Frieren vs Aqua (Konosuba)

[Flashlight237]

Worth a shot, I mean... Frieren is a mage who is a millennia old because of this DnD thing where people randomly threw triple-digit numbers at people with pointy ears and called it a day. Seems simple, right? Well, Aqua is a goddess. Granted Aqua is a goddess who spends her skill points on party favors, but still. Either way, despite their age and experience, Frieren and Aqua both have some serious issues to work out. Frieren is often either sleeping or getting eaten by a mimic over some weird 99% chance. Aqua is often known as the "Useless Goddess" due to her tendency to whine or get drunk and sometimes even flat-out stupidity. Sure, Aqua has buffs, but since Aqua's luck is so terrible that it serves as a direct counter to Kazuma's Second-to-God luck, it's pretty unlikely that she'll get one off.

Aqua has sealing, which iirc can be done with a thought... Problem is even the standard Zoltraak had overcome standard-grade sealing and power-null. What can do Frieren in is the fact that she's a complete glass cannon, or at least that's what the profile says because nobody tried gauging any durability feats for the verse. Frieren gets nommed on by Mimics; even giving a Mimic a bite-force quotient of 50 would be a massive upgrade to that stat.

As for Aqua... Well, one hit and Aqua is boned, but Aqua also has that against Frieren, so... Yeah.

This match-up will be between Frieren and Archpriest Aqua (as I'm pretty sure Goddess Aqua would just stomp). As for speed... I'll leave that unequalized for now as VBW speed equalization logic can be a bit finicky. That's not mentioning the default range would give both contestants plenty of time to dodge each other's crap. Let's give each of our combatants one day of prep. That should be enough for them to figure out how to handle one another.

Anyway, here are their profiles:

Frieren's Profile
Aqua's Profile

Who takes this?

Frieren: 0
Useless Goddess: 0
Inconclusive: 0

 

[Fallen_Angelicx]

Doesn't aqua get unfathomably outskilled here?

 

[Flashlight237]

Doesn't aqua get unfathomably outskilled here?

Not really, she is apparently Eris' senpai (even if she doesn't act like it pretty much all the time).: https://konosuba.fandom.com/wiki/Eris

 

[Detective_Blizzard]

Not really, she is apparently Eris' senpai (even if she doesn't act like it pretty much all the time).: https://konosuba.fandom.com/wiki/Eris

Being someone's boss doesn't help much as a intelligence feat lol. Aqua's own page refers to how she lacks basic analytic skills and self awareness to use any knowledge she has effectively.

 

[AThe1412]

Frieren is only a glass cannon if you ignore the durability amp from Mana and Defensive Magic. Also, she gets nommed by Mimics frequently but she never took any damage from them hence why she even willingly takes the 1% chance to get a grimoire. Aqua, no matter whether she's in her Archpriest or Goddess key, can't do anything to Frieren. She's too weak and incompetent for that.

 

[Flashlight237]

Frieren is only a glass cannon if you ignore the durability amp from Mana and Defensive Magic. Also, she gets nommed by Mimics frequently but she never took any damage from them hence why she even willingly takes the 1% chance to get a grimoire. Aqua, no matter whether she's in her Archpriest or Goddess key, can't do anything to Frieren. She's too weak and incompetent for that.

Funny you mention Mimics... I just did a calc on those damn things.

 

[FrenzyUND]

Worth a shot, I mean... Frieren is a mage who is a millennia old because of this DnD thing where people randomly threw triple-digit numbers at people with pointy ears and called it a day. Seems simple, right? Well, Aqua is a goddess. Granted Aqua is a goddess who spends her skill points on party favors, but still. Either way, despite their age and experience, Frieren and Aqua both have some serious issues to work out. Frieren is often either sleeping or getting eaten by a mimic over some weird 99% chance. Aqua is often known as the "Useless Goddess" due to her tendency to whine or get drunk and sometimes even flat-out stupidity. Sure, Aqua has buffs, but since Aqua's luck is so terrible that it serves as a direct counter to Kazuma's Second-to-God luck, it's pretty unlikely that she'll get one off.

Aqua has sealing, which iirc can be done with a thought... Problem is even the standard Zoltraak had overcome standard-grade sealing and power-null. What can do Frieren in is the fact that she's a complete glass cannon, or at least that's what the profile says because nobody tried gauging any durability feats for the verse. Frieren gets nommed on by Mimics; even giving a Mimic a bite-force quotient of 50 would be a massive upgrade to that stat.

As for Aqua... Well, one hit and Aqua is boned, but Aqua also has that against Frieren, so... Yeah.

This match-up will be between Frieren and Archpriest Aqua (as I'm pretty sure Goddess Aqua would just stomp). As for speed... I'll leave that unequalized for now as VBW speed equalization logic can be a bit finicky. That's not mentioning the default range would give both contestants plenty of time to dodge each other's crap. Let's give each of our combatants one day of prep. That should be enough for them to figure out how to handle one another.

Anyway, here are their profiles:

Frieren's Profile
Aqua's Profile

Who takes this?

Frieren: 0
Useless Goddess: 0
Inconclusive: 0

Luck is not important in battle, Konosuba-wise, unless you're using luck-based skills. And Aqua with buffs tied Kazuma in rock-paper-scissors as per Yorimichi 3.

Frieren is not a glass cannon, she took some big hits from Solitär and survived just fine.

Aqua is a tank though, Frieren can't hurt her, no attack in Konosuba can injury her while she wears her Divine Relic according to the author himself, and nothing in Frieren compares to the firepower that exists in Konosuba.

Frieren characters are below supersonic in speed to the point they are hopeless trying to catch a supersonic bird without tricking it. But to not make this super boring and assume a speed equalized fight, Frieren doesn't really have a winning condition, unless she could somehow figure out Aqua's Hagoromo grants her her immunity to damage, and somehow gets it off Aqua... even then, Aqua's base defensive stats + buffas and healing is probably too much for Frieren to overcome.

Frieren can fly, but Sacred Break Spell nullifies flight magic (shown on V11), so Aqua could either get close and beat Frieren up physically, or drawn her with Sacred Create Water.

Still, Frieren might be hard to put down physically due to her high mana and shields which are pretty strong, but hey, again, I forgot, Sacred Break Spell lol, it'd break through Frieren's shield like glass, since it can even break through the barrier around the Demon King's castle, something able to eat dozens of nuke level Explosion spells.

 

[FrenzyUND]

Being someone's boss doesn't help much as a intelligence feat lol. Aqua's own page refers to how she lacks basic analytic skills and self awareness to use any knowledge she has effectively.

Which is a false statement, Konosuba profiles have more wrong information than otherwise.

Aqua's quick and smart thinking in battle, using her knowleadge and powers to nullify the enemy's flight ability ( which she'd do against Frieren ):

- V11 Chapter 05.

Aqua makes a deep analysis of how a fight between her and Kazuma would play out, stating how she'd counter every single thing he has and beat him up:

- V9 Chapter 02.

And when they fight, it plays out exactly how Aqua predicted to a point Kazuma says she could be the Goddess of Bar Fights:

Not to say Aqua has the upper hand against the likes of Wiz and even Vanir who'd solo the Frieren cast with low difficulty.

 

[Flashlight237]

Luck is not important in battle, Konosuba-wise, unless you're using luck-based skills. And Aqua with buffs tied Kazuma in rock-paper-scissors as per Yorimichi 3.

Frieren is not a glass cannon, she took some big hits from Solitär and survived just fine.

Aqua is a tank though, Frieren can't hurt her, no attack in Konosuba can injury her while she wears her Divine Relic according to the author himself, and nothing in Frieren compares to the firepower that exists in Konosuba.

Frieren characters are below supersonic in speed to the point they are hopeless trying to catch a supersonic bird without tricking it. But to not make this super boring and assume a speed equalized fight, Frieren doesn't really have a winning condition, unless she could somehow figure out Aqua's Hagoromo grants her her immunity to damage, and somehow gets it off Aqua... even then, Aqua's base defensive stats + buffas and healing is probably too much for Frieren to overcome.

Frieren can fly, but Sacred Break Spell nullifies flight magic (shown on V11), so Aqua could either get close and beat Frieren up physically, or drawn her with Sacred Create Water.

Still, Frieren might be hard to put down physically due to her high mana and shields which are pretty strong, but hey, again, I forgot, Sacred Break Spell lol, it'd break through Frieren's shield like glass, since it can even break through the barrier around the Demon King's castle, something able to eat dozens of nuke level Explosion spells.

Wow. Good argument.

@Fallen_Angelicx @AThe1412 Any objections?

 

[Detective_Blizzard]

Which is a false statement, Konosuba profiles have more wrong information than otherwise.

Aqua's quick and smart thinking in battle, using her knowleadge and powers to nullify the enemy's flight ability ( which she'd do against Frieren ):

- V11 Chapter 05.

I'd like to point out, this is literally one line away from the Manicore crashing into Kazuma because while it lost it's ability to fly, it still charged into him due to gravity (Kazuma wasn't hurt much from it due to having buffed defenses, but still not that smart of a move)

Aqua makes a deep analysis of how a fight between her and Kazuma would play out, stating how she'd counter every single thing he has and beat him up:

- V9 Chapter 02.

That is literally just Aqua and Kazuma one uping each other, it's not much of a deep analysis when it's just saying "Your basic spell wouldn't work and I can buff myself". Hell Kazuma literally points out how she had a spell that can remove binds and she just didn't cast it before. One of the next parts to this has the group going to fight Goblins, Aqua trips on icey terrain and falls on her face, and the goblins got away (Granted, it was Megumin's fault for that, but this doesn't yell smart)

And when they fight, it plays out exactly how Aqua predicted to a point Kazuma says she could be the Goddess of Bar Fights:

Not to say Aqua has the upper hand against the likes of Wiz and even Vanir who'd solo the Frieren cast with low difficulty.

Which, again, is just Aqua stat stomping to win a fight. That's not much in the way of an intelligence win and with that level of strategy she just gets blasted. She's not idiotic to the point of being completely below average, but she's certainly not smart enough to outmaneuver Frieren especially when she has the stat advantage.

 

[FrenzyUND]

I'd like to point out, this is literally one line away from the Manicore crashing into Kazuma because while it lost it's ability to fly, it still charged into him due to gravity (Kazuma wasn't hurt much from it due to having buffed defenses, but still not that smart of a move)

The point was:

Aqua's own page refers to how she lacks basic analytic skills and self awareness to use any knowledge she has effectively.

Which is debunked by Aqua using her knowleadge about Manticores and her skills to deal with them. And as you said yourself, Kazuma was barely hurt ( due to Aqua's buffs ), so it was definitely a smart move, although besides the point. If Frieren falls on Aqua after getting her flight negated, it won't hurt her either.

That is literally just Aqua and Kazuma one uping each other, it's not much of a deep analysis when it's just saying "Your basic spell wouldn't work and I can buff myself". Hell Kazuma literally points out how she had a spell that can remove binds and she just didn't cast it before.

Again, the argument was that Aqua was so dumb she couldn't use her knowleadge or skills effectively, which is proved wrong when she uses her knowleadge about Kazuma's arsenal and her skills to counter him in everything. When they fought, it happened exactly like her predicted, not like "smart" Kazuma predicted.

Also, it was Darkness complaining why Aqua didn't use that on her, she had used it on Bind before ( V6 ), she just didn't care to free Darkness at that moment.

Aqua is a canonically good fighter, that's the point.

Which, again, is just Aqua stat stomping to win a fight. That's not much in the way of an intelligence win and with that level of strategy she just gets blasted. She's not idiotic to the point of being completely below average, but she's certainly not smart enough to outmaneuver Frieren especially when she has the stat advantage.

Not really, she has to resist Drain Touch, nullify Bind with Break Spell, then buff herself and stomp.

And wdym Frieren has the stat advantage? Aqua outstats her in everything.

Speed? Kazuma level characters have bullet timing feats, while Frieren couldn't dream of catching a supersonic bird in a conventional way;

Durability? Nothing on Frieren's arsenal can injury Aqua, according to Natsume himself on the fanbook, the Divine Relic will defend her from any attacks, and nothing in Frieren comes close to the destructive power that exists in Konosuba:

Strength? Even without buffs she can pin Vanir with Wiz's help, Vanir can wrestle dragons the size of a warehouse and that can swallow a cow with one hand. Wiz, Wolfsgang ( Wiz level Vampire ), Kazuma, Darkness and Megumin together couldn't break Aqua's grip when she buffed herself on Yorimichi 1. With buffs she's possibly the physically strongest character, and I won't even bring up the fact Akatsukiverse has feats of strength at mountain-range of several miles level.

Mana? Aqua's literally infinite.

Magic power?

- Bakuen Spinoff V2 Chapter 4.

DC? Nothing on Frieren's arsenal compares to Sacred Create Water which, even when cast without buffs and for only a few seconds, it flooded an entire city, destroying its walls and buildings around it.

 

[Detective_Blizzard]

Ok, ignoring most of that and focusing on the factual stuff

Speed? Kazuma level characters have bullet timing feats, while Frieren couldn't dream of catching a supersonic bird in a conventional way;

Speed? Kazuma and Aqua have subsonic speed against Frieren's Supersonic/Hypersonic+ speeds, Aqua couldn't dream of catching her in a conventional way

Durability? Nothing on Frieren's arsenal can injury Aqua, according to Natsume himself on the fanbook, the Divine Relic will defend her from any attacks, and nothing in Frieren comes close to the destructive power that exists in Konosuba:

Durability? Nothing in Aqua's arsenal can bypass Frieren's shields, her defenses and attack potency have a kiloton of power behind them, nothing in Aqua's arsenal comes close to that destructive power except her strongest spell which is still below it by a fair margin

Strength? Even without buffs she can pin Vanir with Wiz's help, Vanir can wrestle dragons the size of a warehouse and that can swallow a cow with one hand. Wiz, Wolfsgang ( Wiz level Vampire ), Kazuma, Darkness and Megumin together couldn't break Aqua's grip when she buffed herself on Yorimichi 1. With buffs she's possibly the physically strongest character, and I won't even bring up the fact Akatsukiverse has feats of strength at mountain-range of several miles level.

Strength? Peak human lifting strength vs Class 50, sure Aqua can punch harder but that doesn't mean much when she gets literally one spotted.

Mana? Aqua's literally infinite.

I mean yeah sure, she has stamina. But that doesn't matter much when the fight ends in one move

DC? Nothing on Frieren's arsenal compares to Sacred Create Water which, even when cast without buffs and for only a few seconds, it flooded an entire city, destroying its walls and buildings around it.

DC? Aqua's strongest move is outclassed by Frieren's, has a longer startup time than it, and can get nullified from Friren's power null alongside her buffs.

These are everything the profiles themselves have, if you have a problem revise the verse

 

[AThe1412]

The point was:



Which is debunked by Aqua using her knowleadge about Manticores and her skills to deal with them. And as you said yourself, Kazuma was barely hurt ( due to Aqua's buffs ), so it was definitely a smart move, although besides the point. If Frieren falls on Aqua after getting her flight negated, it won't hurt her either.


Again, the argument was that Aqua was so dumb she couldn't use her knowleadge or skills effectively, which is proved wrong when she uses her knowleadge about Kazuma's arsenal and her skills to counter him in everything. When they fought, it happened exactly like her predicted, not like "smart" Kazuma predicted.

Also, it was Darkness complaining why Aqua didn't use that on her, she had used it on Bind before ( V6 ), she just didn't care to free Darkness at that moment.

Aqua is a canonically good fighter, that's the point.



Not really, she has to resist Drain Touch, nullify Bind with Break Spell, then buff herself and stomp.

And wdym Frieren has the stat advantage? Aqua outstats her in everything.

Speed? Kazuma level characters have bullet timing feats, while Frieren couldn't dream of catching a supersonic bird in a conventional way;

Durability? Nothing on Frieren's arsenal can injury Aqua, according to Natsume himself on the fanbook, the Divine Relic will defend her from any attacks, and nothing in Frieren comes close to the destructive power that exists in Konosuba:

Strength? Even without buffs she can pin Vanir with Wiz's help, Vanir can wrestle dragons the size of a warehouse and that can swallow a cow with one hand. Wiz, Wolfsgang ( Wiz level Vampire ), Kazuma, Darkness and Megumin together couldn't break Aqua's grip when she buffed herself on Yorimichi 1. With buffs she's possibly the physically strongest character, and I won't even bring up the fact Akatsukiverse has feats of strength at mountain-range of several miles level.

Mana? Aqua's literally infinite.

Magic power?

- Bakuen Spinoff V2 Chapter 4.

DC? Nothing on Frieren's arsenal compares to Sacred Create Water which, even when cast without buffs and for only a few seconds, it flooded an entire city, destroying its walls and buildings around it.

Okay cool. Now where's all of that on Aqua's profile?

 

[Flashlight237]

Gatekeeping much? Any amount of scans is better than relying on Wiki profiles.

 

[AThe1412]

Gatekeeping much? Any amount of scans is better than relying on Wiki profiles.

You mean scans that support outlandish and more importantly  unaccepted claims?

 

[Enter_Bluey]

Tbf, when it comes to magic in the world of konosuba, choosing to resist a magic and having high defense allows you to resist the magic spells tied behind it(like even time magic). And aqua probably resists most of the spells in Frierens arsenal. But AP(of the magic) and speed on this site are the issue.

Granted, even explosion rn is scaled to low 7-C from a vol 7-8 feat, and got a lot stronger up to the last volume considerably. I think aqua would be relative, given explosion can't 1 shot the devil king but she should be relative to him as a Goddess. But it's not up to me.

Also the speed issue, she gets blitzed here in combat. So she may not even have the time to resist the magic(though her base resistances and high defense stat help to resist magic). If they were equal speed, she could probably nullify all the spells, resist them and give more of a fight. It'd be closer than one would expect. Funnily enough, Aqua WOULD do better in hand to hand vs her. But frieren would still fight at a range probably, and still has the potential to hurt her more. But stamina can also come into play here for aqua. Frieren also has defensive magic that would need to be dealt with. You could argue aqua can nullify it or even the flight, I feel like there's more paths to go.

But with that said, it's not speed equal anyway so she probably gets overwhelmed given how Frieren also fights and the speed diff. Ap diff added on top is a gg, I think Frieren takes it. Also Aqua is pretty dumb as well. Granted she's been shown able to fight when against actual people, and not in a terrible luck situation that counters her. But eh..


The real ending is they bond over hatred for demons

 

[Zabazab]

I doubt Frieren would try to blast Aqua's head off, but Zoltraak would still be pretty effective right?

 

[FrenzyUND]

Okay cool. Now where's all of that on Aqua's profile?

Frozen in the bureaucratic system of the site.

All the info has been given already in threads, but there's nothing I can do if people and mods don't show up to update stuff.

 

[FrenzyUND]

Speed? Kazuma and Aqua have subsonic speed against Frieren's Supersonic/Hypersonic+ speeds, Aqua couldn't dream of catching her in a conventional way

Frieren has no supersonic, never mind hypersonic feats, the tournament arc wasn't clear enough, when Frieren had absolutely no way of catching a bird because "they are supersonic"?

Akatsukiverse has countless bullet timing and hypersonic feats, however. Supersonic Agent 22 Adventured with the Axel guild for months, never thought he was particularly fast, quite the opposite, and Natsume himself stated that Kazuma would beat supersonic Agent 6 in a few fights due to being smarter, which would be impossible if he couldn't match his speed and fact dude literally fights with guns:

Durability? Nothing in Aqua's arsenal can bypass Frieren's shields, her defenses and attack potency have a kiloton of power behind them, nothing in Aqua's arsenal comes close to that destructive power except her strongest spell which is still below it by a fair margin

Aqua's Break Spell can break through the Destroyer's shield and the barrier around the Demon King Castle that can withstand 50 back to back nuke level Explosion spells and you're saying this?

Aqua's strongest attack below it? What Frieren has ever done to even come close to compare to Sacred Create Water?

Most powerful spells in Frieren are around this level, like this one cast by Soliäir who was wiping the floor with bloodlusted Frieren and broke through her shield easily:

You've also not addressed how Frieren cannot injury Aqua due to her Divine Relic, and therefore has no winning condition.

Strength? Peak human lifting strength vs Class 50, sure Aqua can punch harder but that doesn't mean much when she gets literally one spotted.


Strength? Peak human lifting strength vs Class 50, sure Aqua can punch harder but that doesn't mean much when she gets literally one spotted.


I mean yeah sure, she has stamina. But that doesn't matter much when the fight ends in one move

Again, still waiting for you to explain how multi-building level Frieren will injury Aqua who can tank anything that exists in Konosuba according to the author himself, and when Konosuba has city busting to mountain busting to multi-country busting stuff.

DC? Aqua's strongest move is outclassed by Frieren's, has a longer startup time than it, and can get nullified from Friren's power null alongside her buffs.

These are everything the profiles themselves have, if you have a problem revise the verse

Frieren's strongest spells don't come close, by feats, to Aqua's Sacred Create Water, even without buffs and even without putting the effort... and this was base Aqua, not god form:

Also, Frieren has no power null against water, Aqua has though, after nullfying Frieren's flight and shields with Break Spell, she'll either one shot Frieren with God Blow or Sacred Create Water.

These are everything the profiles themselves have, if you have a problem revise the verse

Like I said, everything was shared in detail here in this very forum, it's now up to others and the mods to read through it and update the profiles.

 

[Detective_Blizzard]

Ignoring most of that for a second

Like I said, everything was shared in detail here in this very forum, it's now up to others and the mods to read through it and update the profiles.

What does that mean, the only means of doing so is with CRTs and if you referring to this conversation then no this means literally nothing and the profiles won't be effected. If you meant to link something then you didn't

 

[Zabazab]

Frieren has no supersonic, never mind hypersonic feats

Zoltraak is supersonic+

Aqua's strongest attack below it? What Frieren has ever done to even come close to compare to Sacred Create Water?

Most powerful spells in Frieren are around this level, like this one cast by Soliäir who was wiping the floor with bloodlusted Frieren and broke through her shield easily:

Daosdorg is a kiloton of TNT

 

[FrenzyUND]

Zoltraak is supersonic+


Daosdorg is a kiloton of TNT

Sorry, I can't take these calcs serious.

To think Frieren is supersonic+ because of such a wrong calc when we have a literal arc where she can't catch a bird because it's supersonic is just insane:

Same for the 1kt calc, meanwhile Akatsukiverse is listed as Town Level when we have stuff like this:

Thermonuclear Lilith:

Up to country busting Meteor Drop spell being a thing:

Multi big country level busting Alice:

Spam of 10kt explosions ( 2/3 if Hiroshima's bomb ) Belial with only one nitro booster:

Mountain range of several miles sized dragon:

That obliterates smaller mountains:

Tigerman wrestles mountain range-sized dragon and full all nitro-powered Belial one shots it by nuking its brains:

Gets only a broken arm after being attacked by mountain range-sized dragon of several miles:

The fact is that Konosuba is leagues above Frieren in AP, speed, durability, hax and basically anything else.

If you meant to link something then you didn't

Akatsukiverse update and edits (Combatants V7 and overall)

First of, I'd like to make edits regarding incorrect stuff involved missing info and incorrect translations already proved here but that was never changed. First, as already proved in this thread...

vsbattles.com

Konosuba 6-B update

In previous threads I have argued Konosuba's scaling to Combatants who has country busting technology, showing how the author portrayed the high tiers (Gods, Devils and Angels) as stronger than Kisaragi and their technology. Now, in a recent short-story, country busting magic was confirmed to...

vsbattles.com

Upgrading Konosuba characters through Sentouin!

Okay so I'm back (Sorry for taking long). Anyway I'm just creating this thread for @FrenzyUND since honestly he's better at the powerscaling stuff than I am. So I'll just be adding onto Konosuba character abilties or scaling whatever. Wolbach Honestly nothing wrong with her page tbh I...

vsbattles.com

 

[Zabazab]

To think Frieren is supersonic+ because of such a wrong calc when we have a literal arc where she can't catch a bird because it's supersonic is just insane

The calc is correct, that is how fast the Zoltraak moved in that scene. The Mages can't keep up with the Stille because there's a limit on the speed and altitude of flight magic, the spell can't be altered because its repurposed demon magic.

Same for the 1kt calc, meanwhile Akatsukiverse is listed as Town Level when we have stuff like this

Why does any of this matter when Aqua is rated 8-B+

 

[Pearly0nsams]

the likes of Wiz and even Vanir who'd solo the Frieren cast with low difficulty.

Both getting blitzed and 1 taped by Stark

 

[Bernkastelll]

To think Frieren is supersonic+ because of such a wrong calc when we have a literal arc where she can't catch a bird because it's supersonic is just insane:

This is not even an argument, Frieren movement speed is literally rated as average here, only her combat and reaction speed are that fast, the Stille (supersonic bird) have a supersonic movement speed, of course people can't catch it, because their movement speed aren't supersonic, these are different types of speed ratings buddy

 

[Enter_Bluey]

Both getting blitzed and 1 taped by Stark

Pretty sure Wiz is invulnerable to physical attacks so not really

 

[MysticBrawler]

I think Frieren has the advantage thanks to these:
1) Information Analysis (Can decipher the mechanics behind magic instantly just by looking at it)-this coupled with Frieren's superior intelligence would allow her to remain (at least)1 step ahead of Aqua.
2),Stealth Mastery/Invisibility (Passively suppress her magic to appear as weak. Can suppress her magic to the point of not being sensed anymore, Can use attacks which cannot be perceived by even seasoned mages as magic)-for sneak attacks.
3) Power Mimicry (Copied Mana Strike)-can probably copy Aqua's spells.
4)Power Nullification (Can cast a powerful Anti-Magic spell)
5) Layered Magic Projection (1 Layer; With ordinary offense magic, known in the demonic magic system as Killing Magic: Zoltraak.[1] Zoltraak was developed by the Great Demon Qual as the world's first piercing magic, which bypassed the magic resistance of spells and equipment, directly eradicating the body.) and Layered Forcefield Creation & Resistance to Magic (1 Layer; Modern defense magic is a spell that was developed in order to counter the piercing property of Zoltraak.[1] It can defend against the majority of offensive spells)- none of Aqua's spells are layered so the only thing in her Arsenal that could bypass this is her Sacred Break Spell. Though from what I've seen it seems that Aqua's Sacred Break Spell is dodgeable.

 

[MysticBrawler]

I think Frieren has the advantage thanks to these:
1) Information Analysis (Can decipher the mechanics behind magic instantly just by looking at it)-this coupled with Frieren's superior intelligence would allow her to remain (at least)1 step ahead of Aqua.
2),Stealth Mastery/Invisibility (Passively suppress her magic to appear as weak. Can suppress her magic to the point of not being sensed anymore, Can use attacks which cannot be perceived by even seasoned mages as magic)-for sneak attacks.
3) Power Mimicry (Copied Mana Strike)-can probably copy Aqua's spells.
4)Power Nullification (Can cast a powerful Anti-Magic spell)
5) Layered Magic Projection (1 Layer; With ordinary offense magic, known in the demonic magic system as Killing Magic: Zoltraak.[1] Zoltraak was developed by the Great Demon Qual as the world's first piercing magic, which bypassed the magic resistance of spells and equipment, directly eradicating the body.) and Layered Forcefield Creation & Resistance to Magic (1 Layer; Modern defense magic is a spell that was developed in order to counter the piercing property of Zoltraak.[1] It can defend against the majority of offensive spells)- none of Aqua's spells are layered so the only thing in her Arsenal that could bypass this is her Sacred Break Spell. Though from what I've seen it seems that Aqua's Sacred Break Spell is dodgeable.

Bump

 

[Chariot190]

Frieren has no supersonic, never mind hypersonic feats, the tournament arc wasn't clear enough, when Frieren had absolutely no way of catching a bird because "they are supersonic"?

She has several actually, numerous spells have supersonic speed, if not higher. She's also reacted to spells point-blank that by default have to be beyond supersonic simply based on the mechanics of the spell.

It's flight speed that's lower, but that's due to the mechanics of the spell itself, her attacks and own reactions vastly exceed flight speed given flight speed is limited to the rules of the magic itself. They actually elaborate on this at a few points within the manga, flight is simply a spell. It has a set speed, it even has a set vertical distance it can go, it's decent, but not that good in most cases. Even just running at times is better.

Secondly, this kinda ignores the birds also had dragon level stats, just tagging them isn't important (they literally did) plus they needed it alive for the qualification, they just don't give a shit and tank and flee, or fail because they killed it (Frieren and a few others there could have easily killed it, but capturing it is a hell of a lot harder). Plus, Frieren herself was acting as a mentor, she didn't want to just settle it all herself, she gave both allies ample chances to play pivotal roles in the plan. They needed to incap it given context, given the birds' mana sensing as well, they'd know you're coming far, far, away.

Saying they aren't supersonic when Zoltrak has feats of making things like sonic booms and covering kilometers before someone can react is kinda super disingenious.

 

[Chariot190]

Again, still waiting for you to explain how multi-building level Frieren

Casual Frieren btw.
also oh hey it made a sonicboom in that panel.

Also, Frieren has no power null against water, Aqua has though, after nullfying Frieren's flight and shields with Break Spell, she'll either one shot Frieren with God Blow or Sacred Create Water.

She has info anal and can develop power null against stuff she's never seen before in seconds.

To think Frieren is supersonic+ because of such a wrong calc when we have a literal arc where she can't catch a bird because it's supersonic is just insane:

Notice how she doesn't actually say anything past telling the infinitely inferior mages that what they just did was useless, focusing on the uselessness of the actual restraint method.

 

[FrenzyUND]

The calc is correct, that is how fast the Zoltraak moved in that scene. The Mages can't keep up with the Stille because there's a limit on the speed and altitude of flight magic, the spell can't be altered because its repurposed demon magic.


Why does any of this matter when Aqua is rated 8-B+

Because she's way over 8-B+, being at the peak of the verse.

Also, the calc uses how fast it moved in the animation at the anime, if we were going to use the anime, then Megumin's V5 explosion in the movie could be seen from outerspace, but we have no consistency here, do we? Frieren spells are not meant to be supersonic, otherwise they could capture Stille with them, the only supersonic thing in Frieren canon is that bird.

Both getting blitzed and 1 taped by Stark

Lol. They wouldn't even register him as a threat.

She has several actually, numerous spells have supersonic speed, if not higher. She's also reacted to spells point-blank that by default have to be beyond supersonic simply based on the mechanics of the spell.

It's flight speed that's lower

Then why not use spells to capture the Stille? They couldn't, they had to observe it and trick it into "capturing" itself, they had no way to shoot him with some magic while he flies.

Secondly, this kinda ignores the birds also had dragon level stats, just tagging them isn't important

By taking Stille by surprise with the water and ice combo spells, once it was in movement they had no hopes of touching it.

Saying they aren't supersonic when Zoltrak has feats of making things like sonic booms and covering kilometers before someone can react is kinda super disingenious.

I'll accept manga evidence for it, if there's any, then that's it, but anime calcs nope, especially when the knife isn't cutting both ways here and Konosuba isn't allowed anime feats.

Casual Frieren btw.

I forgot about this feat completely, it was in the time shenanigans arc if I recall, fair enough, it's indeed an insane feat leagues above multi-building level, still, not enough to leave a scratch on Aqua while she wears her divine relic.

She has info anal and can develop power null against stuff she's never seen before in seconds.

Just like how it took her at least a month ( if not months I don't recall right now ) literally sleeping over a lifetime of memories from Macht to develop a power null against his gold transmutation? Something that she also was only able to do because she had a prior experience with it, which took her a 100 years just to figure out how to nullify the gold out of her arm?

Only one of them - Aqua - has this power, Sacred Break Spell will nullify basically any spell Frieren has and Reflect will reflect basically anything back to Frieren,

 

[Chariot190]

Also, the calc uses how fast it moved in the animation at the anime, if we were going to use the anime, then Megumin's V5 explosion in the movie could be seen from outerspace, but we have no consistency here, do we?

I dont care.

Frieren spells are not meant to be supersonic, otherwise they could capture Stille with them, the only supersonic thing in Frieren canon is that bird.

That's kind of ironic because they mention multiple times they COULD tag the Stille, they just had no way to restrain it permanently without getting right up on its ass. They flatout say they could mess with it, but it wouldn't restrain due to the fact it's also as strong as a dragon?

Why ignore half the problem?

Then why not use spells to capture the Stille? They couldn't, they had to observe it and trick it into "capturing" itself, they had no way to shoot him with some magic while he flies.

Because they wouldn't work to capture it? They flatout state they have magic that can tag it, it just wouldn't restrain it for long. You're ignoring they're strong as dragons and they need to capture it alive.

See this? It's them saying "yeah they're tanky and robust, tagging them with normal shit don't hinder it" while showing one unphased by some sort of beam attack it looks like based on the collateral.

The only spell Frieren had that could "capture" it was one she needed to get right up on its ass, they also make note that the Still's know where they are within at least 20m, and at best the've only got within a few meters of them before.

What is she supposed to do? Blow a ******* hole through it and fail the test? Or use stuff that is completely useless?

You're hyper focusing the "it's supersonic" as the only problem, when that means they can't catch up to it with flight should it escape, a thing they explicitly note as well. Hell the very statement where they mention it's mach 1 initially, also focuses on the fact it's as robust as a dragon so that type of restraint is useless.

Then why not use spells to capture the Stille? They couldn't, they had to observe it and trick it into "capturing" itself, they had no way to shoot him with some magic while he flies.

You don't seem to pay much attention.
That's exactly what they did.

She only had one spell capable of such that works only within a 50cm range though, hence the need to lure it in. They explain this when they note they have 20m mana sense and geting in that close is basically impossible.

Again, what spells? Frieren specializes in useless magic, or magic that kills.

By taking Stille by surprise with the water and ice combo spells, once it was in movement they had no hopes of touching it.

They literally flatout say again, she COULD capture it that way again, but it's to strong and wouldn't restrain it.

I'll accept manga evidence for it, if there's any, then that's it, but anime calcs nope, especially when the knife isn't cutting both ways here and Konosuba isn't allowed anime feats.

Hey did you know Frieren uses a spell to snipe almost 17km in a moment, with a spell she notes as slow compared to Zoltrack?

There's so much shit way beyond supersonic in the verse, that the verse essentially tells us is supersonic at that so you can't even whip out a cop out "uhm calc only" argument.

And nobody gives a shit no offense. We use what's accepted, not what you want.

I forgot about this feat completely, it was in the time shenanigans arc if I recall, fair enough, it's indeed an insane feat leagues above multi-building level, still, not enough to leave a scratch on Aqua while she wears her divine relic.

You seem to forget a lot of shit my dude.

Just like how it took her at least a month ( if not months I don't recall right now ) literally sleeping over a lifetime of memories from Macht to develop a power null against his gold transmutation? Something that she also was only able to do because she had a prior experience with it, which took her a 100 years just to figure out how to nullify the gold out of her arm?

Yeah because it was a curse that used and worked on completely different foundations to any human science. She had to decipher essentially an entirely new science. Essentially the same as being told to decipher an entirely new form of alien metaphysics without even knowing the basics. The fact she only took like a month was considered baffling, Deken figured it'd take years and that was with the expectation of her being like one of the best on the planet at doing that shit.

Normal slop she just looks at and counters, she's done so before.

Only one of them - Aqua - has this power, Sacred Break Spell will nullify basically any spell Frieren has and Reflect will reflect basically anything back to Frieren,

Which can be dodged, blitzed, and Frieren herself has magic null too. She's also way more liable to do it from the getgo given she's exponentially smarter and analytical.

 

[FrenzyUND]

I dont care.

Cool, V5 Megumin is big country level then, Aqua scales above her:

Yeah because it was a curse that used and worked on completely different foundations to any human science. She had to decipher essentially an entirely new science. Essentially the same as being told to decipher an entirely new form of alien metaphysics without even knowing the basics. The fact she only took like a month was considered baffling, Deken figured it'd take years and that was with the expectation of her being like one of the best on the planet at doing that shit.

Ok, she took a month worth of a lifetime of memories, as well as 100 years to figure out something within the magic system of her own world, but a difference species, sure she'll nullify the magic from another series that don't exist in her own verse lol.

Meanwhile Aqua has actual quantifiable feats easily nullifying any type of magic from blasts of energy to fire to wind, to curses and everything else.

Which can be dodged, blitzed, and Frieren herself has magic null too. She's also way more liable to do it from the getgo given she's exponentially smarter and analytical.

Again, she has no feats to suggest she can nullify anything Aqua does, the opposite, however, is true. Frieren can use magic to fly, Aqua nullifies flight magic onscreen. Frieren shoots blasts of energy, Aqua reflects blasts of energy onscreen, Frieren shoots lightning or fire, Aqua's spells nullifies/reflects it back to the user onscreen, Frieren has a magical shield/barrier, Aqua onscreen nuliffies magical barriers/shields infinitely more durable...

Meanwhile I have to believe Frieren will nullify a horizon city level flood because in a 100 years she was able to learn how to turn her arm from gold to flesh, please, Aqua turns petrified statued monsters back to flash and bone with a single Break Spell, Frieren's "power null" is a joke next to Aqua's.

Let's put the speed behind us, yeah she can shoot supersonic+ Zooltrak, so what? What's her winning condition again? She can't leave a single scratch on Aqua. Her flight will be nullified by Break Spell, her shields will be nullified by Break Spell, and she will get one shotted by God Blow, God Requiem or Sacred Create Water.

 

[Enter_Bluey]

What would Frieren even copy anyway, party tricks? I guess Aqua has her buffs and water spells, God requiem and such but not really fitting to copy the latter of those. Plus, her water and holy spells come from her divinity as a Goddess and will be something she also hasn't seen, not sure if she could really recreate the "method" or techniques behind those like she would other forms of humanities magic really. Probably different for a normal spell like "create water", and similar stuff probably? Not like she has to in this case

Anyway, the equipment to protect her from damage is probably a real thing, but given the current profiles it's still a stat stomp since that is what this will go off of. Plus if we assume the mitigation comes from high defense, then a higher AP attack will damage her. Given Aqua probably is superior to Wolbach, it could probably help her tank explosion magic. But notice how I say "probably" a lot cause it's really just assuming stuff. Stuff that also isn't on the profiles and wouldn't qualify here.

So Frieren will dodge the sacred break spell and out range her likely in the air. Physical attacks last I remember are better against mages, but Aqua likely isn't getting them off. All buffs will do is make her superior in physical stats, which she already is. But it won't boost her to such a high combat speed like that. Aqua wouldn't resort to flooding either, or a powerful spell like that. As for the powernull, I think once Aqua realizes what it is she can set her defenses to stop it from affecting her, if it does. But the spells will also be blitzing her. Assuming she can tank some, she will then be bombarded with more, oh, and more after that if anyone was curious lol. Assuming she can tank displays of explosion like on the demon kings castle would be one thing, but that would in itself require a whole revision. Of Aqua, but also explosion since it got stronger from vol 8 to 17.

So Frieren will take this. Speed equal may be more interesting, but there's still some stat differences. But some spells that haven't been talked about like reflect, which let's her completely reflect attacks would come more into play too. In this case though? She's getting overwhelmed by attacks that will home in on her

 

[FrenzyUND]

What would Frieren even copy anyway, party tricks? I guess Aqua has her buffs and water spells, God requiem and such but not really fitting to copy the latter of those. Plus, her water and holy spells come from her divinity as a Goddess and will be something she also hasn't seen, not sure if she could really recreate the "method" or techniques behind those like she would other forms of humanities magic really. Probably different for a normal spell like "create water", and similar stuff probably? Not like she has to in this case

Anyway, the equipment to protect her from damage is probably a real thing, but given the current profiles it's still a stat stomp since that is what this will go off of. Plus if we assume the mitigation comes from high defense, then a higher AP attack will damage her. Given Aqua probably is superior to Wolbach, it could probably help her tank explosion magic. But notice how I say "probably" a lot cause it's really just assuming stuff. Stuff that also isn't on the profiles and wouldn't qualify here.

So Frieren will dodge the sacred break spell and out range her likely in the air. Physical attacks last I remember are better against mages, but Aqua likely isn't getting them off. All buffs will do is make her superior in physical stats, which she already is. But it won't boost her to such a high combat speed like that. Aqua wouldn't resort to flooding either, or a powerful spell like that. As for the powernull, I think once Aqua realizes what it is she can set her defenses to stop it from affecting her, if it does. But the spells will also be blitzing her. Assuming she can tank some, she will then be bombarded with more, oh, and more after that if anyone was curious lol. Assuming she can tank displays of explosion like on the demon kings castle would be one thing, but that would in itself require a whole revision. Of Aqua, but also explosion since it got stronger from vol 8 to 17.

So Frieren will take this. Speed equal may be more interesting, but there's still some stat differences. But some spells that haven't been talked about like reflect, which let's her completely reflect attacks would come more into play too. In this case though? She's getting overwhelmed by attacks that will home in on her

If we're gonna gatekeep the facts because of bureaucracy to upgrade the profiles, sure, Frieren wins.

If we're sticking to the facts, however, as shown before, from the author's own mouth, no attacks will leave a single scratch on Aqua as long as she's wearing the Divine Relic, and in Konosuba we have tons of stuff that are leagues more powerful than anything that exists in Frieren, up to multi country busting at the very least.

Speed? Mid-tier Konosuba character Viper with her time manipulation fighting style is fast enough to react and deflect with her bracelets ( like Wonder Woman does ) the bullets from hundreds of super soldiers shooting her with machine guns all at the same time, high tier Lilith can casually walk through WW3 no man's land deflecting every bullet comes her way with her tentacles. Can also react and defend herself from point blank explosions ( hypersonic feat ) and shoot hypersonic stuff too.

Low tier Gadalkand reacted and deflected a shotgun shell shot by surprise at pointblank, low tier Kazuma level Agent 6 blitzed this same Gadalkand to pieces with his limiters removed.

Konosuba has way better speed feats and scaling.

 

[Enter_Bluey]

If we're gonna gatekeep the facts because of bureaucracy to upgrade the profiles, sure, Frieren wins.

If we're sticking to the facts, however, as shown before, from the author's own mouth, no attacks will leave a single scratch on Aqua as long as she's wearing the Divine Relic, and in Konosuba we have tons of stuff that are leagues more powerful than anything that exists in Frieren, up to multi country busting at the very least.

Speed? Mid-tier Konosuba character Viper with her time manipulation fighting style is fast enough to react and deflect with her bracelets ( like Wonder Woman does ) the bullets from hundreds of super soldiers shooting her with machine guns all at the same time, high tier Lilith can casually walk through WW3 no man's land deflecting every bullet comes her way with her tentacles. Can also react and defend herself from point blank explosions ( hypersonic feat ) and shoot hypersonic stuff too.

Low tier Gadalkand reacted and deflected a shotgun shell shot by surprise at pointblank, low tier Kazuma level Agent 6 blitzed this same Gadalkand to pieces with his limiters removed.

Konosuba has way better speed feats and scaling.

I am all for seeing someone update konosuba with many things. Especially given how combatants is same universe and thus the feats correlate. Maybe they will be recognized at some point. I remember Vanir trolling the agent that visited them and all.

But yeah since it is an official fight between two characters these two will be gone off the profiles

 

[Chariot190]

Cool, V5 Megumin is big country level then, Aqua scales above her:

Legit just said I don't care, it ain't on the profile.
The profiles from my understanding are LN only.

Ok, she took a month worth of a lifetime of memories,

Already an exceptional feat. She parsed through 100 years time in a two months.


A fact that was expected to take her years even.

Frieren is a mage who, has info analysis so potent that in a world where there's numerous mages analyzing magic, deconstructing it, forming counters to it, and so forth, none at all could ever even pray to analyze this spell, and even when the dude factored in Frieren's own excellency at it, she was still way the hell beyond what he expected.

You act like this is a anti-feat when it's way better than instant glance infoanal the verse has.

as well as 100 years

As above. And 600 years ago Frieren, ain't current, she outright says she's grown exponentially at various points since times last past that.

to figure out something within the magic system of her own world, but a difference species,

Yes a different species that have been time and time again stated to be so widely different that even their very brains don't work on the same principles.

Deconstructing demon magic, let alone the most complex spell of their kind, is like telling a caveman to go build a functional high end rocket. In fact that was basically Solitar's analogy.

Despite, Frieren was able to construct a magic theory to dispel it, shit is like Iron Man inventing a new element. It taking awhile isn't a anti-feat, the fact she did it at all is insane.

sure she'll nullify the magic from another series that don't exist in her own verse lol.

Yeah? We have no reason to assume magic there functions and uses non-human principles and formulas.
The problem with demon shit is that it straight up isn't even compatible with the human mind. Legit alien babble.

Evidently, the magic Konusuba has, for the most part, aren't so baffingly alien that they can't be used by humans. The very fact Frieren can analyze stuff like Macht's magic that nobody ever managed to and they basically had to pick the "well **** us" option, is evidence enough. The fact she has figured out other magic on the fly just fine, is good enough as it is to say she could.

Meanwhile Aqua has actual quantifiable feats easily nullifying any type of magic from blasts of energy to fire to wind, to curses and everything else.

And so does she?

Again, she has no feats to suggest she can nullify anything Aqua does, the opposite, however, is true. Frieren can use magic to fly, Aqua nullifies flight magic onscreen. Frieren shoots blasts of energy, Aqua reflects blasts of energy onscreen, Frieren shoots lightning or fire, Aqua's spells nullifies/reflects it back to the user onscreen, Frieren has a magical shield/barrier, Aqua onscreen nuliffies magical barriers/shields infinitely more durable...

I'm legit convinced you didn't even read the profile.

• Power Nullification (Can cast a powerful Anti-Magic spell)

As stated on her profile.
Coupled with

• Information Analysis (Can decipher the mechanics behind magic instantly just by looking at it)

Unless we have good reason to believe she can't analyze Aqua's stuff, which mind you, we don't, she can, in fact, just see it and nullify Aqua's stuff as well. You're focused so much on Aqua's nullification, ignoring Frieren literally has the same stuff.

Why are you pretending otherwise? Because she didn't do so against Great Demon Magic that is hyped up to be so wild that it isn't even perceived as magic?

Aqua does not resist info analysis, Aqua does not resist power null, while on the contrary, Frieren can analyze Aqua's own magic that enables such things, form a counter spell, and nullify it at the same time.

Meanwhile I have to believe Frieren will nullify a horizon city level flood because in a 100 years she was able to learn how to turn her arm from gold to flesh, please.

It's more like she was able to decipher a counter to advanced inhuman formulas beyond standard comprehension.


This scene alone explains the gap well.
"The magicks of the Seven Sages of Destruction transcend intellect and reason. That is an unmistakable fact. There are biological differences in our bodies as well as the construction of our brains, so it is definitely magic that those people cannot handle".

You're conflating the super complex impossible to counter magic that is built upon formulas and logic from a mind that is straight up incompatible with a human brain, to magic that is evidently not the case.

Why is Aqua's magic void here? Is there qreason to believe it's so complex and incompatible with the human mind it can't be analyzed? No? Then Frieren can, of course, analyze it back and null it just fine.

As an aside, her dispel worked on El Dorado, while she was kms away, as well as the region around it covering whole mountain ranges into solid gold later into the fight as it spread toward the border.

As long as she understands how the magic works, it's a non-issue.

Let's put the speed behind us, yeah she can shoot supersonic+ Zooltrak, so what? What's her winning condition again?

Blitz into duraneg. Infoanal+Null of her own to negate Aqua's own counters, given Frieren's higher speed, she'd get it off first too.

She can't leave a single scratch on Aqua.

As above.

Her flight will be nullified by Break Spell,

It seems to be dodgeable.

her shields will be nullified by Break Spell,

Frieren herself has duraneg that has layered res bypassing.
Also as above.

and she will get one shotted by God Blow, God Requiem or Sacred Create Water.

She is literally like 20x quicker.

Let's give each of our combatants one day of prep.

And because OP gave Frieren a day of prep for some reason... She literally just walks up with complete nullification of Aqua's whole kit.


Hate to break it to you, but most of your arguments go against the profiles, or even just standards the wiki uses like infoanal against similar stuff. The only way you could argue her infoanal wouldn't work, is if we didn't bring verse equalization into this, but at that point Frieren just zaps Aqua with duraneg Zoltrack and calls it a day because her magic would be fundamentally different from the magic Aqua can null while also being layered so your whole argument is self-defeating. Obviously, we wouldn't do that, but just saying you can't have your cake and eat it too man. Also undermining and cherry picking feats like Frieren taking awhile to decipher El Dorado, ignoring the fact that's an exceptional case and the fact she even did it all is a feat, not an anti-feat, to argue she somehow has bad infoanal and null, is kinda wild.

 

[Dalesean027]

Agreed with chariot

 

[Bernkastelll]

Frieren FRA

 

[FrenzyUND]

Already an exceptional feat. She parsed through 100 years time in a two months.

We only need to find out now how this will be any useful against Aqua, which wouldn't.

The profiles from my understanding are LN only.

LN is already > anime in scaling.

Yes a different species that have been time and time again stated to be so widely different that even their very brains don't work on the same principles.

Then imagine how different a god from another completely different and unrelated media would be compared to Frieren.

Despite, Frieren was able to construct a magic theory to dispel it, shit is like Iron Man inventing a new element. It taking awhile isn't a anti-feat, the fact she did it at all is insane.

Meanwhile Aqua does the same thing in a single second with a single spell. Yeah impressive feat for Frieren in Frierenverse, not by Konosuba's standards, Aqua has an actual powerful power null she can use in battle, Frieren doesn't.

I'm legit convinced you didn't even read the profile.

I don't need to, I've done something more reliable and read the manga.

Power Nullification (Can cast a powerful Anti-Magic spell)

She can nullify a spell to control bodies, wow, I bet this will help her against Aqua.

• Information Analysis (Can decipher the mechanics behind magic instantly just by looking at it)

Wow, she realized the monster was redirecting magic, amazing, is this supposed to help her win here?

Unless we have good reason to believe she can't analyze Aqua's stuff, which mind you, we don't, she can, in fact, just see it and nullify Aqua's stuff as well.

No limits fallacy, Frieren has never nullified a wall of reflection that reflects spells back to the user, has never nullified a tsunami that covers the entire horizon and destroys cities, has never nulified magic-powered punches with super strength, nor has she nullified specific power nulls, so there's no reason to believe she can nullify anything against Aqua, plus have limited mana, is stated to burn lots of mana to nullify controlling bodies magic, and is overall helpless here.

Meanwhile we have actual Aqua power null feats that are billions of times better than Frieren's. Frieren takes 2 months analyzing thousands of years of memories of Macht using his gold transmutation + her previous knowledge about it, taking a 100 years to dispel it from her art, to turn humans from gold back to flash and bone. Meanwhile, Aqua, in a single second, says "Break Spell" and turns petrified monsters back to flash and bone.

Frieren shoots energy blasts, Aqua nullifies or reflects it on screen, Frieren shoots fire, Aqua does the same against fire on screen, Frieren shoots lightning, Aqua does the same against lightning on screen, Frieren flies with magic, Aqua dispels it on screen, Frieren uses magical shields, Aqua nullifies magical shields billions of times more powerful on screen.

To even pretend Frieren's power null compares to Aqua's or to suggest she can nullify anything Aqua does is a big joke.

Why are you pretending otherwise? Because she didn't do so against Great Demon Magic that is hyped up to be so wild that it isn't even perceived as magic?

Again, Aqua has a much better feat against the same stuff lol.

Why is Aqua's magic void here? Is there qreason to believe it's so complex and incompatible with the human mind it can't be analyzed?

Yes.

Then Frieren can, of course, analyze it back and null it just fine.

No limits fallacy.

She can only nullify what she was shown to be able to, nothing more, nothing else, she can't nullify a galaxy busting explosion just because it's a simple explosion that is easy to understand, seriously, is NLF the best argument here?

Aqua does not resist info analysis

She doesn't, indeed, Frieren will analysis her and realize she's getting one shotted, then admit she can't comprehend and visualize a way she'd ever win.

Aqua does not resist power null,

She does. Does Frieren though? Any feats resisting any power null Aqua has ever displayed? Guess not.

It's more like she was able to decipher a counter to advanced inhuman formulas beyond standard comprehension.

Unquantifiable, just because she did that, doesn't mean she can do the same to Sacred Create Water, 2 unrelated stuff from unrelated magic systems from unrelated universes. Just NLF on your part.

In-Universe she struggles so much with curses because Demons are monsters with a different mentality than humans, elves and others, never mind trying to do anything to a God from another Universe, not that it matters anything, unless she has the feats, she can't do it, she either has feats nullifying a city level tsunami or she doesn't.

As long as she understands how the magic works, it's a non-issue.

Again, NLF.

Blitz into duraneg. Infoanal+Null of her own to negate Aqua's own counters, given Frieren's higher speed, she'd get it off first too.

She has no duraneg that affects Aqua lol, can't negate anything Aqua counters her by feats, and she doesn't have any higher speed.

It seems to be dodgeable.

Very unlikely, especially when Frieren is slow while flying.

Frieren herself has duraneg that has layered res bypassing.
Also as above.

Which duraneg is that again? Nothing on her arsenal can affect Aqua. In fact if I were to use your own NLF logic I'd say nothing in Frieren comes even close to compare to the duraneg that Aqua can resist, therefore nothing Frieren does will affect her. Aqua can resist any types of instant-death spells, time stop, bursting in flames from the inside, petrification, curse, sleep, paralysis, death curses, soul manipulation, level drain, mana drain, stamina drain, phasing, teleportation, healing, curse that reflects any damage back to the attacker, and multiple other things.

Zooltrak wouldn't even scratch Aqua even if it connects, though it wouldn't, it'd be deflected back to Frieren's face with Reflect or nullified with Break Spell.

She is literally like 20x quicker.

She's much slower, she has no feats to compare to Konosuba's speed feats, as shown already.

And because OP gave Frieren a day of prep for some reason... She literally just walks up with complete nullification of Aqua's whole kit.

NLF.

but at that point Frieren just zaps Aqua with duraneg Zoltrack

Can't even scratch her. Wait, are we equalizing the verses magic system? Then it's a bigger stomp for Aqua. How the hell you can even argue that Zooltrak will kill her when claiming to be an equalized discussion? How the hell does Zooltrak compares in the slightest to all of the Konosuba's infinitely superior duranegs?

her magic would be fundamentally different from the magic Aqua can null while also being layered so your whole argument is self-defeating.

It doesn't matter, first Zooltrak doesn't have an instant-death effect, it's just effective to kill/destroy, as offensive magic and demon-killing magic, but it can be tanked with raw durability, it won't even scratch Aqua and she has resistance to actual infinitely superior duranegs of all types, plus Reflect literally creates a "mirror" shield in front of her that reflects the attack.

ut just saying you can't have your cake and eat it too man.

I'm talking about Aqua nullifying Frieren shooting lightning or fire because she has done that on screen, you've talking about her nullifying things that don't exist in Frieren's verse, that she has never done, one if NLF, the other is literally the most basic vs battle argument, if my character has shown a feat to nullify fire and lighting on screen, then if your character shoots it, it can be nullified.