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God (Seekers into the Mystery) downgrade

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ElohAm

ElohAm

10
2
I saw a profile about God (Seekers into the Mystery), and I saw an explanation of the reasons for God getting tier 1-A
https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/God_(Seekers_into_the_Mystery)
Click to expand...

•"Outerverse level (God is an eternal, formless and infinite consciousness, Maya is the dream of God. While Maya is the illusion, God is the ultimate Reality, the true reality beyond Maya, the Reality from which all dreams emanated. He is beyond duality (Including the duality of space and time, Infinity and limitation, existence and non-existence) as the concept of duality is still inside of Maya who is his dream. If creation is a movie playing in a cinemathen God is the projectionist. He is the ultimate cause of everything. He is one with everything and everyone, he is one with the soul, the true self of everyone. The true self of humans are infinite and timeless but even the human soul swims in the eternal ocean that is God)"

↑The explanation above says that God is the true reality and beyond Maya. In addition, God also transcends the concept of duality (which includes space-time, infinity and limitation), From the explanation it is clear that God is not qualified to go to tier 1-A anymore because there is no infinite hierarchy/infinite higher dimension Since the tier 1-A revision was made by DT. Even beyond the concept there is no mention of the concept of dimensions, there is only the concept of duality which includes space-time infinity and limitation.

Conclusion:

•There is no proof of God (Sekeras into the Mystery) has the trait of Transcendence towards infinite hierarchy/infinite higher dimensions, God is simply beyond the concept of duality which includes space-time.

So I want to bring God downgrade from 1-A to Low 1-C (5D) because it just transcends the concept of duality that includes space-time.

Agree: @PrinceofPein @ImmortalDread @IdiosyncraticLawyer @Lewis @Planck69 @Qawsedf234 @Ovy7

Neutral: @VeryGoofyToddler (But tend to agree with the OP)

Disagree:
 
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Neutral, maybe agreeing with the OP because I agree with the downgrade but I would consider him also to be likely 1-C. However, he transcends everything which includes the likes of duality. Other than that this seems fine.
 
VeryGoofyToddler said:
but I would consider him also to be likely 1-C. However, he transcends everything which includes the likes of duality
Click to expand...

It get tier Low 1-C As explained above


VeryGoofyToddler said:
The layered existence of dreams for the physical, spiritual, and metaphysical realms being a smaller reality of Maya compared to the Magician's true nature and reality.
Click to expand...

The explanation of the layered existence of dreams never mentions the number of layered dreams in each issue comic Seekers into the Mystery
 
ElohAm said:
The explanation of the layered existence of dreams never mentions the number of layered dreams in each issue comic Seekers into the Mystery
Click to expand...
The Magician's the one who's interested in ripping the truth out of you... In stripping the layers of dreams and dragging you into a light that's so bright--it will blind you and burn you alive.

There are layers to the dream closer to the Magicians and each burns brighter and Maya would later be absorbed alongside these dreamsback to the Magician and his Primal Ocean.
 
I wonder if people actually read the story to come up with this conclusion. His missing so much context to the Magician.

I suggest we wait for more knowledgeable people.
 
Antvasima said:
What do you think about this?
Click to expand...
Well this part
ElohAm said:
From the explanation it is clear that God is not qualified to go to tier 1-A anymore because there is no infinite hierarchy/infinite higher dimension Since the tier 1-A revision was made by DT. Even beyond the concept there is no mention of the concept of dimensions, there is only the concept of duality which includes space-time infinity and limitation.
Click to expand...
Isn't true, since our 1-A justification on the FAQ page still has the following:
A: A good way to accomplish this would be to show that whatever state of being in which they exist is completely independent of the number of layers/dimensions present on the setting. For example, if they are unaffected by dimensions being arbitrarily added or removed from physical space by virtue of transcending it entirely, or if they exist as a "background" or canvas of sorts in which any amount of them can be inserted. This argument generalizes to tiers higher than 1-A as well.

Note that, in order to jump to 1-A this way, it does not suffice that adding one or several layers/dimensions makes no difference to the character in question. That much could be true even if the character only has one level of qualitative superiority to the constructs, as then they would all appear to have zero / infinitely small size to them. It has to be clear in some fashion that even if an infinite or unlimited number of dimensions/layers are added or removed it would make no difference to the character. The same applies to similarily large jumps in other tiers, like from 1-A to 1-A+ etc.
Click to expand...
However I do agree that just what the OP posted isn't enough for 1-A without more to it. Since just being beyond duality and everything else can be accomplished by just being superior rather than some Aleph-2 superiority.
 
What's more important here is that the Dream or Maya has uncountable Universes, Planes of Existence, and because of how Matteis writes they're all layered.

Heaven is part of the layer yet we don't know when it ends since God created infinite to have a limitation but referring to his Creation, not the size of it. As the Ocean and Oneness are limitless and so is the dream that encompasses the reality that is Maya. It should be 1-C.

Since this takes place literally after Matteis finished writing Doctor Fate. It's a clear indication although not the same God as the Divine Presence is pretty much allegorical.

Smile - Magician
Divine Presence - God(When his consciousness and form sprung from the Ocean).
Pralaya - Maya(since she has many names in every belief system).
Creation - Both houses infinite/uncountable Universes, Limitless Planes of Existence each as an essence to get closer to one individuality with God. The Soul takes the journey through the layers of dreams.
 
VeryGoofyToddler said:
What's more important here is that the Dream or Maya has uncountable Universes, Planes of Existence, and because of how Matteis writes they're all layered.

Heaven is part of the layer yet we don't know when it ends since God created infinite to have a limitation but referring to his Creation, not the size of it. As the Ocean and Oneness are limitless and so is the dream that encompasses the reality that is Maya. It should be 1-C.

Since this takes place literally after Matteis finished writing Doctor Fate. It's a clear indication although not the same God as the Divine Presence is pretty much allegorical.

Smile - Magician
Divine Presence - God(When his consciousness and form sprung from the Ocean).
Pralaya - Maya(since she has many names in every belief system).
Creation - Both houses infinite/uncountable Universes, Limitless Planes of Existence each as an essence to get closer to one individuality with God. The Soul takes the journey through the layers of dreams.
Click to expand...
Alright this seems fine to get 1-C so here's a new conclusion:

•Uncountable Universe (2-B Possibly 2-A)

•Heaven (Low 1-C 5-D)

•Another layers of dreams (Low 1-C 6-D)

•God/The magician/Primal ocean (1-C 7-D)
 
I think this is acceptable given that many agree with the OP and this is a new conclusion after reading the explanation from VeryGoofyToddler.


ElohAm said:
•Uncountable Universe (2-B Possibly 2-A)

•Heaven (Low 1-C 5-D)

•Another layers of dreams (Low 1-C 6-D)

•God/The magician/Primal ocean (1-C 7-D)
Click to expand...
 
Antvasima said:
Thank you. 🙏

I think that solution can be applied then.
Click to expand...
I have applied these changes. However, I would also contend that we should replace BDE with HDE and Large Size 11 with 10, as God is only higher-dimensional now, not beyond-dimensional.
 
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IdiosyncraticLawyer said:
I have applied these changes. However, I would also contend that we should replace BDE with HDE and Large Size 11 with 10, as God is only higher-dimensional now, not beyond-dimensional.
Click to expand...
He dreamt of the countless dimensions and exists beyond Maya and is the entire Primal Ocean. He created infinity to have a limit and also created all dualities.

He isn't affected by Creation that contains dimensions.
 
VeryGoofyToddler said:
He dreamt of the countless dimensions and exists beyond Maya and is the entire Primal Ocean. He created infinity to have a limit and also created all dualities.

He isn't affected by Creation that contains dimensions.
Click to expand...
This seems to make sense, but you preferably need to post evidence for it.

So what do you think that we should do here then?
 
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