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Gravity Falls General Discussion Thread

Tbh I am beginning to think that Bill's Tier 5/3 stats shouldn't really apply in normal VS Threads. Why?

Because in the whole story Bill tried everything in his power to connect the Nightmare Realm to the main universe, as he can only project himself within minds through the Mindscape otherwise, without a physical form, with his true capabilities are only when he's in the Nightmare Realm. Why do you think he needs to connect the Nightmare Realm and the Universe directly otherwise? Mind you that the only reason he can partially do his stuff on the Earth is because our planet is in a weak spot between dimensions, aka perfect for Bill's plans.

Heck he literally list the lack of a physical form as one of his weaknesses. What do do?

I think we should do something like "Unknown in the universe, 5-B, possibly 3-C in the Nightmare Realm".
 
Adem_Warlock69 said:
Or we could just add a note about how mindscape Bill fights should be located in the Nightmare Realm, kinda like what we do with Darkners
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Don't think it's necessary? Darkners don't have a "10-C in the Light World" (as that would be not only super redundant but also spammed in every profile), I think it's just common sense to apply it.

Also SBA is also a thing.
 
StrymULTRA said:
Tbh I am beginning to think that Bill's Tier 5/3 stats shouldn't really apply in normal VS Threads. Why?

Because in the whole story Bill tried everything in his power to connect the Nightmare Realm to the main universe, as he can only project himself within minds through the Mindscape otherwise, without a physical form, with his true capabilities are only when he's in the Nightmare Realm. Why do you think he needs to connect the Nightmare Realm and the Universe directly otherwise? Mind you that the only reason he can partially do his stuff on the Earth is because our planet is in a weak spot between dimensions, aka perfect for Bill's plans.

Heck he literally list the lack of a physical form as one of his weaknesses. What do do?

I think we should do something like "Unknown in the universe, 5-B, possibly 3-C in the Nightmare Realm".
Click to expand...
That's why I was saying the Time Baby V Bill fight isn't crazy, (outside of the fact he shook the Card Carrier), because it happened in the Nightmare Realm, where Bill has access to his full powers. The problem is apparently Bill made himself an abstract idea, whose true essence exists as an immortal story, so by definition he should also simultaneously be a Mindscape being (contradicting the ending). I think the solution is that he loses his Mindscape status (or more specifically, it just becomes his Soul), by gaining a physical form in our world, and that in the Nightmare Realm he just has both powersets.
 
StrymULTRA said:
Don't think it's necessary? Darkners don't have a "10-C in the Light World" (as that would be not only super redundant but also spammed in every profile), I think it's just common sense to apply it.

Also SBA is also a thing.
Click to expand...
I meant that we don't give em an Unknown rating and just do a note or weakness about how he can't really do anything outside the Nightmare Realm
 
RedReaper616 said:
That's why I was saying the Time Baby V Bill fight isn't crazy, (outside of the fact he shook the Card Carrier), because it happened in the Nightmare Realm, where Bill has access to his full powers. The problem is apparently Bill made himself an abstract idea, whose true essence exists as an immortal story, so by definition he should also simultaneously be a Mindscape being. I think the solution is that he loses his Mindscape status by gaining a physical form in our world, and that in the Nightmare Realm he has both powersets.
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Issue is that it's clear as water that he gained a physical form for the 1st time (and thus all the powers) within Weirdmageddon, not that in the Nightmare Realm.

Somehow merging the NR with the universe made him that strong, we don't know how, it just happened, especially when thanks to the Weirdmageddon he completely one-shot the Time Baby, when before they were kinda equals.
 
StrymULTRA said:
Issue is that it's clear as water that he gained a physical form for the 1st time (and thus all the powers) within Weirdmageddon, not that in the Nightmare Realm.

Somehow merging the NR with the universe made him that strong, we don't know how, it just happened, especially when thanks to the Weirdmageddon he completely one-shot the Time Baby, when before they were kinda equals.
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True. Hm. It's also weird because the battle with Time Baby directly blew up planets, caused paradoxes, and whatnot, so it's directly him demonstrating his powers.
 
RedReaper616 said:
True. Hm. It's also weird because the battle with Time Baby directly blew up planets, caused paradoxes, and whatnot, so it's directly him demonstrating his powers.
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Yeah but it happened in the Nightmare Realm, meaning he hadn't restrictions back then, and could use his (at the time) full power.
 
StrymULTRA said:
Yeah but it happened in the Nightmare Realm, meaning he hadn't restrictions back then, and could use his (at the time) full power.
Click to expand...
So what I'm hearing is
Nightmare Realm (Restrictionless Base Power, has both Mindscape and Psuedo?-Physical Form), Mindscape (Has specifically the Mindscape Powers), and then Weirdmaggeddon (Heightened Power, TRUE Physical Form, Mindscape Powers limited to his Soul), and then there's Post-Series (Massively weakened, exists as his Shattered Soul, but still powerful, Half-Alive).

To try and make all of this make sense.
 
RedReaper616 said:
Nightmare Realm (Restrictionless Base Power, has both Mindscape and Psuedo?-Physical Form), Mindscape (Has specifically the Mindscape Powers), and then Weirdmaggeddon (Heightened Power TRUE Physical Form, Mindscape Powers limited to his Soul), and then there's Post-Series (Massively weakened but still powerful, Half-Alive).
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Nah.

Post-Death I don't think it's even worth making one.

Deciding what he can or can't use outside of the Mindscape is kinda a task which borders in being arbitrary af, so for simplicitly's sake, just say he can use all, given he could use also his powers in Dipper's dream just like when he met Giden outside of a dream (and most of the shit he did in the Book is talking about how he interacted with humanity in the course of the centuries, so you can see where I am leading at).

The real issue are the statistics in play, where I just can't see Bill being that strong outside the NR.
 
StrymULTRA said:
Nah.

Post-Death I don't think it's even worth making one.

Deciding what he can or can't use outside of the Mindscape is kinda a task which borders in being arbitrary af, so for simplicitly's sake, just say he can use all, given he could use also his powers in Dipper's dream just like when he met Giden outside of a dream (and most of the shit he did in the Book is talking about how he interacted with humanity in the course of the centuries, so you can see where I am leading at).

The real issue are the statistics in play, where I just can't see Bill being that strong outside the NR
Click to expand...
To slightly subvert conversation, what do we do about the fact Bill can canonically be summoned through creepypasta nonsense and still exhibits some of his powers (a la the Robbie Chat Logs)?
 
RedReaper616 said:
To slightly subvert conversation, what do we do about the fact Bill can canonically be summoned through creepypasta nonsense and still exhibits some of his powers (a la the Robbie Chat Logs)?
Click to expand...
Nothing. Being summoned from an outside source isn't a feat for the character, it's a feat for whoever does it.
 
StrymULTRA said:
Nothing. Being summoned from an outside source isn't a feat for the character, it's a feat for whoever does it.
Click to expand...
Well, yeah, but I was more referring to contact methods/his awareness. Like how he can possess people through Spirit Boards, and immediately knew of the incantation being fulfilled by Stanford.
 
StrymULTRA said:
Tbh I am beginning to think that Bill's Tier 5/3 stats shouldn't really apply in normal VS Threads. Why?

Because in the whole story Bill tried everything in his power to connect the Nightmare Realm to the main universe, as he can only project himself within minds through the Mindscape otherwise, without a physical form, with his true capabilities are only when he's in the Nightmare Realm. Why do you think he needs to connect the Nightmare Realm and the Universe directly otherwise? Mind you that the only reason he can partially do his stuff on the Earth is because our planet is in a weak spot between dimensions, aka perfect for Bill's plans.

Heck he literally list the lack of a physical form as one of his weaknesses. What do do?

I think we should do something like "Unknown in the universe, 5-B, possibly 3-C in the Nightmare Realm".
Click to expand...
Unknown, Varies with Possession, at least 5-B, possibly 3-C in the Nightmare Realm

I think this is better because we don't use things like "in the universe/physical universe" or "in SBA" in the profiles, as you can see in the many examples I can list if you want (Hela, Mephisto from Marvel Comics and Sinbad from Magi etc)

Also I'm still angry at myself for not thinking of separating keys when indexing characters with different stats and abilities in this kind of physical world and other worlds in the past.
 
CodeCCLL said:
Click to expand...
what is this
 
Btw, a last thing.
CodeCCLL said:
Unknown, Varies with Possession, at least 5-B, possibly 3-C in the Nightmare Realm
Click to expand...
I do not think that, from how worded the justification is, listing the highest tier at the last is appropriate, especially given you're implying he can't possess people in the NR.

Something like this is better:
  • Unknown, at least 5-B, possibly 3-C in the Mindscape or the Nightmare Realm. Varies with Possession
Edit: Added also he also has these powers in the Mindscape for obvious reasons.
 
Last edited:
RedReaper616 said:
You should include on Power Bestowal that whilst possessing Blendin he was able to use his sleep manipulation. That way it being based on deals is backed up. Also, small list:

Projection

Bill can project himself into anything with neurons, (meaning the Book is directly exhibiting his powers as he is projecting himself into it, making it applicable for sharing abilities).

Was able to scan all possible future timelines to see his defeat and astrally project a message across the globe.

Regeneration

The Book of Bill (and thus Bill) can come back from molecular destabilization, (this scan also doubles down on the book being made of brain matter).

Regenerated from lasting damage caused by the Memory Gun after exiting McGucket's head.

So Bill should have Limited Mid-Godly. Even if you don’t agree with these, you definitely have to state the regeneration level on his Pre-Weirdmaggeddon State.

Omnscience/Omni-Sight and Intelligence (as well as Multilinguism)

Was aware of Stanford's meddlings with the Book of Bill despite being dead and trapped within the Theraprism,

Is aware of Mabel's communication in the Astral Plane with The Beast, (as well as used her dreams to find her weakness).

Ford doubles down on Bill's ability to see the future, (and implies Bill can offer to teach you how to "speak tree" as well as how to make nukes of of rubber ducklings, {which Bill also claims to know}),

Was able to scan all possible future timelines to see his defeat and astrally project a message across the globe,

Power Bestowal

Bestowed upon normal women (Witches) magic, a life of sin and pleasure (how isn't stated), the ability to speak to beasts, and claimed to be capable of surface scaling whilst possessing a creature,

Instinctive Reaction?

Can conquer dynasties whilst dissociated (meaning some form of instinctive reaction?)

Social Influencing

Bill has seduced Galaxies,

Extrasensory Perception

Fordtramarine is an Extradimensional Color

Memory and Dream Manipulation

Can hold onto memories he's seen/manipulated (to show others) and prank people in their dreams

Possession

Possesses an excommunicated priest via a Spirit Board,

Resistance to Radiation

Bill was unaffected by Radiation when he opened a temporary rift with it.

Is unaffected by portal radiation capable of melting people.

Hypnosis, Tech and Intelligence

Made a computer with trinary code capable of mass hypnosis, and floppy drives capable of eating fingers, as well as causing suicide to programmers who worked on it.

Power Bestowal???

After Martha took in toxic fumes that causes people to hallucinate (allowing her to see Bill), her experience with him (we don't know what outside of seeing the toy designs he made) gave her the ability to speak in tongues, leak black fluid from their eyes, and make nearby cats float when asked their origin.

???

Can laugh so hard (from the Nightmare Realm) it can be detected on radar.

Foresight and Info Analysis?

Saw Stanford's possible futures, was able to analyze his intellect once inside his head and immediately tell how ingenius he was.

Possession

Possessed a legion of rats and shaped them.

???

Keeps the last atoms of his home Dimension.

Hallucination Inducement

Can induce hallucinations (that seemingly stop time, ala his Summoning by Gideon), to communicate with his "puppets".

Also, you should probably include that Bill can constantly see through the eyes of those he’s possessed (and potentially killed), and his perception to messages within Static.

??? = Dunno how to rate that.
Click to expand...
The list from before, with alterations based on what you’ve added to the P&A.
 
I am kinda confused now, why do we assume Bill is Unknown? He clearly fought Time Baby at the Nightmare Realm WHILE LACKING A BODY

So it is two keys, with no physical body / with physical body

3-C / 11-B

Whats wrong with that?
 
StrymULTRA said:
Exactly, in the Nightmare Realm, not in the universe.
Click to expand...
Why does that matter?? If he is gonna fight anyone in vs threads in his first key he will be with them in whatever universe or place just without a physical form

Unless you mean people have to specify the fight takes place in NR, in that case isnt that basically the same as Dark World in Deltarune?
 
Accelerated_Evolution said:
Having a note/weakness on Bill´s profile regarding his power level only "working" on the NR should be fine instead of the "unknown" rating for when he´s outside of the realm
Click to expand...
I mean... no. We see Bill almost all the time outside the NR in the series. I think it's more accurate that way, you can just specify that the fight happens in the NR and that's it.

Wanna be accurate to the character or not?
 
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