Green Gods Like a Good Game (BFDI Two vs The Flying Dutchman)

[CuteAnimeNekoGirl99]

Two hosts a competition in a haunted house for their contestants to face their fears. They hire the king of scaring them all. The flying dutchman but he takes it way too far threatening the very sanctity of the entire competition

The Dutchman refuses to leave Goiky to keep his scaring escapades to a wider audience but Two isn't having any of that

Battle takes place in Goiky

Two doesn't have any of their optional equipment

Both are in their 4-A keys (Both scale to this)

Speed Equalized

Green Number: 2 (psychomaster35, James_Plays_4_Games)

Green Ghost: 1(JustANormalLemon)

Incon:

 

[Psychomaster35]

Funnily enough, both of them have contrasting relationships with a blue hotheaded creature (Four and Squidward respectively) and a yellow irritating childish friendly creature (X and SpongeBob respectively), where Two is friends with them (By TPOT 6) while the Flying Dutchman is enemies with them (For most SpongeBob episodes), with said blue and yellow creatures happening to have jobs at restaurants (Two’s Hotel and the Krusty Krab respectively).

Will debate later.

 

[Psychomaster35]

Anyways, the Flying Dutchman usually resorts to scaring his opponents, though most of the haxes he’s used throughout the series (Such as Time Manipulation and Death Manipulation) have only been used once. That being said, Two has no way to physically interact with the Flying Dutchman with any of their abilities except for 2 abilities: Telekinesis and Existence Erasure. The former is unlikely due to how the Flying Dutchman possesses higher lifting strength (As well as teleport out of it), but Two can very much still affect him via eliminating him with a handwave/clap/screen cover, which has worked on intangible characters like Cloudy.

Given how the algebralien would know the Flying Dutchman is a ghost they can’t affect with most of their powers, it’s more likely they’re going to deliver the finishing blow through their elimination method, while the Flying Dutchman won’t resort to killing first. Even if he is going for a kill, it’s usually by sheer AP, which won’t work since Two is many one-shots above starry sky scaling (~5 one-shot values) while the Flying Dutchman is only scaling to 1 one-shot value above starry sky scaling.

Voting Two.

 

[CuteAnimeNekoGirl99]

that's one!

 

[JustANormalLemon]

Nice battle

Anyways, the Flying Dutchman usually resorts to scaring his opponents, though most of the haxes he’s used throughout the series (Such as Time Manipulation and Death Manipulation) have only been used once. That being said, Two has no way to physically interact with the Flying Dutchman with any of their abilities except for 2 abilities: Telekinesis and Existence Erasure. The former is unlikely due to how the Flying Dutchman possesses higher lifting strength (As well as teleport out of it), but Two can very much still affect him via eliminating him with a handwave/clap/screen cover, which has worked on intangible characters like Cloudy.

Given how the algebralien would know the Flying Dutchman is a ghost they can’t affect with most of their powers, it’s more likely they’re going to deliver the finishing blow through their elimination method, while the Flying Dutchman won’t resort to killing first. Even if he is going for a kill, it’s usually by sheer AP, which won’t work since Two is many one-shots above starry sky scaling (~5 one-shot values) while the Flying Dutchman is only scaling to 1 one-shot value above starry sky scaling.

Voting Two.

Well, what you said is true, but... first of all, why would 2 imediatly know that flying dutchman is a ghost? and why would he think he can't interact with such? I would like to rember you that characters with intangibility are considered able to interact with other intangible things as long both are intangible at the same time most of the time, trough It can be arguead that sinse we don't know what type of intangibility 2 has we can't expect that they have the same type as FD to interact with him, so I guess this is half viable

But now the most important point. 2 has no fear haxes resistences or regeneration and dutchman fear can make the oponent body dismantle untill only the nerve sistem is left, with dutchman invisibility and teleportation I can see him winning by simply scaring TWO into his death, especially sinse 2 really don't have any feat that show him to be less scared them normal

Voting Dutchman for now, sinse Dutchaman has all the means to evade Two and one shoot him trough fear manipulation

 

[James_Plays_4_Games]

Does the Flying Dutchman have low-godly regeneration listed on his profile because of him coming back from SpongeBob unraveling the universe? That looks like an assumption to me, but using that information anyway, it would mean that Two wouldn't be able to get rid of the Flying Dutchman for good. The question is whether or not the Flying Dutchman would be able to get back to the battle in time for Two to not win. If the Flying Dutchman can get back fast enough, then I vote for him winning. Otherwise, I will decide once I get the information.

[...] Two can very much still affect him via eliminating him with a handwave/clap/screen cover, which has worked on intangible characters like Cloudy.

I think being able to treat a cloud as solid isn't evidence of being able to treat something beyond states of matter as solid, due to a different in scope, but either way, I think Two's ability would work on a ghost, since Two doesn't even need to touch the target for it to work.

[...] why would 2 imediatly know that flying dutchman is a ghost?

Two would know that the Flying Dutchman is a ghost because the Flying Dutchman clearly looks like how cartoon ghosts look like.

 

[JustANormalLemon]

Does the Flying Dutchman have low-godly regeneration listed on his profile because of him coming back from SpongeBob unraveling the universe? That looks like an assumption to me, but using that information anyway, it would mean that Two wouldn't be able to get rid of the Flying Dutchman for good. The question is whether or not the Flying Dutchman would be able to get back to the battle in time for Two to not win. If the Flying Dutchman can get back fast enough, then I vote for him winning. Otherwise, I will decide once I get the information.

I think being able to treat a cloud as solid isn't evidence of being able to treat something beyond states of matter as solid, due to a different in scope, but either way, I think Two's ability would work on a ghost, since Two doesn't even need to touch the target for it to work.

Two would know that the Flying Dutchman is a ghost because the Flying Dutchman clearly looks like how cartoon ghosts look like.

I mean, even them, why would he assime the dutchman is intangible?

And you need high godly to survive existence eresure

 

[Psychomaster35]

Does the Flying Dutchman have low-godly regeneration listed on his profile because of him coming back from SpongeBob unraveling the universe?

He was transmuted by the string, not erased by it. Even then, I don’t remember any episode where he comes back from complete soul destruction, only partial at best.

dutchman fear can make the oponent body dismantle untill only the nerve sistem is left,

I’m pretty sure that was a one time thing and most times he’s scared someone on the show, they don’t tear apart. So it’s rather random.

 

[JustANormalLemon]

I’m pretty sure that was a one time thing and most times he’s scared someone on the show, they don’t tear apart. So it’s rather random.

He is constantly depicted as scary, with just a few moments he isn't for comic effect

Not to mention cartoons without fixed continuity we normaly use the most impressive feats as the rule

Even if he don't just makes two dismantle It self, his fear manipulation would be more them enough to incapacitate two

 

[James_Plays_4_Games]

I mean, even them, why would he assime the dutchman is intangible?

Usually ghosts are supposed to be intangible beings. I think it's fair to presume that characters who aren't unintelligent would know pretty basic things about extremely well known public domain fiction, even if they haven't been living on Earth for many years.

And you need high godly to survive existence eresure

It depends on the existence erasure. We don't have definitive confirmation that Two's elimination is existence erasure, so we don't know if high-godly regeneration is required to survive it.

He was transmuted by the string, not erased by it. Even then, I don’t remember any episode where he comes back from complete soul destruction, only partial at best.

The Flying Dutchman's profile has the information about him coming back from being affected by the string as evidence of regeneration, so if what you wrote is true, someone should revise his profile.

 

[JustANormalLemon]

It depends on the existence erasure. We don't have definitive confirmation that Two's elimination is existence erasure, so we don't know if high-godly regeneration is required to survive it.

Well, if we go with the BFR option of his existence erasure, Two probable can win sinse we have no idea where teo send the eliminated contestants

But if not... this is a stomp them

Well, The bases on the wiki is that you need high godly to survive basic existence erasure if I remenber correct, so we should assume It's enough

Still, dutchman fear manipulation should be more them enough for him to get the win, especially sinse TWO only has a ant feat from resisting fear where he was scared in the rolercoster

 

[James_Plays_4_Games]

Well, if we go with the BFR option of his existence erasure, Two probable can win sinse we have no idea where teo send the eliminated contestants

But if not... this is a stomp them

Well, The bases on the wiki is that you need high godly to survive basic existence erasure if I remenber correct, so we should assume It's enough

I mean the default for existence erasure is utter destruction of a character's physical form, which is destruction that low-godly regeneration can come back from. It's a bit awkward to phrase it like this for the Flying Dutchman when he doesn't really have a physical form, but you know what I mean. Also, about the BFR interpretation of the elimination, we could still try estimating how far Two would send an eliminated target.

Still, dutchman fear manipulation should be more them enough for him to get the win, [...]

I imagine that Two could use their elimination faster before getting too scared, so the question is how long it takes for the Flying Dutchman to regenerate or get back to the battle.

 

[Psychomaster35]

I imagine that Two could use their elimination faster before getting too scared, so the question is how long it takes for the Flying Dutchman to regenerate or get back to the battle.

From what was agreed on a thread I was on, this was overtime since we don’t see them immediately come back. Given the lack of continuity in SpongeBob, it probably took a long time, supposedly days, weeks, or even months.

 

[James_Plays_4_Games]

From what was agreed on a thread I was on, this was overtime since we don’t see them immediately come back. Given the lack of continuity in SpongeBob, it probably took a long time, supposedly days, weeks, or even months.

Thanks for the information. Standard Battle Assumptions make it so that removing an opponent from a battle for at least one week counts as a win, or incapacitating an opponent for over a day counts as a win. As it stands, there's no way to know for sure whether Two's elimination is BFR or existence erasure, but out of the possibilities that you wrote about how long it could take for the Flying Dutchman to be able to fight Two again after getting eliminated, Two would have the advantage overall, so I vote for Two winning the battle.

 

[JustANormalLemon]

I imagine that Two could use their elimination faster before getting too scared, so the question is how long it takes for the Flying Dutchman to regenerate or get back to the battle.

No no, Durchman has telepqrtation and invisibility, two still need to get close to cover him or be able to overpower Durchman with TK, with both gives the Duthman to hide and scare Two with a surprise atack

 

[Psychomaster35]

No no, Durchman has telepqrtation and invisibility, two still need to get close to cover him or be able to overpower Durchman with TK, with both gives the Duthman to hide and scare Two with a surprise atack

Teleportation (in fights) is only used by him to chase after those running away from him and he's never used invisibility in fights. Not that it matters anyways since SBA assumes that they are already looking at each other at a distance upon the fight starting.

 

[James_Plays_4_Games]

No no, Durchman has telepqrtation and invisibility, two still need to get close to cover him or be able to overpower Durchman with TK, with both gives the Duthman to hide and scare Two with a surprise atack

Before Two would lose as a result of the frighten, I see no reason why Two wouldn't swat their hand and win immediately as a result. The Flying Dutchman would intend for Two to see him at some point in order to scare them, so it's not like the Flying Dutchman would be stealthy the whole time. Plus, being invisible isn't protection against Two's abilities. If Two would cover most of the screen with their hand, what difference would a lack of vision be? The Flying Dutchman would be in range either way.

 

[James_Plays_4_Games]

Teleportation (in fights) is only used by him to chase after those running away from him [...]

Don't forget when he teleports during his battle during SpongeBob SquarePants: Battle for Bikini Bottom – Rehydrated, although the teleportation is very telegraphed and visible; nothing Two couldn't handle.

 

[JustANormalLemon]

Before Two would lose as a result of the frighten, I see no reason why Two wouldn't swat their hand and win immediately as a result. The Flying Dutchman would intend for Two to see him at some point in order to scare them, so it's not like the Flying Dutchman would be stealthy the whole time. Plus, being invisible isn't protection against Two's abilities. If Two would cover most of the screen with their hand, what difference would a lack of vision be? The Flying Dutchman would be in range either way.

Don't forget when he teleports during his battle during SpongeBob SquarePants: Battle for Bikini Bottom – Rehydrated, although the teleportation is very telegraphed and visible; nothing Two couldn't handle.

2 things, Dutchman just need to make a scary face once to win here

And saing that two would be able to existence eresure domeone he can't see is a strech for a hability we have little info on how It works, specially sinse It mostly is based on covering the vision of the oponent from the camera, and if he is alread invisible... you know

Even if the Dutchman teleportation is "telegraphed" what stops him from teleportin into inside the ground? I see Two beingh able to get a win but for me Dutchman just has everything to avoid It and is in character for him to do such

Not to mention his fear manipulation is partially passive as most characters alread fear his presense

 

[James_Plays_4_Games]

2 things, Dutchman just need to make a scary face once to win here

I'm aware. The combatants may even do their win condition actions at the same time. I could see either of them winning, so I suppose I could switch my vote to the matchup being inconclusive. It seems that the thread creator isn't keeping track of the votes anymore right now anyway though, so this discussion might be fruitless.

And saing that two would be able to existence eresure domeone he can't see is a strech for a hability we have little info on how It works, specially sinse It mostly is based on covering the vision of the oponent from the camera, and if he is alread invisible... you know

Even though we don't know a lot about how the ability works, we do know that Two can remove a character when they do a trick involving covering a character from view. Although it's interesting in terms of visibility, the actual effect has to do with the positions of the characters.

Even if the Dutchman teleportation is "telegraphed" what stops him from teleportin into inside the ground? I see Two beingh able to get a win but for me Dutchman just has everything to avoid It and is in character for him to do such

I only mentioned that the Flying Dutchman's teleportation was telegraphed in the specific source that I mentioned. He has shown to be capable of better teleportation in other sources such as when he sealed SpongeBob, although this was outside of a combat situation like the one against Two in this thread.

Not to mention his fear manipulation is partially passive as most characters alread fear his presense

Are you sure the case isn't just that the Flying Dutchman is generally feared by default due to being a dangerous ghost rather than because his fear manipulation is passive? I don't see every character he comes across getting deconstructed due to his fear manipulation. For example, when the Flying Dutchman wanted to scare a random kid with SpongeBob and Patrick, but they ruined his attempt by failing at being scary, the kid stopped being afraid.

 

[CuteAnimeNekoGirl99]

I'm aware. The combatants may even do their win condition actions at the same time. I could see either of them winning, so I suppose I could switch my vote to the matchup being inconclusive. It seems that the thread creator isn't keeping track of the votes anymore right now anyway though, so this discussion might be fruitless.

i- homie it's literally only been a single day-

but yeah that's two for two and would that be one for dutchman or is lemon more batting for incon?

 

[JustANormalLemon]

i- homie it's literally only been a single day-

but yeah that's two for two and would that be one for dutchman or is lemon more batting for incon?

Still going dutchman

 

[CuteAnimeNekoGirl99]

Still going dutchman

Gotcha! One for dutchman:3

 

[James_Plays_4_Games]

i- homie it's literally only been a single day-

Never mind; it felt longer for some reason.

 

[JustANormalLemon]

Are you sure the case isn't just that the Flying Dutchman is generally feared by default due to being a dangerous ghost rather than because his fear manipulation is passive? I don't see every character he comes across getting deconstructed due to his fear manipulation. For example, when the Flying Dutchman wanted to scare a random kid with SpongeBob and Patrick, but they ruined his attempt by failing at being scary, the kid stopped being afraid.

Kinda a mix of both, maybe we can say It's a kinda social influence them?

Any way, ghosts are supposed to be naturally scary

 

[James_Plays_4_Games]

Kinda a mix of both, maybe we can say It's a kinda social influence them?

Any way, ghosts are supposed to be naturally scary

That's a more preferable assessment.

 

[Psychomaster35]

Bump

 

[JustANormalLemon]

Any way, still think Two wouldn't be able to use his existence erasure into a target they don't know the location of, sinse he would need to know where is his target

So still think dutchman would have a easy time pulling his win condition

 

[Psychomaster35]

Bump

 

[JustANormalLemon]

Bump

Why again you voting dutchman? Just for record

 

[Psychomaster35]

Why again you voting dutchman? Just for record

I was voting Two, not Dutchman

Read above

 

[JustANormalLemon]

I was voting Two, not Dutchman

Read above

ye, I writen dutchman thinking Two... let me write again

Why again you voting Two? Just for record sinse It was a wile sinse you sended your vote and has been more debate sinse

 

[Psychomaster35]

Read above

^My opinion has not changed

 

[JustANormalLemon]

^My opinion has not changed

... I... okay, let me go directly to the point, Dutchman has all the habilities he needy to avoid two existence erasure and use fear manipulation to incapcitate two

or at least both will take their wincon at the same time pulling a incon

you have not acknolladged this part of the debate yet, so I'm asking your currently reason knowing It

 

[James_Plays_4_Games]

he needy to avoid

There is no escaping Needy. Just kidding. Anyway, have you considered the possibility of the Flying Dutchman spooking Two, Two covering their eyes in fear, causing the Flying Dutchman to disappear before Two gets scared enough to lose? I'm pretty sure the continued presence of the Flying Dutchman is required for a character to get destroyed from the fear he causes.

 

[JustANormalLemon]

There is no escaping Needy. Just kidding. Anyway, have you considered the possibility of the Flying Dutchman spooking Two, Two covering their eyes in fear, causing the Flying Dutchman to disappear before Two gets scared enough to lose? I'm pretty sure the continued presence of the Flying Dutchman is required for a character to get destroyed from the fear he causes.

I think we have enough prof that two need to want to erase something to erase the thing, not to mention he need to cover the target nor for him self but from a third party perspective

 

[James_Plays_4_Games]

I think we have enough prof that two need to want to erase something to erase the thing, not to mention he need to cover the target nor for him self but from a third party perspective

I don't think there's sufficient proof that Two must see the target instead of covering the position of the target. Two always covers the screen, so they would need to cover the target from whatever the screen would be in a VS thread scenario, which could be a first person point of view.

 

[JustANormalLemon]

I don't think there's sufficient proof that Two must see the target instead of covering the position of the target. Two always covers the screen, so they would need to cover the target from whatever the screen would be in a VS thread scenario, which could be a first person point of view.

I will disagree untill a first person POV is used in a elimination

And we still have my first point

 

[Psychomaster35]

Bump

 

[CuteAnimeNekoGirl99]

bump!