Personally I think it's both rather than just one or the other
Probably bad wording on my part but the idea is that I don't see why we assume he didn't stop both the stars and the Starbeasts. All evidences we have indicate he affected both, with the stars being his primary objective and the Starbeasts being secondary.
Radahn wanted to emulate Godfrey, that's it, nothing suggests he was even remotely loyal to the Golden Order especially after the Shattering. Morgott was the one true faithful demigod devoted to the Greater Will.
Except Radahn's idol wasn't his father but Godfrey
Afaik there's no real indication that he hated Radagon and was shown to follow in his footsteps as being a major component in the Golden Order. He even parades his red hair because he is proud of his dad's legacy.
Radahn was the one who chased Godrick off when he tried to lay siege to Leyndell. There's also an item description of his helmet that implies that he admired and respected Radagon.
He clearly thought of Radagon as a "Champion" of the Golden Order and says as much, he also liked his red hair because it was reminiscent of the heroic actions of his father. IMO, this lends itself to the idea that even if Radahn wasn't specifically loyal to the Greater Will and the Golden Order, he at least respected and admired Radagon enough not to go against them.
Me and I'm not sure it's acausality, Blaidd has something similar and a lot of extra unique dialogue for it too.
Pretty much what I think to, all we know about Radahn describes him as a fanboy of Godfrey and it's heavily implied he did everything he did just to gain a reputation as a great conqueror
Tbf it's also likely he did si to get rid of a contester. He still had respect for Radagon, then again it didn't stop him from trying to attempt invasion as well and Morgott clearly resents him and deems him as a traitor (though much less than Rykard)
While that post does discount Radahn saving Sella, it still backs the previous point about Stars and Starbeasts being different things considering he stops one but not the other.
That very well could be true about Godrick, though I still think his invasion could be chalked up too "Radagon and Merika are missing, the country to going to hell, and everyone is killing everyone else. Might as well."
Yeah you've made a solid argument, as of now I can't really think or find anything to refute you so you've convinced me. It just seems really difficult and kind of a reach to use an argument like that in a debate, which is why I guess he has "possibly 4-C" instead of just outright being tier 4.
It's not like there was a good solution to this mess anyway. And aside from Miquella, Radahn was definitely among the best choices. Morgott could have been great if he wasn't...well, like he is
Why do people hate Omens again? Is just because they have Horns?
Because they're omens for bad things to come, when one is born something bad will happen sooner or later, hence the name.
Figured as much. So they're like Absol from pokemon but as people.
Omens are born without the grace of the Erdtree and won't join it when they die. So they're living heresies in the modern age of the game world.
Ah, so Racism straight from an Outer God. Isn't that fun?
It's never explicitly stated and the timeline seems really funky. It never seemed like Radahn and Malenia's fight was that long ago but then again you have Millicent and her sisters who appear like fullgrown adults. Godrick tried to lay siege to Leyndell but was ran off by Radahn and it seems like he's been stuck in Stormveil forever. You're probably right about Sellen, though I don't know if she was expelled from the Carian academy before or after the shattering since I haven't found any explicit evidence of when that happened.
TBH, I get the feeling Miyazaki didn't really bothered thinking about the actual years of how long the events happened.
It's like that with pretty much every Souls title as well. Gwyn linking the Flame, The Fog and subsequent Demons invading Boletaria, The Healing Church creating and using Blood Healing, etc... The only recent Fromsoft game I can think of with a somewhat concise timeline is Sekiro simply for the fact that the game takes place in a fictionalized Japan in the Sengoku period and most of the main characters are still alive and active during the game.
Because they're proof there was something before the Edtree and that all lives don't originate from the Greater Will, something the Outer God is definitely not willing to accept. Same situation than for the Albinaurics. It's basically propaganda and a mean to establish the Greater Will as the capital G God and the origin of all lives, something that obviously is impossible if people acknowledge there was something there before. You don't come from the Edtree, you're corrupted, evil and worthless, simple as that.
Millicent was possibly outright born the way she is now, Gowry says he raised her but judging by their respective personnality, it's likely he simply raised her in the sense he educated her.
I doubt it? He may have had other methods of kidnapping Miquella such as sending his minions to do it for him. Plus if Mohg did just came through Elphael and fought the haligtree forces on his own, I'm pretty sure the Haligtree and Malenia would've been alerted to who kidnapped Miquella.
Well he seems pretty okay with fighting the Tarnished as soon as they walk into the temple. His strikes are wild and unfocused but you also note that he still shows some good skills at fighting and he was raising an entire army with the clear intention to attack anyone once he'll be ready to establish his dynasty so while he's definitely not a master fighter like Malenia, Radahn or Morgott, he's still clearly ready to fight. Though that doesn't mean he wouldn't use other ways.
Malenia obliterated Godrick because he insulted her but also because he was Godrick. Malenia was pride but not pride to the point of attacking whoever defies her or had a reputation for being strong, she even gracefully notes the Tarnished's strength after her defeat. Her primary objective was to help and protect Miquella, so abandonning her brother like that simply for a challenge or to repair an insult seems like a bit to out of character for her.
I would agree with that but nothing related to the stars is mentionned for them. Ranni is also a special case since she's linked to the Carians and the Academy, which are very closely related to stars, plus she wants to use the power of an Outer God to usher in a new age whereas Miquella had found a way to ward off the influence of Outer Gods by himself without the need to call upon another deity to help him.
The opening cutscene cutscene shows him personally carrying Malenia away the same way we see Morgott defeating early Radahn so it was definitely him doing the deed, plus I don't see why he would confide such important task for his plans to a minion. Though, he probably didn't fight and just sneaked his way through
Mohg has also been cooped up underground for who knows how long, he likely isn't privy to the immediate happenings and instead is just waiting for Miquella to hatch from the cocoon. He probably has no idea there is a specific Tarnished out there who'd been killing Demigods, on top of that it's not like he has a choice anyway. He sees a warrior invade his palace where he's keeping Miquella, he kinda has to defend it.
The line of dialogue also seems to indicate she's hopeful that he would keep his promise and return to the Haligtree and cure her Scarlet Rot and free them from the influence of the Greater Will. She also talks about how he is the most fearsome Empyrean and his abilities and wisdom. To me, this means that she more than likely has no idea where he is and instead is hoping that whatever happened, he's able to find his way out of it and return to her.
Elphael is very well defended. Not only is it at the Northernmost point of the map where you have to use the Grand Lift of Rold to access it as well as an evergaol puzzle at Ordina Liturgical Town, but the area itself is also heavily defended by a large group of Haligtree and Cleanrot Knights as well as Loretta, Revenants, and a Putried Tree Avatar. I don't think it's unreasonable to assume that Miquella was still well defended, even if she wasn't there.
Most descriptions of the Stars do directly talk about the Carians, but there are also item descriptions and dialogue dictating that they rule the fate of the Gods as well.
True
Morgott took part in both battles since he was personnally leading Leyndell's defense but the only moment known where he directly fought was to repel Radahn. The monument says he's been pilling up corpses, which would simply indicate he gathered the corpses of his soldiers during the battle or a metaphorical way to say he basically obliterated Godfrey to the point he created piles of dead corpses from the Grafted's army.
Malenia waiting for him doesn't contradict the possibility that she came to Caelid because she thought he was here. The blooming left her so weak she had to be transported all the way back to Elphael by a third party (Finlay) otherwise she would have been dead on the spot, especially if Radahn was already starting to become feral, and she more or less stayed comatose after that. She's been waiting for a long time when we reach her. It seems she didn't exactly know where Miquella exactly was in Caelid but had somehow tracked him down to the place and then the Battle of Aeonia plus the hit to her pride (since she spent all her life restraining the Rot and hated her power) simply put her out of commition to the point of prompting her to wait for Miquella's return after the battle. And again, unless we say Malenia is such a thrill seeking warrior she wanted a challenge for fun to the point of leaving her frail brother who was the only one capable of curing her, which isn't indicate in the lore at all, it seems to be the only logical reason for why she go that far.
It's not really about defense and more about feelings. Malenia has been at Miquella's side since the beginning, she loves him and would do anything to protect him. Very well defended or not, he's still a child unable to fight physically and as Mohg (and really the Tarnished) proved, Elphael is not unpenetrable and can be put in danger by someone sufficiently crafty or powerful. The best way to protect him was to stay at his side, not to mention she needed to stay with himto support his attempts to cure her from the Scarlet Rot.
The Haligtree was a failrue because it needed Miquella to power it and when Mohg abducted him, everything went to shit, it was perfectly working before. And no, Miquella and Malenia weren't completely free from the GW but they still openly opposed it with their plan and nothing came to stop them. The plan only failed because Mohg came to kidnap Miquella for his own project, something neither Malenia or Miquella was expecting.
Except that it was Radahn who fought Godrick and ran him off to Stormveil. It wouldn't really make sense for Radahn to defend a city he already tried and failed to conquer. Especially if you consider that if that were the case, Morgott would still be there and Radahn wouldn't need or probably even want to help him in any way.
So far, no one had even attempted to invade or attack the Haligtree, there was no reason to think that Miquella would really even need Malenia to defend him because there was no need to at the time. This is especially so if Miquella sent Malenia to kill Radahn in order to stop him from keeping the Stars halted.
Yes, and the Haligtree was not fully grown yet meaning they had yet to free themselves from the Greater Will. The only way they could have done so was if the Haligtree had become an Erdtree which it had yet to do when Mohg kidnapped Miquella.
Yes but the point was that Morgott directly took the field only once and saying he did for Godrick means he thought it was necessary to personnally intervene for a pathetic excuse of a demigod with poor strategic skills, which makes no sense. So if he was personnally involved in the First Siege above the Second, then the first was from Radahn.
Nothing says she didn't at least got some informations or knew something that led her to . Again, she went from the Haligtree to Caelid, which are completely opposite to each other in the map, and fought Radahn in a location that is exactly above the very specific place where Miquella is. This is way too significant to just be a coincidence, especially with Fromsoftware where every little tiny item tells a story, so obviously something as glaring as this has to be significant. And literally nothing in the game supports the idea that Malenia is a thrill seeker blood knight seeking challenge just cause why not. In fact, this description actually fits Radahn himself, Malenia for her part is simply devoted to her brother, to the point she followed him in his plot for the Haligtree, defying the GW, and didn't care about glory. All she cared about was 1) protecting her brother and 2) restraining the Scarlet Rot. And again, this is more about feelings than defense. Malenia and Miquella are clearly extremely close, with statues of them depicting embracing each other, she's utterly devoted to him to the point she abandonned her shot at succeeding Marika to follow him and let him lead his own land. Putting the two and two together, with all we know about Malenia as a character, her devotion to Miquella, her lack of interest in glory including from battle, the location of Mohgwhyn and the Swamp and Miquella being exactly under the very specific spot where Malenia and Radahn fought, Malenia having somehow accessed some clues about Miquella being near Caelid is literally the ONLY logical reason for why she would do all of this.
Yes, and? Miquella still had the means to make it happen, all he needed was time to power the Haligtree. That's why Mohg kidnapping him throws everything into shit, the Haligtree needs Miquella to grow, and it's not something that can be done easily. As for the Greater Will, its influence is limited to their chosen champion and the Two Fingers. Marika was too busy plotting the Shattering and getting tortured by the Elden Beast and Malenia and Miquella don't seem to have a specific set of Two Fingers, which are the only one aside from Marika who can directly interfere with the life of people.
I think you're a bit confused, the second siege is the one Morgott defended and the one I'm saying Radahn initiated. Radahn defended Leyndell from Godrick in the first siege.
I'm not saying she fought Radahn for the hell of it, I'm saying that there are multiple factors at play in her decision making.
Except that there is no way for her to get to Moghwyn Palace in Caelid, the only ways that we are able to get to Moghwyn Palace is through a gateway teleporter in the Consecrated Snowfield, which Malenia would have had to pass by in order to get to Caelid. On top of that no one knows where Mogh is, not
Miquella doesn't really have characterization, everything we learn about him is through item descriptions and character dialogue. Yes he was kind and open-minded, but that doesn't mean he didn't use military might when necessary. Seeing as how the stars decided everyone's fate and Radahn controlled the stars, I don't see anyone else capable of defeating Radahn that Miquella could send, it was Melania or no one.
Two Fingers or not, the Greater Will still apparently has a power over Emyreans, Two Fingers just seem to make it easier to directly manipulate one. Also it isnt just themselves that Miquella wishes to free from the Greater Will, but the outside world. This is why Miquella wanted to create the Haligtree, to serve as a vessel similar to the Erdtree but outside the control of an Outer God.
