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Fate Revision Thread

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The problem is that everyone is already scaled to At least 7-B for defensively fighting Heracles. Which makes the scaling look wonky as they are over 7 times weaker yet can still deflect blows from Servants like him. The Servants that are At least 7-B should at least be 7-B+ with the stronger ones like Cu being 7-A. It would still be more consistent as Herc would be still be over 4 times stronger making it more plausible for them to be able to defensively fight him. Also Diarmuid wouldn't be 6 times stronger than Servants like Cu.
 
Ramesses the Sun King said:
The Servants that are At least 7-B should at least be 7-B+ with the stronger ones like Cu being 7-A.
Click to expand...
That sounds way better. Previously it sounded like you wanted to make everyone 7-A.

I'm okay with this new reasoning.
 
By the way, when we inevitably make a profile for Servant Shiki, where should we rate her at?

Assassin Shiki canonically helps you take down powerful Servants like Lancetoria Alter and Lu Bu.
 
I won't be able to help with the revision until Friday.

@Reppu Well considering she is fighting with Mashu and Meph she should probably just be 7-B+.
 
Do we really need Assassin/Saber Shiki profile?

If we go by feats, Shiki (or should i say Assassin Shiki) Killed 99 servants in Fate/Extra, so yeah, that's something.
 
@KamiYasha

I mean, Assassin Shiki and Saber Shiki have their own feats (i.e. Assassin Shiki helped take down Lancetoria Alter with Mashu's help, while Saber Shiki cut down several wraiths that scared Mephistopheles so badly that he compared them to Primate Murder, albeit cheap weaklings by comparison).

Unless you want to make them tabs on Shiki's profile.
 
Okay so I have some problems with Brahmastra being 6-B again.

It's creating some scaling issues. Balmung blasts could offset it which would put Balmung in the Low 6-B range, and Clarent Blood Arthur is comparable. So by scaling Clarent and Balmung>>>Galatine and Excalibur. Additionally Karna also tanked a Balmung blast with his armor and flames which would be ridiculous if it was low 6-B.

America also portrayed Gae Bolg as more powerful and if we scale that to 6-B as well it becomes we get more problems, as Karna barely survived it. There also wasn't any mention that Arjuna could nuke America.

If Brahmastra was at 6-C instead it would be more consistent with the scaling. Balmung offsetting it would place it in the High 7-A range putting it in the same area as other holy swords. Gae Bolg would be 6-C which would be plausible for Karna to survive since he already managed to tank a Balmung blast with his flames and armor.

I also don't think we should go from 6-C to 6-B just because he can one shot Jeanne and from his Anti-Country rating. Since Anti-Country seems to mainly be for range going from Stella and the Dynamics of an Asteroid's description.
 
@Ram

This has been bugging me for a while now too.

Balmung is also supposed to be a step down from Gram, which easily OHKO'd Caliburn.

I'm still not sure what to do with the whole Anti-Country ratings though, but I would not be heavily against these changes.
 
@Reppu

That further supports High 7-A Balmung and 6-C Gae Bolg and Brahmastra.

I'm also not sure what to do with Anti-Country ratings but it's likely better to not keep a bunch of scaling issues because of it.
 
@Ram

This would also affect Ozymandias, whose Dendera Electric bulb is scaled from the fact that it needed Excalibur Proto and a Triple Command Seal backed Stella to beat. Lion King Arturia's Rhon is also scaled from this.

Stella has a maximum range of 2500 km, tearing apart two factions to form Iran's border line.

Thoughts on this?
 
@Reppu

Dendera should be fine at its current tier with being compared to a solar flare and being able to vaporise tokyo in one shot which can be further strengthened. Rhon is comparable if not stronger and Stella offset Rhon so I think Stella can keep the tier.
 
I'm fine with those then.

Kind of want Kami's and Prom's opinion on this before we do anything though.
 
I'm fine with changing the Anti-Country stuff.
 
So to sum things up:

1) Balmung and Clarent Blood Arthur get bumped up to Large Mountain level.

2) Brahmastras and Pashupata get bumped down to Island level.

3) Gae Bolg Alternative and Gae Bolg: Gouging Spear of Carnage get bumped up to Island level.

Everyone okay with this?

Also, what should we do about Merlin stopping Gae Bolg?
 
Something also just came to me.

Balmung is a step down from Gram, Excalibur's equal.

Wouldn't this bump Excalibur up to Island level as well?

This would also affect anything scaled from Excalibur, like Bellerophon, Lord Chaldeas, and Merodach.
 
Merlin gets Island level durability with Magecraft. Scales to Solomon and that's about it.

Upgrading Excalibur to 6-C now would bump a lot of things to 6-C which I'm not 100% comfortable with right now.
 
Aren't there 6-C Excalibur calcs? It'd just be fullpower Excalibur
 
6-C Excalibur would upgrade Photon Ray, Lord Chaldeas, Merodach, Jewel Sword Zelretch and some others to 6-C.

Rider under Sakura would get High 7-A Bellerophon and other powerful A+ Noble Phantasms such as Mesektet and Galatine would also be High 7-A.

I guess I can live with that.
 
This is propably me not really knowing the material that well yet, but...

Where exactly is the Difference between Excalibur and Excalibur Proto? I mean, Proto-Cu has the same Gae Bolg as FSN Cu, or? Should that not go for Saber as well?
 
@Heiler

Different Servants, different Noble Phantasms.

Excalibur Proto is explicitly restricted by the Thirteen Restraints of the Round Table to prevent the possibility of Arthur abusing its power. Each restraint is locked with a code provided by one of the Knights of the Round such as "The battle must be honorable" and "The battle must be to save the world". With one restraint release it's a fairly small beam, but still equivalent to an Anti-Army Noble Phantasm and overloaded Paracelsus' A+ Anti-Army Noble Phantasm. With over half the restraints released, it's supposed to gain enough power to put down Beast VI and destroy things that can threaten the entire Earth.

Mainstream Excalibur doesn't have the same restraints but its feats are usually lower than Excalibur Proto's. It is thought to possess similar power, since Arturia says in her F/GO interlude that she has never unleashed its full strength before (correct me on this if necessary, I haven't played through it myself). It was also responsible for killing Sefar in the past.
 
Those restraints I think are the only real explanation for how it was able to actually slay Sefar.

Also, I'm unsure that it's really accurate that Ozy and Lancer Artoria are that much more powerful than Karna and Arjuna with their NPs. Although, "Anti-Country" seems fairly ambiguous in and of itself.
 
I also wanted to bring up another Servant scaling topic.

IT's a little weird that Archer and Assassin, who have really low Strength ratings, can deflect blows from Berserker with their current stat ratings. I was thinking of putting a + on their AP and Durability, but what do you guys think?
 
The City level characters should all be City level+, yeah.
 
@Iapitus

Yeah, but this basically affects every combat ready Servant.

The particularly strong Servants like Karna and Heracles should probably get an At least 7-A as well.
 
Yeah I've thought about that for a while. Unless you are someone like Mata Hari (far lower) or Achilles (Far Far Higher with his Shield), every servant can engage in physical combat with another. On top of that, no servant can one shot another outside of hax. So I agree, but with standard deviation of course
 
We already agreed that basically all Servants are going to be at least 7-B+. We just never started the upgrades.

Karna and Heracles should be plain 7-A with no at least.

@Iapitus What? Strong Servants like Heracles can one shot Servants that are weaker. Saber under Shirou needed all her might to deflect blows and would have died against any direct hit.
 
Since most of us agree on the Anti-Country stuff can I go ahead and upgrade Gae Bolg and downgrade Brahmastras and Pashupata?

We can still discuss the High 7-A and 6-C stuff but I want to fix the 6-B things first.
 
Cu Alter's page says Mash blocked a Brahmastra. Shouldn't her durability with Lord Chaldeas be changed if that's the case? I'm not up to date since I don't play FGO anymore. ******* gacha
 
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