Darth Sidious vs Reimu Hakurei

[The_Wright_Way]

I did. And you ignored me. But in an attempt to avoid going in circles I'll repeat.

It takes effort to mindhax a person. The more people you mindhax at once, the less effort you can focus on one person. The more people you can mindhax at once the stronger your mindhax is.

Not that it matters because a good chunk of the people Sidious haxed resist mindhax. Driving people insane is a common enough power that any Jedi Council Master can resist it. That didn't stop Palpatine from dominating them with ease, along with quadrillions more.

 

[MrBreakout]

Sidious feats with Mind hax trump anything Reimu has ever resisted.
Not voting on this but show me her resisting a Mind Hax that drives 100 Quadrillion people mad entirely focused on her single mind.


And unless anyone tells me a moon making people go mad is higher than an entire Galaxy going mad because someone willed so, then yeah, saying her resistance isn't enough is not a rule.

It's plain common sense.

Here's an analogy right, goku is able to destroy majority of people who lacks a resistance to his potency but when faced against jiren he gets resisted? It's the same here except his potency is replaced with the mind hax itself. Of course he could manipulate people who lacks any sort of resistance to the ability but trying to deduce that it'd work on someone who has shown resistance is jumping a gun here and a big one.

Anyways granted I heard he could bypass people with resistance (even though I never got the scan for that but whatever) so sidious fra

 

[The_Wright_Way]

Comparing mind hax to AP is literally the dumbest argument I've ever seen.

 

[Wokistan]

Mindhax is not AP. Mindhaxxing 100 quadrillion and mantaining that mindhax requires more mental potency than mindhaxxing 7 billion and mantaining it. Sidious can focus his powers all in to one person, and the mental power that allows him to constantly exert dominance over 100 quadrillion minds is far more than a resistance of 7 billion.

 

[MrBreakout]

Comparing mind hax to AP is literally the dumbest argument I've ever seen.

>calls it a dumb argument >doesnt refute it

Wew the ad hominem is juicy here.

AP requires effort Mind hax requires effort

its a synonymous event only one is using their mind.

 

[The_Wright_Way]

Anyways, doesn't Sidious stomp?

No amount of luck is going to make Sidious act out of character and none of Reimu's powers can kill him before he thinks and enslaves her.

 

[Eficiente]

Sidious ftra, this thread is unnecessarily long.

 

[MrBreakout]

Mindhax is not AP. Mindhaxxing 100 quadrillion and mantaining that mindhax requires more mental potency than mindhaxxing 7 billion and mantaining it. Sidious can focus his powers all in to one person, and the mental power that allows him to constantly exert dominance over 100 quadrillion minds is far more than a resistance of 7 billion.

You're strawmanning me. I know its not Attack potency, its an analogy thats used as a deduction to prove my point. Both require effort but can be negated if someone has resitance. Those people could be very vulnerable to the ability (even though Im asking scans and evidence for him bypassing people who has resistance and not recieving it).

Heres an option, instead of repeating the same point just *show* him bypassing people who has resistance, I already said I'd concede if you do,

 

[Wokistan]

Hax is totally different from AP. I posted an explanation above your comment on why the mindhax works. However if they were the same, it would make no sense for a dude with an AP of 100 quadrillion tons of tnt or whatever to be no sold by someone with 7 billion. AP isn't resisted like hax is, that's just how durability scales.

 

[MrBreakout]

Anyways, doesn't Sidious stomp?
No amount of luck is going to make Sidious act out of character and none of Reimu's powers can kill him before he thinks and enslaves her.

Well this site sorta downplays reimu but imma save that until I can try to upgrade her O3O

 

[The_Wright_Way]

>calls it a dumb argument >doesnt refute it

Wew the ad hominem is juicy here.

AP requires effort Mind hax requires effort

its a synonymous event only one is using their mind.

I've been refuting it the entire thread. You just use the same argument and ignore me.

All hax requires effort. That doesn't make it less hax. Mind controlling someone is not synonymous to punching them.

 

[FateAlbane]

snip

Your analogy doesn't work because basically you're doing something like comparing punching a stone to make it break to willing the stone out of place.

Physical Strength is completely different from the strength of the mind so obviously each will have a potency and scale of their own when faced with different or specialized type of attacks. The same way we rate someone's tier physically by the physical destruction they can bring about, so we also rate their soul and mental capabilities and such based on respective showings.

That logic you presented is utterly faulty because it almost equates saying a character will be as mentally strong as they are physically strong.

Same would go for soul or concepts.

Characters are only as strong with their minds and such for as far as they have shown.

Sidious has shown that his mind powers while divided can affect 100 quadrillion people across a galaxy. Focus that into a single point and you get the full scale of his powers. It's a notion akin to multi-tasking. If your attention is undivided, obviously you will be much more efficient when focused on a single target.

Reimu showed that at best her mind resistance can deal with the moon.

Arguing this is entirely out of the question and is at this point, honestly, a massive overestimation of Reimu's mental abilities while the burden of proof to confirm that she resists that scale of hax is entirely on your shoulders.

With feats, not speculation.

 

[Mr. Bambu]

That isn't exactly a strawman. Your point is that animu here resists mindhax. That's valid, but they've never shown to resist as potent mindhax. We've told you this. Just saying.

 

[Wokistan]

It is not a straw man argument when the very example you use to try to illustrate your point is one of AP and not mindhax, implicitly equating the two. Your argument inarguably conflates AP with hax. To say so is not fallacious. You don't resist AP, you just have higher durability. Hax does not work that way. Even if you did, 100 quadrillion is still far, far greater than 7 billion, AP wise or hax.

 

[MrBreakout]

Hax is totally different from AP. I posted an explanation above your comment on why the mindhax works. However if they were the same, it would make no sense for a dude with an AP of 100 quadrillion tons of tnt or whatever to be no sold by someone with 7 billion. AP isn't resisted like hax is, that's just how durability scales.

How durability scales is sorta the same thing as resisting it, going by definition of "resist".

Anyways I'm pretty seeking enlightenment on how potent sidious really is since people arent giving me scans here. so for now I'll take the word that he can affect people with resistance

 

[The_Wright_Way]

Hax is totally different from AP. I posted an explanation above your comment on why the mindhax works. However if they were the same, it would make no sense for a dude with an AP of 100 quadrillion tons of tnt or whatever to be no sold by someone with 7 billion. AP isn't resisted like hax is, that's just how durability scales.

Quoting this so it doesn't get ignored.

 

[MrBreakout]

I'd be repeating the same point which would come off as ad nauseam, granted I'm only taking the word of what he can bypass for now

 

[Wokistan]

Resistance on this site apies to hax only, and not AP. Your example with AP falls apart regardless though with a bit of a closer look. You state that goku can kill people but jiren wasn't, because he has higher durability. That's all fair and good, but in this case tohou girl doesn't have the higher "durability". Her resistance feat is on the order of 7 billion minds, when the attack she has to tank is the potency of 100 quadrillion. That is millions of times more potent. She needs to display a feat on that level for resistance to help.

 

[MrBreakout]

Resistance on this site apies to hax only, and not AP. Your example with AP falls apart regardless though with a bit of a closer look. You state that goku can kill people but jiren wasn't, because he has higher durability. That's all fair and good, but in this case tohou girl doesn't have the higher "durability". Her resistance feat is on the order of 7 billion minds, when the attack she has to tank is the potency of 100 quadrillion. That is millions of times more potent. She needs to display a feat on that level for resistance to help.

Ohhhh I understand now, you're saying the moon only showed to neg 7 billion while reimu is left dealing with a number she hasnt dealt with before.

K makes sense

 

[MrBreakout]

Sidious FRA then

--Gonna upgrade reimu one day--

 

[Wokistan]

Yeah, basically that. With other hax you generally gotta show resistances and overcoming those and all that jazz, but mindhax you can just reduce to a number. It's probably the most similar to AP, in a way, but still pretty different. I didn't vote yet, so I guess sidious fra, though not sure how notable this match really is.

 

[MrBreakout]

Depends really. Fantasy nature allows reimu to float outside reality and is basically spatial temporal lock (which isnt an ability on this site for reasons idk) so he'd have to have some access to people who can do that. However its not known whether reimu or sidious is bloodlusted or not.

If bloodlusted inconclusive, if not sidious from what I've been presented anyways since reimu doesn't really use fantasy heaven in character

 

[MrBreakout]

Some conditions need to be added to actually clarify these stuff, I'd suggest editting the post

 

[The_Wright_Way]

He's mindhaxed people who can do that.

 

[MrBreakout]

I know I'm gonna regret this, but scans? I'll wait

 

[The_Wright_Way]

The 100 quadrillions feat included force ghosts, which exist outside the physical plane as one with the living force.

You'll have to ask a knowledgeable member for scans. I can't access them with my phone and I'm staying at the campground for the weekend so I have no computer.

Also, pretty sure we treat fantasy heaven as just intangibility here, which doesn't affect mindhax resistance.

 

[MrBreakout]

physical plane shouldn't equate to the definition of reality itself.

I should try to add the power spatial temporal lock here if thats FN is treated then

 

[Uninown]

Although i would like Reimu to win, i dont think she uses Fantasy Nature in character or straight out off the bat, unlike Sidious, with his humongous mindhax

My vote goes to Sidious via Mindhax IF this is in character. If bloodlusted, then i think this would be inconclusive via Reimu using Fantasy Nature and i think Sidious would be unable to knock her out with mindhax or anything.

Im going to upgrade Reimu one day ill promise

 

[Uninown]

I dont want to discuss Reimu's mind resistance here, since quadrillion to 7 billion is big difference. And no, its not only range. Sidious mindhaxxed dudes who already had mind resistance.

 

[Wokistan]

Op only specified dpeed equal, so everything else is Standard Battle Assumptions. As such, neither is bloodlusted, but mindhax is a consistent opening for sidious. Not knowledgeable enough about touhou to say what reimu opens with.

 

[MrBreakout]

Although i would like Reimu to win, i dont think she uses Fantasy Nature in character or straight out off the bat, unlike Sidious, with his humongous mindhax
My vote goes to Sidious via Mindhax IF this is in character. If bloodlusted, then i think this would be inconclusive via Reimu using Fantasy Nature and i think Sidious would be unable to knock her out with mindhax or anything.

Im going to upgrade Reimu one day ill promise

How do u do that crossy thing QAQ

 

[MrBreakout]

Also there needs to be some sort of rules here.

Are the characters bloodlusted? Are any haxes disabled? Which key is being used?

This post is jumbled

 

[Uninown]

Although i would like Reimu to win, i dont think she uses Fantasy Nature in character or straight out off the bat, unlike Sidious, with his humongous mindhax
My vote goes to Sidious via Mindhax IF this is in character. If bloodlusted, then i think this would be inconclusive via Reimu using Fantasy Nature and i think Sidious would be unable to knock her out with mindhax or anything.

Im going to upgrade Reimu one day ill promise

How do u do that crossy thing QAQ

With < strike > (WORD HERE) </ strike>. You're Welcome.

 

[MrBreakout]

thank you

 

[Sir_Ovens]

Also there needs to be some sort of rules here.

Are the characters bloodlusted? Are any haxes disabled? Which key is being used?

This post is jumbled

Look up standard battle assumptions on the site. We should have a page for that here.

 

[Mr. Bambu]

@Pro I believe SBA solves two of your questions. Characters aren't automatically bloodlusted (as in, in a craze to kill each other) but are in combat and willing to kill. As bloodlusted as their character normally is.

Also, unless stated, no hax are disabled.

Keys... that's a mess yeah. Unless otherwise stated though both characters are at their strongest forms so Y E E T.

 

[Uninown]

Also there needs to be some sort of rules here.
Are the characters bloodlusted? Are any haxes disabled? Which key is being used?

This post is jumbled

The OP only stated Speed equalized and we are all assuming its one of his 4-B versions. I assume Windows Reimu is being used, since PC-98 lacks hax as far as i can remember. Im checking Sidious profiles and i saw that non-corporeal, wonder what that could be :thinking: Im not familiarized with Star Wars at all. Answering the question what Reimu starts with, i dont really know either at all, i think she uses most of her Danmaku and Probability thingy, but i can't confirm this. The only thing i know is that she doesn't start right off the bat with Fantasy Nature (sorry, i just recently started with the Touhou franchise so far q_q)

 

[Uninown]

Also, check SBA. Its what happens when the OP doesn't state it.

 

[MrBreakout]

K so I looked up SBA. So she's willing to kill her opponents then, well its not known whether reimu uses FN without SCR or not but if she's gonna treat it like a major incident then there shouldn't be any reason she shouldnt.

Voting inconclusive

 

[Uninown]

Im still wondering what that Non-corporeal and Spatial manip on DS is :thinking: