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anime and manga are not the same cosmology, there are differences in them, like anime having different stories, like different places, like a room full of drawers of time rings."almost no conection" meaning that there is one
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anime and manga are not the same cosmology, there are differences in them, like anime having different stories, like different places, like a room full of drawers of time rings."almost no conection" meaning that there is one
I’m not saying it’s apart of the universe I’m saying it’s a subspace within the timeline the RoSaT is a space within a space and even if it’s not in the macrocosm (not my argument so idk why you keep bringing it up) it can be referring to the timeline and that’s not contradicted saying that’s it’s not inside the timeline and it is it’s own timeline is head canon and there’s no evidence to back that up if there’s scans or statements of the RoSaT being its own timeline and not being Inside the timeline at all like is being claimed I’ll concede
it doesn’t have enough evidence imo even if the RoSaT isn’t inside of Universe 7 it would still be a 2-C multiverse but the argument is that the RoSaT is outside of the timeline and there’s no evidence of that and it’s been stated to be a subspace so I disagree with this statement that’s not enough evidence for it to be a 2-C multiverse
I’ve sent proof you’ve just ignored it and you havent been addressing it wheres your proof the RoSaT is outside the timeline? And if needed I’ll send the scan once againthis was addressed in the last thread, there is no proof or evidence that it is inside the timeline, so we don't consider it to be
My ban just ended and I got tagged lol
Basically RoSaT Is outside of universe 7, but is a part of the timelineThe only way the cosmology can get downgraded is if the RoSaT is outside of the timeline entirely which there’s no proof of I haven’t seen anyone talk about this because if the RoSaT is inside the timeline it means a space time can encompass a space time defaulting the universes back to Low 2-C can anyone address this?
i don't see in any of the points you shown the evidence for the rosat to be inside the timeline, the only thing you showed as proof was the subspace thing, which i already addressed hereI’ve sent proof you’ve just ignored it and you havent been addressing it wheres your proof the RoSaT is outside the timeline? And if needed I’ll send the scan once again
I think that you, @Ottavio_Merluzzo, @Dominodalek, and @Dagoth_OwO can comment here if you wish.It is because manga have different feats and statements compare to anime, thus different ratings
Edit: shit, forgot to ask for permission
I personally agree with this.Working off of Toriyama's notes means very little for their connection to each other, considering the notes are, evidently, vague, simple, and straightforward outlines of the primary plot points, especially when considering the fact that Toei and Toyotaro took their months in radically different directions.
I thought that Whis has a dimensional travel type of flight, and that he stated that Beerus and other characters that can fly across the local universe cannot travel outside of it through flight on their own, or do I misremember?I don't know why this was brought up. They don't have reality warping or any such technique giving them dimensional travel Why are we now suddenly assuming basic flight is some sort of dimensional travel or warp without evidence.
"The plot created by Toriyama-sensei is a starting point for both anime and manga, but then we work independently from each other. The possibilities of anime and manga are different, so each one tries to adapt the scenario in the best possible way. So there is almost no direct connection between the anime and the manga".
You're welcome, bro, whenever you need it, you can ask.Thank you for the information.
Not really, it was never stated that they cannot fly off from one universe to another but it's just that, they don't do that. Even something as small as going from one planet to another, they rely on angles.I thought that Whis has a dimensional travel type of flight, and that he stated that Beerus and other characters that can fly across the local universe cannot travel outside of it through flight on their own, or do I misremember?
It’s the world beyond and the universe section so it can be referring to either onei don't see in any of the points you shown the evidence for the rosat to be inside the timeline, the only thing you showed as proof was the subspace thing, which i already addressed here
well, about Whis, he can travel through different periods of time, like in this quote where he mentions that he could go there and talk to beerusI personally agree with this.
I thought that Whis has a dimensional travel type of flight, and that he stated that Beerus and other characters that can fly across the local universe cannot travel outside of it through flight on their own, or do I misremember?
The original god dragon balls should also be far more powerful than Whis, but I suppose that may be a bit speculative, even with Dragon Ball's raw power-dependent type of scaling.
no, the part about subspace is talking about the locations of Earth aka the living universeIt’s the world beyond and the universe section so it can be referring to either one
a negative is not needed to proven, the positive is, which in this case is the claim "the rosat is part of the timeline" this claim is the one needed to be proven, no one needs to prove a negativeedit: also is there remotely any proof that shows the RoSaT is outside of the timeline? since that’s the claim
Unless I’m mistaken, wasn’t infinite a mistranslation for the WoV? That it’s simply just eternal since it’s…a void?like the void where the Tournament of Power took place in, which was noted to be infinite.
I read through old threads, WOV was accepted to be infinite ig because treating it as mistranslation and using term "eternal" over "infinite" was making the statement looking bad.Unless I’m mistaken, wasn’t infinite a mistranslation for the WoV? That it’s simply just eternal since it’s…a void?
So Toppo must climb to that feat, we could even do a CRT to discuss infinite velocity, if indeed this is accepted, since Toppo has filled every world of void with his energy, I already have several plansI read through old threads, WOV was accepted to be infinite ig because treating it as mistranslation and using term "eternal" over "infinite" was making the statement looking bad.
Unless I’m mistaken, wasn’t infinite a mistranslation for the WoV? That it’s simply just eternal since it’s…a void?
I see. I mistook it then.It’s accepted as Eternal time wise, and not infinite size wise atm. At least, I’m pretty sure it is
If you argument is that the RoSaT isnt within the timeline that would need to be proven the sub space section is talking about the locations within the universe and the world beyondno, the part about subspace is talking about the locations of Earth aka the living universe
a negative is not needed to proven, the positive is, which in this case is the claim "the rosat is part of the timeline" this claim is the one needed to be proven, no one needs to prove a negative
They’re not canon to Z Z is canon to them huge difference this is like saying the db manga is canon to the z anime so any cosmology things that happens to the Z anime applies to the Z mangathink of it like this, both are equally canon to z, meaning that anything that they ad cosmology wise retroactively applies to z, and since z is canon to both, then it applies to both
they are both equaly considered as canon continuation, a canon continuation is canon to the thing it is continuing from, like how dbz is canon to db, same thing hereThey’re not canon to Z Z is canon to them huge difference
dbz anime is not considered canon here and was not written by akira toryama, dbz anime is a continuation of db anime, not the same situationthis is like saying the db manga is canon to the z anime
read aboveso any cosmology things that happens to the Z anime applies to the Z manga
i don't need to prove a negative, you need to prove the positive, also no, the subspace is in the Earth section of the map, let us stop now as it is clear that we will not convince each other, let the staff evaluateIf you argument is that the RoSaT isnt within the timeline that would need to be proven the sub space section is talking about the locations within the universe and the world beyond
Minor nitpick, but DB and DBZ are the same series, just split up and released as different for western audiences.they are both equaly considered as canon continuation, a canon continuation is canon to the thing it is continuing from, like how dbz is canon to db, same thing here
well, about Whis, he can travel through different periods of time, like in this quote where he mentions that he could go there and talk to beerus
Also he is able to go to other dimensions, like the other world which is only accessible through teleportation.
on the dragon balls they are able to cross the world of emptiness to go to other places, like here
to access other Universes it is necessary with only the cube, as shown here
Champa even mentions that it would be impossible to catch them.
here it shows that help is needed to go to other Universes, for example like Universe 6
https://imgur.com/a/lbPn7OS
in the manga there is evidence of a dimension that separates the Universes
https://imgur.com/a/NY2sWh6
also when Whis says that it takes two days to go to Bills' palace is not a refutation, because Zeno's palace is outside the multiverse
https://imgur.com/a/1lQbcU7
https://imgur.com/a/YfpcgKO
both anime and manga Zeno's palace is shown outside the multiverse, all 12 Universes are shown outside
so the angels would necessarily have to have dimensional travel flight
i talked about it in my commentPeople are forgetting
Whis was literally watching Goku and Merus Train in a time chamber hense it had to be in the timeline
i know, just used the nameMinor nitpick, but DB and DBZ are the same series, just split up and released as different for western audiences.
why would it had to?People are forgetting
Whis was literally watching Goku and Merus Train in a time chamber hense it had to be in the timeline
Well I’m not aware if Og db anime and manga are different in anyway but I dont think it is from what I’ve seen but either way toriyama creates a plot script and toei and toyataro can do their own things toei couldn’t have done whatever they wanted in Z Toriyama still helped out with Z just not as much because he was working on the manga but that point doesn’t really matterthey are both equaly considered as canon continuation, a canon continuation is canon to the thing it is continuing from, like how dbz is canon to db, same thing here
dbz anime is not considered canon here and was not written by akira toryama, dbz anime is a continuation of db anime, not the same situation
read above
i don't need to prove a negative, you need to prove the positive, also no, the subspace is in the Earth section of the map, let us stop now as it is clear that we will not convince each other, let the staff evaluate
Also in DB's databook it is mentioned that Zeno's palace is outside the 12 Universes of DBThis also seems like useful information.
i don't understand your pointWell I’m not aware if Og db anime and manga are different in anyway but I dont think it is from what I’ve seen but either way toriyama creates a plot script and toei and toyataro can do their own things toei couldn’t have done whatever they wanted in Z Toriyama still helped out with Z just not as much because he was working on the manga but that point doesn’t really matter
do you have a scan showing the image of the guide? because i don't see that in the scanYou must not be reading my scan it’s legit in the universe/world beyond section it refers to the actual Rosat as C4 and mentions the one on earth and calls that one area b-1 but the actual rosat and not the entrance to it is referred to as a sub space
ok, going to stop answering about this nowbut sure we can get staff to evaluate I just wanted to say this first though
Don’t worry about that onei don't understand your point
do you have a scan showing the image of the guide? because i don't see that in the scan
ok, going to stop answering about this now
It's going against our standards.I completely disagree with this.
This is very pedantic and essentially using a technicality to downgrade a verse. I say in this case, author intention should take precedence over this. It's clear that the story intends each universe to be an actual universe comparable to our real life standards. And I am not a fan of stories where we handicap stories where the author has a creative cosmology because it doesn't match 1:1 to our chosen cosmology standards.
It’s not it fits our standards you’re just bringing in head canon arguments that can’t be provenIt's going against our standards.
A ridiculous headcanon argument that is supported by 4 staff membersIt’s not it fits our standards you’re just bringing in head canon arguments that can’t be proven
Are you sure it’s 4 staff members? Plus glass iirc didn’t even give a reason why he disagreed Planack and Maverick are the only ones who’ve actually given reasons but i don’t think they know the main argument and assume it’s because of the travel between universesWe shouldn't even be using the same cosmology for the anime and manga when they have multiple differences that was warranted enough to give the characters different profiles, so why on earth are statements made in the manga use as justification to effect anime stuff is beyond me but whatever. Also, Frieza said "perhaps", meaning he isn't even sure if that's the exact reason but sure, I could see the reason for the downgrade but I still don't agree with the cosmology for the anime and manga being the same when they already have different events and statements happening in them so when a statement is made on the cosmology from one, it's basically ignorant to use it for the other when the wiki itself treats what's happening in both as noticeably different.
Regardless, I don't really much know enough about the manga to even way in but considering the decision was that they have the same cosmology was agreed upon, I guess the downgrade is justifiable. However, the angels and Zeno's guards "physically" traveling to other universes is something that's bothered be since they are clearly using a technique (that warp or whatever it's called) that doesn't look like their normal flight but I haven't the time nor effort to debate Dragon Ball stuff. I'm sick, busy with real life stuff, and revising other verses and despite this known fact, I'm still being called for major revisions... so I'm not replying after this.
I'll let other staff handle this.