Dream Stone Re-Upgrade CRT

[CloverDragon03]

For reference the total for real world entities was like ~4000, counting dream worlds stuff it ranged from 9000-26813 dreams.

I don't think Dream World stuff would qualify, it'd just be what's on Pi'illo Island

 

[Foxthefox1000]

Feel like we'd need a comprehensive blog or something going over all of them in that case, because people may not trust you by your word.

 

[CloverDragon03]

If the upgrade goes through and we reach a consensus on what number of universes to use, I can draft a blog (It basically just needs to highlight the number of universes and why it's that number, right? If it's more than that though you may wanna get someone more knowledgeable on the verse)

 

[JJSliderman]

Feel like we'd need a comprehensive blog or something going over all of them in that case, because people may not trust you by your word.

I could post my notes, although they are somewhat disjointed.

 

[Foxthefox1000]

Well we'd have to show exactly how many NPCs were logically affected which could be time-consuming.

 

[Foxthefox1000]

We could use this as a reference and just say that Dream enemies and the bosses probably wouldn't count as a start. This is probably the easiest start.

 

[Firestorm808]

Idk where he got at least 52 from, we have a calculated value that comes out to 292,200,000 universes

That is a stark difference. I would assume this calculated value was accepted by staff?

 

[CloverDragon03]

That is a stark difference. I would assume this calculated value was accepted by staff?

I'm actually gonna put a moratorium on that real quick because we're currently discussing what the actual number might be. Seems like it'll be more in the thousands to tens of thousands atm

 

[Firestorm808]

I'm actually gonna put a moratorium on that real quick because we're currently discussing what the actual number might be. Seems like it'll be more in the thousands to tens of thousands atm

I see. Can you link to this calc. I'm curious about the methodology.

 

[CloverDragon03]

I see. Can you link to this calc. I'm curious about the methodology.

Tbh I don't think that's what the past calc was, I think we were scaling it to the Dream Depot which has countless dreams. The calc for 292,200,000 universes was done in this thread on the first page, but I'm really not in agreement with it anymore because of the context of the story.

 

[Omnificence]

Alright gotcha

Now we just need more mod input

Just spoke to LordGriffin here and he agrees with the OP.

 

[QrowBarr]

Don't really have staff voting power but I was asked to give input here. I think lower degree of 2-B also makes sense

 

[Foxthefox1000]

So that's 18 I think with 3 mod votes

 

[CloverDragon03]

We should preferably start drafting how many universes this will scale to

 

[Foxthefox1000]

Honestly I'd prefer just using the real world smallest island equivalent cause trying to count the NPCs could have some margin of error.

 

[Omnificence]

We should preferably start drafting how many universes this will scale to

Honestly I'd prefer just using the real world smallest island equivalent cause trying to count the NPCs could have some margin of error.

Okay, so run me through this one more time...

Whose dreams did the Dream Stone contain again?

 

[Dust_Collector]

So at this point tier 2 is accepted it's just a matter of finding how many universes the stone scales to right?

 

[CloverDragon03]

Given the need for the Dream Stone to be charged up with people’s dreams via the Dreambeats, we should use the population of Pi’illo Island as the number of dreams. Using the population of the island with the smallest population, this comes out to 100,000

 

[JJSliderman]

100 K seems too high, I counted less than 10000 when considering both NPCs and enemies in the real world segments.

 

[CloverDragon03]

100 K seems too high, I counted less than 10000 when considering both NPCs and enemies in the real world segments.

Counting NPCs and all that leaves room for error and doesn’t account for any residents we may have just not seen

Nothing suggests it’s “too high”

 

[JJSliderman]

There are like what, 6-7 major areas on the island? It’s not exactly a high end population.

 

[CloverDragon03]

There are like what, 6-7 major areas on the island? It’s not exactly a high end population.

Why do you think I used the island with the smallest population?

 

[Foxthefox1000]

Counting every NPC is a very low end. We can just use the real world island example as a high end I guess.

 

[Omnificence]

Counting every NPC is a very low end. We can just use the real world island example as a high end I guess.

Yeah, that should work.

 

[AStrangeverse]

so, if I'm understanding

those who scale to/above the Dream/Nightmare Stones are a countable amount into 2-B

and those who scale to/above the Chaos/Pure Hearts are a countless amount into 2-B?

 

[CloverDragon03]

so, if I'm understanding

those who scale to/above the Dream Stone are a countable amount into 2-B

and those who scale to/above the Chaos/Pure Hearts are a countless amount into 2-B?

Essentially, yes

 

[AStrangeverse]

Essentially, yes

ah ok

 

[Foxthefox1000]

The Void and the Hearts are always going to be the God Tiers of the franchise that directly scale to the cosmology unless something new comes that's explicitly stated to be the same level of threat or scales above them, but I doubt that's going to happen.

The cosmology is easily Multiversal so the best shot of downgraded them would be to argue the Multiverse isn't made of countless universes but I'm not sure how strong that argument would be given all the evidence to suggest otherwise.

 

[JJSliderman]

Well an argument could be made the Void doesn’t really scale to anything outside the Paper Mario cosmology, since no even knew about the events in that world before Paper Jam.

 

[CloverDragon03]

Well an argument could be made the Void doesn’t really scale to anything outside the Paper Mario cosmology, since no even knew about the events in that world before Paper Jam.

Let's not derail with further discussion about the Void. This is about the Dream Stone

 

[Foxthefox1000]

Well an argument could be made the Void doesn’t really scale to anything outside the Paper Mario cosmology, since no even knew about the events in that world before Paper Jam.

A bad argument. But yeah, that's not for this thread.

 

[Shmeatywerbenmanjenson]

Idk where he got at least 52 from, we have a calculated value that comes out to 292,200,000 universes

A wanked calc value

You should try the suggestion I made or actually compare it to real world civilization times for a more conservative answer

Edit: Seems I was ninja'd as I neglected to read the second page

I'm fine with the island scaling

 

[Mephistus]

I don't think it's that hard to count the npcs? Obviously it's hitting over 1000. Prefer that vs arbitrary one end using an irl island

 

[Omnificence]

I don't think it's that hard to count the npcs? Obviously it's hitting over 1000. Prefer that vs arbitrary one end using an irl island

That should work as well.

 

[Foxthefox1000]

We'd need to verify that count though. If someone can do that, then sure.

 

[Omnificence]

We'd need to verify that count though. If someone can do that, then sure.

Well, how many NPCs are there?

 

[ZespeonGalaxy]

Theres 47 characters in dream team, not that its the number we are probably looking or hoping for bur surely thats not including every npc.

 

[JJSliderman]

I definitely counted more than that, it was around 4000 post-Dreambeats and probably closer to 5000 counting stuff before then.

 

[ZespeonGalaxy]

I definitely counted more than that, it was around 4000 post-Dreambeats and probably closer to 5000 counting stuff before then.

May i know the counting process or how its done?

 

[JJSliderman]

I went to each area in the game and counted every unique NPC I saw, every enemy I defeated, even stuff like the Bob-ombs in Neo Bowser castle.