DBS Non-God Form Downgrade

[Mageman460]

Second: Whis states that Goku wouldn't able to defeat Beerus. That makes no sense if Goku's SSJ form surpassed SSG. Unless you think Whis didn't notice it while he watched the entire fight and is able to sense God Ki and Goku didn't even have God Ki so.

literally irrelevant. This just means Beerus is above the SSJ form. Which he is.

Third: Base Goku struggled against Buu, SSJ Gohan who was weaker than he was in the Buu Saga, Piccolo did fought Final Frost while base Goku struggled to fight Third Form Frost.

I assume you mean Skinny Buu. I don't remember post BOG Goku fighting Buu anywhere else. SSJ Gohan is stronger than Mystic even in RoF. He claims that Ginyu/Sorbet is as strong as his peak, and then goes SSJ and one shots. The Gohan he fights goes through even more training with Picollo and gets stronger. Even during Universe 6 Tournament, Gohan was considered superior to Picollo. Piccolo is constantly training and getting stronger. Just means he scales to Frost who scales to Goku. Also iirc, Goku wasn't really struggling with Frost in his Third Form.

There are some counter arguments such as SSJ2 Goku being stated to rival a God of Destruction, base Vegeta easily defeated SSJ3 Gotenks and base Goku fighting Beerus, but two of them are filler.

Base Vegeta one shot someone equal to Mystic Gohan. First Form Freeza tortured Gohan. Final Form Freeza, Base Goku, and Base Vegeta are all reletive. Every instance of interaction between people relative to Base Goku and top tiers of Z result in a stomp.

This is a quick post. I might do later indepht with scans at alall.

You really need those scans.

Anyway, didn't one of the universe busting feats happen after Goku lost SSG? Also Goku never even noticed he lost SSG, which you'd think Goku would notice such a large drop in power.

 

[Shadyboi0]

Isnt everything in the anime canon?

 

[Flashlight237]

Oh my god... If I had a nickel for every time a Dragon Ball fan makes a stupid argument...

 

[SSJGeminiJJ]

There are some counter arguments such as SSJ2 Goku being stated to rival a God of Destruction, base Vegeta easily defeated SSJ3 Gotenks and base Goku fighting Beerus, but two of them are filler.

Bro to the other one

 

[KLOL506]

KLOL your pfp , i just noticed it

Noob

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

Oh joy, a CRT that doesn’t have a single scan.

I feel like we should have a discussion rule about this.

I agree with this assessment.

 

[LordTracer]

I agree with this assessment.

Are you fine with my suggested wording for the discussion rule? And if you are, could you unlock the Discussion Rules page so I can add it?

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

I unlocked it, ping me again when you are done.

 

[SlendVeny]

Only SSB transformation is called "a SSJ form of the power of SSG".

Yeah, a combo of both transformations.

 

[LordTracer]

@DarkDragonMedeus I’m done, you can lock the page again.

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

All the SSB means is SSJ is accepted as a 50 times multiplier, and let's say Super Saiyan God is a multiplier of Z, then SSB is a multiplier of 50*Z at minimum. Has nothing to do with base form. Goku just grows and grows, and eventually grew to where the feats he previously needed a SSG form to do is now something he can do in base form. Him going SSJ doesn't contradict his base form being stronger than his SSJ form used to me. Him still being able to go SSJ2 doesn't contradict his base or SSJ1 form being stronger than his SSJ2 form used to be. Him still being able to go SSJ3 doesn't contradict his base form to SSJ2 being stronger than SSJ3 form used to be, and so on.

All it means is that his base form is stronger than his SSG form used to be, with each of his forms being stronger yet especially his SSG and SSB forms. And the same process happens a lot throughout the series.

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

@DarkDragonMedeus I’m done, you can lock the page again.

Thank you, I have locked it back up.

 

[LordTracer]

So, can we close this thread, or is there still discussion that needs to be had?

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

I think we're done with all honesty

 

[KLOL506]

Did you link the other threads where it was discussed and rejected?

 

[LordTracer]

Did you link the other threads where it was discussed and rejected?

Nobody gave me links to other threads aside from the one Lephyr posted lmao

 

[KLOL506]

Try the Frey6678 links. Those were comedic AF.

 

[LordTracer]

Try the Frey6678 links. Those were comedic AF.

How am I supposed to try links that I don’t have

 

[KLOL506]

How am I supposed to try links that I don’t have

Check the RVT, he was reported for those offenses there.

 

[KLOL506]

Found it:

https://vsbattles.com/threads/rule-violation-reports-new-forum.107529/post-4307874

https://vsbattles.com/threads/rule-violation-reports-new-forum.107529/post-4307877

 

[BasedNecoScaler69]

Found it:

https://vsbattles.com/threads/rule-violation-reports-new-forum.107529/post-4307874

https://vsbattles.com/threads/rule-violation-reports-new-forum.107529/post-4307877

Should be noted he has stated and expressed enjoyment for, as he has put it, "seeing DB fans struggle against him"

LOL

 

[ByAsura]

Second: Whis states that Goku wouldn't able to defeat Beerus.

Even Super Saiyan Blue doesn't stand a chance against Beerus, despite explicit statements that it far surpassed his Battle of Gods arc powers.

Beerus was holding back a lot throughout the entire fight, and was later shown to be superior to characters on par with or stronger than Kaioken amped tournament arc SSB.

Third: Base Goku struggled against Buu

Buu post-training, where it's made clear that he's way stronger and could unlock dormant power.

SSJ Gohan who was weaker than he was in the Buu Saga

He wasn't. Gohan trained with Piccolo.

There are some counter arguments such as SSJ2 Goku being stated to rival a God of Destruction, base Vegeta easily defeated SSJ3 Gotenks and base Goku fighting Beerus, but two of them are filler.

Wdym filler? There is no filler in the DBS anime, and they're not adaptations of each other.

This is worse than saying that we shouldn't use filler feats for Toei Goku.

Also, here's another contradiction. Tagoma took an attack from Super Saiyan Gotenks, and Ginyu-Tagoma (who's stronger) was instantly vaporized by Vegeta's base form casually with his weakest post-God level of power.

 

[Shubham_Sonsurkar]

I wasn't online for a day and there are already downgrade threads popping even though this one makes no sense

 

[Guacamolefletcher]

What about the evidence against it such as SSB being the only form called "A SSJ form with the power of SSG". If Goku is already did with regular SSJ in RoF?

Because it's deliberately talking about SSJ stacked on top of it???? Like, dude... did we see the same series?

 

[Guacamolefletcher]

Because it got retconned as shown numerous times such as: Buu struggling against Basil and base Goku struggling against Buu, Gohan who was weaker than he was in the Buu Saga, base Goku struggling against Third Form Frost, base Goku struggling against the dog trio in ToP etc

Breh, Third form frost can just be that guy.

 

[KLOL506]

If I had a nickel for every ******* time someone tried downgrading Goku from his feats in the BoG arc, I'd prolly have two dollars. Because hot ******* damn this is getting out of hand.

 

[LordTracer]

Found it:

https://vsbattles.com/threads/rule-violation-reports-new-forum.107529/post-4307874

https://vsbattles.com/threads/rule-violation-reports-new-forum.107529/post-4307877

None of those are about trying to downgrade BoG‘s AP for the same reason as the discussion rule…

I’m closing the thread. The discussion rule is in place.

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

Cope

For the future, avoid these types of comments. You damn well know they invite unnecessary conflict.