Game mechanics for abilities

[Schnee_One]

Okay, so as noted by Scarlet on 2B vs Gilgamesh, he believes that 2Bs time manipulation and other abilities were game mechanics and shouldn't be added on her profile, I disagree with this as game mechanics or not they are still abilities the character uses.

Nevertheless less, any thoughts?

 

[Cropfist]

If they're game mechanics, they are not valid abilities.

 

[Schnee_One]

Then should all of them be removed or adjusted from profiles?

 

[Cropfist]

It comes down to whether or not they are actual game mechanics.

 

[LazyHunter]

What abilities, how do they work and is any justification for them given in the game? There's some game mechanics that are legitimate abilities of the character and others that are just there for the gameplay. For example, regenerating health in a FPS wouldn't give the main character Regenerationn unless the lore brings up an explanation for it. Slowing down time in a shooter so that the player has bettter acuraccy could be just explained by reflexes and extreme focus, not literally slowing time.

 

[Blanked]

I asked Darknine for input who I believe has some knowledge about game mechanics, but I am not sure how much he knows about this in particular.

 

[Dragonmasterxyz]

It depends. How does her Time hax work?

Is it like Sengoku Basara in which in Gameplay Time Slows down when they enter their Basara State(Forgot the real name). However, that is regarded as game mechanics and not an actual ability.

 

[Blanked]

@dragon

"Time gets slowed down for everyone except the user, activates when dodging an enemies attack or when an enemies long range attack is closing in"

that's the description from her page now how accurate it is I don't know.

 

[Dragonmasterxyz]

Has this ever been reference in cutscenes?

 

[Blanked]

Gargoyle played the game so he should be able to answer i don't know if anyone else played it.

 

[RadicalMrR]

Its case by case.

If the game slows down when attacking and are given 0 exaplaination for it, then its game mecanics.

In 2B's case the slow down can only be achived through a plug in chip, meaning that means that this can be dobe by anyone and just the player so its not game mecanics.

 

[DaFritzi]

I don't think it was ever used in a cutscene.

What makes me certain it is an actual ability and not simply game mechanics is that it is an actual chip that has to be implanted in her body.

Other chips are for example the OS chip which causes her 2Bs death when removed or the speed chip which makes her move faster.

In this game even the HUD and respawning are not game mechanic so I'm sure the abilities by chips are actual abilities as well.

 

[LazyHunter]

If it's done by her equipment it should be legit.

 

[Dragonmasterxyz]

Then it's fine imo.

 

[Schnee_One]

Her equipment explains pretty much every ability she has yes.

Every ability she has is an adjustable pod program, including her intangibility which was compared to super armor on an EX Shoruyuken

 

[Amelia_Lonelyheart]

Yeah, if it's ever referenced in the lore, or menu or anything, it should be fine. If what Dafrizi says it's true (which I assume it is, he's been trustworthy so far), then I think it's fine.

 

[DaFritzi]

Thanks for the kind words.

Yeah the chips are items that can be stored and plugged in via the menu to activate their effects.

 

[Matthew_Schroeder]

I don't really get this complaint.

All of Mario's Power-Ups are valid and canon, just like all moves and weapons Crash can obtain throughout the games. Similarly, all of a character's spells in a JRPG are valid and canon too.

Though some games have time slowing down simply as game-mechanics and nothing is explained, while others like DMC, Bayonetta and Metal Gear Rising have legitimate reasons for it.

 

[ScarletFirefly]

Apparently this is being discussed here. Anyway.

The fact that the HUD and respawning are handled by chips in-game, doesn't explain the existence of this ability. This is not mathematical logic. And if there are no references to it, outside gameplay, the validity of said ability is dubious at best.

Also if there is an actual technology in-game that makes her untouchable it would be legit, but the lack of it makes me think what I'm saying above.

And I don't really think the "trustworthyness' of a member should be taken in consideration for these things, no offense to Fritzi of course. A person can be misled or misunderstand things despite his good intentions.

And I mention this once again, can someone please provide visual evidence of the aforementioned abilities?

 

[ScarletFirefly]

To clarify, I'm talking specifically about her Invulnerability after taking damage and Time Slow when dodging attacks.

 

[Schnee_One]

Why doesn't it? The game both explains what the ability is and what it does, time slow in particular was a quest reward given in act 2 of the game.

I also noticed this during a replay of Act 3, 9S and A2 fight, and you have to choose who you play as, and regardless of whether or not you do any side quests or buy any of the pod programs, 9S or A2 will still use said weapons against the player, so they are referenced more then once.

 

[Reppuzan]

@Scarlet

Mercy Invincibility (a more technical term for what you're describing) is definitely game mechanics.

However, I don't know enough about NiER to say if the Time Slow is game mechanics.

 

[The_Everlasting]

@Rep

It's not quite mercy invincibility, it's more like you get a chip that lets you become invincible for a few seconds after taking damage, not something like "you get hit and are by default invincible for a few seconds".

 

[Schnee_One]

^Thats actually a pod program as well. You get it from 11B as a quest reward in act 1

 

[The_Everlasting]

@Scarlet

The chips are explained several times as being things 2B/9S/A2 can implant in themselves to give themselves various different boosts, I don't see how only being a gameplay thing changes that. It's not like you just go to the settings and enable/disable any of it, you literally implant chips that give you it.

Also no, respawning is not handled by chips, the androids just have their data rebooted back at the Bunker as an effective restart (I'd explain it more, but that would carry heavy spoilers).

The general point is the game tries to explain all of this, and doesn't just give you stuff like the time slow for no reason.

 

[Matthew_Schroeder]

I agree with The Everlasting. These are explicitly story abilities.

 

[Schnee_One]

I'll wait for their response before closing.

 

[Antvasima]

Only staff members can close threads. You can only remove your own, and that is not a good idea.

 

[ScarletFirefly]

@The Everlasting

I get the idea of chips, I have played a small portion of the game. But being game mechanics doesn't mean you can enable/disable them.

2B's ability that slows time in an area is handled by the A110: Slow chip. Is there a named chip that handles her invulnerability after taking damage and slowing time after dodging?

 

[The_Everlasting]

My point is that the game is implementing it through a feature they establish as canon, I fail to see how it's game mechanics.

First of all, A110: Slow isn't a chip, it's a Pod program, and what do you mean by "named chip"? There are chips that can do it, but I forget what their names are (Since I never use them because I balance my characters differently).

 

[ScarletFirefly]

There are chips that can do it, but I forget what their names are (Since I never use them because I balance my characters differently).

I mean are there any chips/programs/whatever that can do this or are we just assuming they exist like DaFritzi is doing?

 

[The_Everlasting]

I know that there are.

 

[ScarletFirefly]

Alright, I'll take your word for it. Are we done here so we can close this?

 

[Schnee_One]

Yep, concluded