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Dragon Ball Super Discussion Thread 34

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Shouldn't Belmod get a profile and get a 3-A rating since he scales off of Toppo and Jiren? I don't think Belmod is weaker than them, especially since he considers Toppo a GoD candidate because of his strength.
 
One random question. IF Dragon Ball Super ends in away similar to Z and everything reconned so far is back to normal ...will GT characters be Universal level? :D
 
If 17 becomes SSB level this episode, it means 17 has surpassed all these characters (each much, much stronger than the previous) just by training in the woods

17 < Super Perfect Cell < Fat Buu < Buuhan < SSJ Vegito < SSG God Goku

Although this is nowhere as big asspull as Super Trunks, which was an abomination. 17 actually got 10 years to train
 
Just watched latest episode, i don't know about SSB powerscaling, but he beat the living shit out of regular Super Saiyan Goku.
 
So apparently 17 said you can do that transformation too. When goku went ssjb. So was he talking about the fact he can't sense ki from goku or something else?
 
Huesito88 said:
So apparently 17 said you can do that transformation too. When goku went ssjb. So was he talking about the fact he can't sense like either from goku or something else?
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I don't know, but he might just be making an observation, something like "You can become SSJ and now SSJB too? How quaint..."
 
Gr8Gr3yM said:
Just watched latest episode, i don't know about SSB powerscaling, but he beat the living shit out of regular Super Saiyan Goku.
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You can't powerscale in Super when SSB fluctuates from 3-A to 5-B all the time. Powerscaling is mostly dead unless it's for guys like Hit or Jiren
 
Someone else noticed that, dende can move the lookout of kami iso would be telekinesis or some ability to be a kami sama
 
This is the problem when you try and bring old weak characters back into the series when the current ones gained new found power beyond anything before.

Anyway I think 17 can get 4-B for fighting SSJ Goku but their is no way in hell he gained 3-A power by training, even Goku nor Vegeta could pull that of without a new transformation, Frieza being a OP prodigy with a new transformation and plot, Trunks needed a plot induced rage boots so yeah 4-B 17 I can believe that but 3-A no way
 
Joseph619 escreveu:
RadicalMrR escreveu:
Aparentemente, ambos se seguraram.
Faz você se perguntar por que 17 estava completamente ausente na batalha de arco de deuses, uma vez que ele se prende contra a atual SSB Goku. Ah bem
Goku obviously did not use all his power in these recruiting episodes, until in none of them did he get tired
 
Sooooooo....... Toei is messing up with power levels again? Can't blame all it to them. Toriyama himself is very forgettable sometimes and might have messed up himself.
 
LordGriffin1000 said:
This is the problem when you try and bring old weak characters back into the series when the current ones gained new found power beyond anything before.
Anyway I think 17 can get 4-B for fighting SSJ Goku but their is no way in hell he gained 3-A power by training, even Goku nor Vegeta could pull that of without a new transformation, Frieza being a OP prodigy with a new transformation and plot, Trunks needed a plot induced rage boots so yeah 4-B 17 I can believe that but 3-A no way
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Good luck with that. Super creators don't care about logic, if they want to make 17 3-A they will. Just like with Trunks
 
Hit The Badass said:
Sooooooo....... Toei is messing up with power levels again? Can't blame all it to them. Toriyama himself is very forgettable sometimes and might have messed up himself.
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Hold on, Yammer might be forgetful, but he never messed up this much. Also, this seems to be a toei only thing. One more thing- if Toyotaro doesnt make this mess in the manga, it implies the power scale mess up was on toei's behalf, since yama is working closely with toyotaro, and if toyotaro doesnt make the mistake and toei does, then the mistake originated from toei and not yammer.
 
Toei has the most garbage writing, and their logic is nonexistent, I wish there was a way for Toriyama to switch from Toei to Madhouse, much better animation too.
 
This is the problem with Toeis Super. If this had been some random alien goku went ssb to fight we wouldn't even question the alien being 3-a as PIS. But since it's 17 we get a bit more context.

Unfortunately the writing/powerscaling of fights is so bad it makes it hard to enjoy.

Time to face the truth people. Toei just writes whatever makes the fights look cool and the plot/powerscaling is just collateral damage. We will soon see Goku use SSB to fight bank robbers next.
 
I am more accepting of Android 17 new power, i think the problems that apply to Kuririn, and maybe Trunks do not to artificial humans, those two matter because we have seen a substantial amount of evidence indicating how they progress and it was broken, we have not seen android 17 and 18 developing their power, so i'm ok with Toei rushing things for them.
 
The main problem is their crappy explanations. They could have easily made up some BS like "The power an android gets from training is much greater than even a saiyan, combined with his 10 years of training, the power 17 has now cant even be compared to that of Goku when he fought Beerus" or at least something along those lines so we have more context but instead its just "Yeah I trained every week or so".
 
LordAizenSama said:
This is the problem with Toeis Super. If this had been some random alien goku went ssb to fight we wouldn't even question the alien being 3-a as PIS. But since it's 17 we get a bit more context.
Unfortunately the writing/powerscaling of fights is so bad it makes it hard to enjoy.

Time to face the truth people. Toei just writes whatever makes the fights look cool and the plot/powerscaling is just collateral damage. We will soon see Goku use SSB to fight bank robbers next.
Click to expand...
Yeah, toyotaro's version is almost certainly a true summary of toriyama's vision of the story and the fights
 
The Living Tribunal1 said:
Yeah, toyotaro's version is almost certainly a true summary of toriyama's vision of the story and the fights
Click to expand...
Doesn't Toriyama supervise each Super chapter himself personally? He doesn't do anything for Super anime except for handing out drafts.
 
why are people saying that Super's logic is nonexistence, the only thing that is wrong is the excuses they give for such a massive power up, not the fact that the characters are getting stronger all of a sudden. and still Goku is clearly holding back.
 
AnonymouXOtakuX said:
why are people saying that Super's logic is nonexistence, the only thing that is wrong is the excuses they give for such a massive power up, not the fact that the characters are getting stronger all of a sudden. and still Goku is clearly holding back.
Click to expand...
Hmm, I don't know, maybe their bullshit powerups,plotholes, time paradoxes, and Goku needing SSB for SSJ or below level characters, you could chalk it up to lazy writing as well.
 
Honestly, 3-A Android 17 is far less of an ass pull than Golden Frieza. The former started out stronger, and had way more time. On top of that, he has infinite stamina, so he can literally train non-stop with zero rest and just keep getting better.

Also, another thing to keep in mind. All characters known to go from 4-B to 3-A did it in an extremely short amount of time with some sort of ass pull. 17 would be the only exception. Think about it. The SSJG ritual. Goku goes from 4-B to 3-A within minutes. Vegeta gets SSJB offscreen without the ritual by training for a few months (granted, he was being trained by someone who is 3-A). Frieza gets his Golden Form within four months because he's "a prodigy". Goku Black achieves SSJR in a short amount of time, even though he struggled with SSJ Goku like a week prior. Trunks achieves his Super form out of rage. Future Zamasu somehow became 3-A due to immortality.

If 17 is 3-A, he would currently be the only one who achieved this level over the course of several years.
 
@MeleeniumRXJ I guess I can agree with him getting this strong its just powerscalings been very bad in Super so it's not helping 17 but he did say he trained and since he would have started right after the Cell Games up till now he had a lot of time and with his Limitless Stamina he could most likely pull it off, I just wish they went into more detail with his training but I doubt they will. We have all these people pulling power ups out of no where so I don't see why we can't give 17 the Benefit of the doubt and except his power up.
 
So... everyone and their mother can fight blue now, probably an exaggeration but it's getting a bit ridiculous, though 17 did have numerous years to train, still not buying him being blue level, i think goku was holding back a lot.
 
Just finished watching the full episode and I actually like it, It was good seeing 17 again and how he changed his life though it shocked me when he didn't want to compete in the tournament even when he found of the truth about the universe being erased but obviously he will change his mind in the next episode.
 
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