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Hax Layer Evaluation Thread

ReZero Soul and mind Manipulation Layers

Julius's Soul Manipulation, and Mind Manipulation (Can attack the soul itself[2]. Damage to the soul, also damages the mind[3], as the mental has been[3] equated to the spiritual[4]), <Reinhard resists<Life sword Zeam (works on Reinhard) (+1 layer)<Reinhard resists with a new blessing<Sirius's Soul Manipulation ( He is able to resist[41] Sirius' Authority of Wrath- which manipulates the mind, senses, and soul- for a short period of time before it overpowers him) (+2 layer)
There is also
Fog of contamination (Mind Manipulation, and Soul Manipulation (Can directly attack the mind[1] through its mist. Damage to the soul, also damages the mind[3], as the mental has been[3] equated to the spiritual[4]),)<Subaru's soul manipulation resistance Resistance to Mind Manipulation, and Soul Manipulation (Was unaffected by the[18] White Whale's mental attacks[18].<Satella's soul manipulation(Soul Manipulation (Her miasma corrupts the soul. Can violate the soul of others, diving deep into a person to understand everything they care about. Knocked Petelgeuse's soul[5] out of Subaru's body) (+1 layers)<Reinhard's Soul manipulation resistance<Sirius's Soul manipulation ( He is able to resist[41] Sirius' Authority of Wrath- which manipulates the mind, senses, and soul- for a short period of time before it overpowers him)(+2 layer)

also keep in mind that Soul=Mind so Mind manipulation also gets layered
 
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Theglassman12 said:
@Eseseso that would need to be evaluated then.
Click to expand...
Hello ! I am here to answer that.

Makina has unquantifiable layers because

1) Makina scales to Alice's RE

2) Alice's RE which can grow indefinitely can near quickly break out of Chronois's Spatial Manip and allow her to use Kuromueina's powers which are Unresisted to Non World Creators. This is important because this confirms that Alice can gain an extra layer with her RE. Chronois's hax scales to shiro because she directly uses her authority.

3) Makina stalemated her rival for 100 million years

even with the lowest of lowballs it "could" easily exceeds 100 million layers (assuming 1 layer per year) . Its unquantifiable because its very abnormally high and there is no safe way to estimate it.
 
BoastJr said:
Hello ! I am here to answer that.

Makina has unquantifiable layers because

1) Makina scales to Alice's RE

2) Alice's RE which can grow indefinitely can near quickly break out of Chronois's Spatial Manip and allow her to use Kuromueina's powers which are Unresisted to Non World Creators. This is important because this confirms that Alice can gain an extra layer with her RE. Chronois's hax scales to shiro because she directly uses her authority.

3) Makina stalemated her rival for 100 million years

even with the lowest of lowballs it "could" easily exceeds 100 million layers (assuming 1 layer per year) . Its unquantifiable because its very abnormally high and there is no safe way to estimate it.
Click to expand...
Yeah there is

Just one layer!
 
Jozaysmith? said:
How many layers were accepted I'll add it to the blog, then add it to profiles.
Click to expand...
5 layers
Magic -> Baseline
Anti-Magic -> 1 Layer
Holy Field -> 2 Layers
Unique Skills -> 3 Layers
Shion's Skill [Chaotic Fate] -> 4 Layers
Ultimate -> 5 Layers

the rest you already know, including the world system and stuff, which would be the same layers above ultimate skills as accepted before. 6 Layers ig.
Was wondering if we could do the same for subjective reality with this since both are base of skills and magic, or if it has to be accepted separately
 
Astral_Trinity439 said:
5 layers
Magic -> Baseline
Anti-Magic -> 1 Layer
Holy Field -> 2 Layers
Unique Skills -> 3 Layers
Shion's Skill [Chaotic Fate] -> 4 Layers
Ultimate -> 5 Layers

the rest you already know, including the world system and stuff, which would be the same layers above ultimate skills as accepted before. 6 Layers ig.
Was wondering if we could do the same for subjective reality with this since both are base of skills and magic, or if it has to be accepted separately
Click to expand...
Law=Concept=reality
Pretty much it, so it might work
Anyways I'll add it to the verse layered blog and then to the ultimate skill profile page
 
Jozaysmith? said:
Law=Concept=reality
Pretty much it, so it might work
Anyways I'll add it to the verse layered blog and then to the ultimate skill profile page
Click to expand...
You forgot to add the layers to holy field and anti-magic in the skills page, or maybe didn't had the time
so I added it

Tho I didn't add layers for concept and reality manip with the analogy [Law=Concept=reality] for now, leaving that to you if you have time
 
SatellaTheWoE said:
ReZero Soul Manipulation Layers

Julius's Soul manipulation<Reinhard resists<Life sword Zeam (works on Reinhard) (+1 layer)<Reinhard resists with a new blessing<Sirius's Soul Manipulation (+2 layer)
There is also
Fog of contamination<Subaru's soul manipulation resistance<Satella's soul manipulation (+1 layers)<Reinhard's Soul manipulation resistance<Sirius's Soul manipulation (+2 layer)

also keep in mind that Soul=Mind so Mind manipulation also gets layered
Click to expand...
Bumping this bevause its been decades😔

Anyways can OP add the ReZero layers to the OP? I have like a whole ass list to go through
 
Astral_Trinity439 said:
Okay, than, is there a need of a thread for it or can I implement the changes into their profiles just from this?

Oh, and one more thing


So.... every magic and skill at base also has Subjective Reality/Reality Warping other than law manip
So can the layers apply to subjective reality as well?

And if you don't have enough time to look through all the bundle of scans on each link, here are the specific scans :

Magic : Brings user's imagination into reality, turning non-physical phenomenon into real life, which works by adding your wish into magicules before casting it
Skills : The physical manifestation of user's desires that turns these desires into reality merely by wishing it
Click to expand...
bump
 
Layered Explosion Manipulation for Kamen Rider Kuuga.
Summarizing, regular forms will have baseline explosion manipulation, Rising forms will have 1 layer, Rising Mighty will have 2 layers, and Amazing Mighty/Ultimate form will have 3 layers of explosion manipulation.
 
ZeedKZ said:
Layered Explosion Manipulation for Kamen Rider Kuuga.
Summarizing, regular forms will have baseline explosion manipulation, Rising forms will have 1 layer, Rising Mighty will have 2 layers, and Amazing Mighty/Ultimate form will have 3 layers of explosion manipulation.
Click to expand...
Explosion manip is a degree type hax there's no layers
 
Fezzih_007 said:
Bruh, you have zero scans for all of that, It makes hard to evaluate.
Click to expand...
what are you talking about?
SatellaTheWoE said:
ReZero Soul and mind Manipulation Layers

Julius's Soul Manipulation, and Mind Manipulation (Can attack the soul itself[2]. Damage to the soul, also damages the mind[3], as the mental has been[3] equated to the spiritual[4]), <Reinhard resists<Life sword Zeam (works on Reinhard) (+1 layer)<Reinhard resists with a new blessing<Sirius's Soul Manipulation ( He is able to resist[41] Sirius' Authority of Wrath- which manipulates the mind, senses, and soul- for a short period of time before it overpowers him) (+2 layer)
There is also
Fog of contamination (Mind Manipulation, and Soul Manipulation (Can directly attack the mind[1] through its mist. Damage to the soul, also damages the mind[3], as the mental has been[3] equated to the spiritual[4]),)<Subaru's soul manipulation resistance Resistance to Mind Manipulation, and Soul Manipulation (Was unaffected by the[18] White Whale's mental attacks[18].<Satella's soul manipulation(Soul Manipulation (Her miasma corrupts the soul. Can violate the soul of others, diving deep into a person to understand everything they care about. Knocked Petelgeuse's soul[5] out of Subaru's body) (+1 layers)<Reinhard's Soul manipulation resistance<Sirius's Soul manipulation ( He is able to resist[41] Sirius' Authority of Wrath- which manipulates the mind, senses, and soul- for a short period of time before it overpowers him)(+2 layer)

also keep in mind that Soul=Mind so Mind manipulation also gets layered
Click to expand...
 
ZeedKZ said:
This is the first time I've seen someone saying this.
Click to expand...
basically resisting explison manip is not a kind of conventional hax resistance, as explosions, as a mixture of overpressure and heat, are a form of AP. Sure, it can be resisted, but it does not have layers.
 
SatellaTheWoE said:
what are you talking about?
Click to expand...
real-powder.png


I love how you just copypaste from the profiles lmao
 
EL_xWatcher1234x said:
The hax should be superior to the previous one.
Click to expand...
Which it literally is. Not only did Valkyrie's Gate: Another outright ignore the Demon Lord's resistance to Valkyrie's Gate, but it also made it so that Ristarte's healing factor WOULD NOT WORK after Seiya used it. Valkyrie's Gate: Another even had a mind of its own, something Valkyrie's Gate doesn't have!
EL_xWatcher1234x said:
It like resisting a curse by single person but having a problem when number of curses increase.
Click to expand...
Which it ALSO literally is.

Look, man. I don't get why you're not seeing it as layered hax despite all the signs showing proof that it's layered hax.
 
ZeedKZ said:
This is the first time I've seen someone saying this.
Click to expand...
Explosion Manipulation is the ability to generate spontaneous explosions at will. This can be achieved through a variety of means, such as weaponry, specialized technology, or through supernatural powers. Some users are even able to direct them and control their path, allowing them to demolish specific structures and foes and making it harder for one to escape the explosion.
Click to expand...
You probably never asked anyone then lmao, this is like saying layered temperature manip.
Explosions are generated through fire and some level of heat, fire is degree associated, degree associated abilities cant be recognized
 
It's not, it is nowhere near close to that. This not a 500°C vs 1000°C case, we're not playing with units., it is the same ability negating resistance. Heck, Rising Titan is above Rising Mighty and yet the latter bypassed Gamego's resistance when the first didn't.
 
ZeedKZ said:
It's not, it is nowhere near close to that. This not a 500°C vs 1000°C case, we're not playing with units., it is the same ability negating resistance. Heck, Rising Titan is above Rising Mighty and yet the latter bypassed Gamego's resistance when the first didn't.
Click to expand...
What is an explosion?
What causes explosion
An explosion is a rapid expansion in volume of a given amount of matter associated with an extreme outward release of energy, sometimes related to heat, sometimes related to electricity, this energy is burnt up and then returns back to stationary state
Click to expand...
You're finding this hard to grasp aren't you?
Its like saying explosions are their own thing haha, that guy was just more solid, doesn't sound like something that's layered
 
Kuuga and Sealing Energy for the first two. Elaborate the third, and yes, they are their own thing in this case. There is no "more solid", he got his resistance bypassed by a physically weaker form when it didn't for a physically stronger form. If you want to at least say a single useful thing here, be more elaborated with your words and I'll concede this is a enhanced form of explosion manipulation.
 
ZeedKZ said:
Kuuga and Sealing Energy for the first two. Elaborate the third, and yes, they are their own thing in this case. There is no "more solid", he got his resistance bypassed by a physically weaker form when it didn't for a physically stronger form. If you want to at least say a single useful thing here, be more elaborated with your words and I'll concede this is a enhanced form of explosion manipulation.
Click to expand...
I am not a mod and i practically don't care about your arguments, just telling before you wait to only get a response of "it's a degree ability"
So yeah, ejoudese (that's all)
 
Flashlight237 said:
Look, man. I don't get why you're not seeing it as layered hax despite all the signs showing proof that it's layered hax.
Click to expand...
I only watched the anime, and it look like all what Seiya did is overpower the demon king with two Valkyrie's Gates. It's like casting the same spell twice to affect someone, but you know more about the series than me.
 
Okay, so here's another case. So... I think Zeno's Existence Erasure should be one layer of Existence Erasure. The reason I say this? Well, here's the deal.

For Hakai, Hakai as an energy form, which is either used by those not fully-versed in Hakai (like Toppo) or by those intentionally nerfing their power (ex. Sidra) can both be survived AND resisted. For surviving Hakai, we have Frieza (who survived Toppo's onslaught) and Zamasu (who in the manga survived an incomplete Hakai and regenerated from it). Frieza's case is shown here:



Despite being utterly brutalized by Toppo, Frieza has shown to survive both Toppo's incomplete Hakai techniques and Toppo's passive Hakai aura.

As for Zamasu, we have this:

latest


Which Goku said is a failure later on, as Zamasu had later survived and regenerated from it. Again, this would make it an incomplete Hakai.

But as for resisting, here is Frieza earlier on compressing an earlier, intentionally-incomplete Hakai:



A more complete Hakai looks like this:



No need for energy orbs; it just gets the job done.

However, Zeno's existence erasure has shown no evidence of anyone resisting it whatsoever. First time Zeno used it (and this is the same as in the manga, only instead of Giygas, Infinite Zamasu would instead be an endless supply of Zamasu clones), Zamasu was just... Gone-zo.:



And later on, Zeno would erase each and every universe that got eliminated, including Gods of Destruction (who should be able to utilize the same Hakai Toppo had, so they should more or less be able to handle Hakai), but not angels because the angels are at the top rung of the ladder and Zeno didn't think erasing them made sense. The first instance of such is this.:



From what I can tell, I think Zeno's Existance Erasure is only worth one layer, as while Hakai is based on power and can be resisted or survived, the weaknesses of Hakai DO NOT APPLY to Zeno's own Existence Erasure, and the difference between an incomplete Hakai and a complete Hakai are too negligible to warrant different layers on their own.
 
Last edited:
Flashlight237 said:
Okay, so here's another case. So... I think Zeno's Existence Erasure should be one layer of Existence Erasure. The reason I say this? Well, here's the deal.

For Hakai, Hakai as an energy form, which is either used by those not fully-versed in Hakai (like Toppo) or by those intentionally nerfing their power (ex. Sidra) can both be survived AND resisted. For surviving Hakai, we have Frieza (who survived Toppo's onslaught) and Zamasu (who in the manga survived an incomplete Hakai and regenerated from it). Frieza's case is shown here:



Despite being utterly brutalized by Toppo, Frieza has shown to survive both Toppo's incomplete Hakai techniques and Toppo's passive Hakai aura.

As for Zamasu, we have this:

latest


Which Goku said is a failure later on, as Zamasu had later survived and regenerated from it. Again, this would make it an incomplete Hakai.

But as for resisting, here is Frieza earlier on compressing an earlier, intentionally-incomplete Hakai:



A more complete Hakai looks like this:



No need for energy orbs; it just gets the job done.

However, Zeno's existence erasure has shown no evidence of anyone resisting it whatsoever. First time Zeno used it (and this is the same as in the manga, only instead of Giygas, Infinite Zamasu would instead be an endless supply of Zamasu clones), Zamasu was just... Gone-zo.:



And later on, Zeno would erase each and every universe that got eliminated, including Gods of Destruction (who should be able to utilize the same Hakai Toppo had, so they should more or less be able to handle Hakai), but not angels because the angels are at the top rung of the ladder and Zeno didn't think erasing them made sense. The first instance of such is this.:



From what I can tell, I think Zeno's Existance Erasure is only worth one layer, as while Hakai is based on power and can be resisted or survived, the weaknesses of Hakai DO NOT APPLY to Zeno's own Existence Erasure, and the difference between an incomplete Hakai and a complete Hakai are to negligible to warrant different layers on their own.
Click to expand...

Didn't they separate manga from anime, despite that, i guess layered EE due to frieza resistance seems very logical
 
Jozaysmith? said:
Didn't they separate manga from anime
Click to expand...
Not completely. They were quite similar until Future Trunks arc, and the Tournament of Power arc was mostly different aside from the baseline of Universe 11 being the main obstacle and Jiren being the "final boss" of that arc. They split off for real in the Galactic Patrol Prisoner arc and the Granolah arc, but then met back up with each other in the Super Hero arc.
 
Flashlight237 said:
Okay, so here's another case. So... I think Zeno's Existence Erasure should be one layer of Existence Erasure. The reason I say this? Well, here's the deal.

For Hakai, Hakai as an energy form, which is either used by those not fully-versed in Hakai (like Toppo) or by those intentionally nerfing their power (ex. Sidra) can both be survived AND resisted. For surviving Hakai, we have Frieza (who survived Toppo's onslaught) and Zamasu (who in the manga survived an incomplete Hakai and regenerated from it). Frieza's case is shown here:



Despite being utterly brutalized by Toppo, Frieza has shown to survive both Toppo's incomplete Hakai techniques and Toppo's passive Hakai aura.

As for Zamasu, we have this:

latest


Which Goku said is a failure later on, as Zamasu had later survived and regenerated from it. Again, this would make it an incomplete Hakai.

But as for resisting, here is Frieza earlier on compressing an earlier, intentionally-incomplete Hakai:



A more complete Hakai looks like this:



No need for energy orbs; it just gets the job done.

However, Zeno's existence erasure has shown no evidence of anyone resisting it whatsoever. First time Zeno used it (and this is the same as in the manga, only instead of Giygas, Infinite Zamasu would instead be an endless supply of Zamasu clones), Zamasu was just... Gone-zo.:



And later on, Zeno would erase each and every universe that got eliminated, including Gods of Destruction (who should be able to utilize the same Hakai Toppo had, so they should more or less be able to handle Hakai), but not angels because the angels are at the top rung of the ladder and Zeno didn't think erasing them made sense. The first instance of such is this.:



From what I can tell, I think Zeno's Existance Erasure is only worth one layer, as while Hakai is based on power and can be resisted or survived, the weaknesses of Hakai DO NOT APPLY to Zeno's own Existence Erasure, and the difference between an incomplete Hakai and a complete Hakai are too negligible to warrant different layers on their own.
Click to expand...

Hakai is what 3-D/4-D?

Zeno's EE is 5D, this already eliminates the possibilities of layers since the guys are receiving higher dimensional EE.
 
Wu Mian should have layered Invisibility and Enhanced Sense as masks are invisible in the story. Truth is invisible[3] to humans, and he is still invisible to Zi Luo Lan, a mask user herself and someone who knows about masks.
 
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