Pretty Pretty Shrine Maidens- Reimu Hakurei vs Sailor Mars (Touhou vs Sailor Mars) (0-0-0

[Topaz404]

Reimus best MU, in my opinion.

Uh- yeah. Reimu Hakurei vs Sailor Mars, pretty simple
Sailor Mars starts in Eternal Form (Crystal) and Reimu has everything, including Optional Equipment
Speed equalized, the location is the Hakurei Shrine, SBA otherwise

The Shrine Maiden of Poverty: 0
The Shrine Maiden of Mars: 0
They kiss and make up: 0

god if this is a stomp i am going to cry​

 

[Topaz404]

i uh- guess ill bump this (if i may?)

 

[Topaz404]

Le bumperoni (hggggg)

 

[Topaz404]

Bump, again. Once more!

 

[Iamunanimousinthat]

I can argue for Mars, but I dont know much about Touhou

 

[Topaz404]

Oh! Wonderful! Someone new lol (get ready, because Touhou is a pretty bullshit verse in terms of hax, and Reimu is no exception)
What might be Mars's first move, given the circumstances she currently finds herself in?

 

[Iamunanimousinthat]

Rei would go in for a straight ranged attack.

 

[Topaz404]

I feel bad for what i am about to do

Anyways, Reimu starts with using her Passive Fate Manip, which would lead her to using her Spatial Intangibility that i believe extends to a 2-B scale, she literally floats outside of reality, so Rei's attacks wont touch her, but Reimu can still shoot Rei

She will then start attacking Rei with her Danmaku, which has all the effects of Spirit Manip, consisting of light bullets, yin-yang orbs, Persuasion Needles, and ofuda. She has a lot she can do not counting Optional Equipment

 

[Iamunanimousinthat]

Fate manipulation maybe tricky depending on its specific application,, but Rei's attack can hit intangible beings and can attack across dimensions and spaces. Senshi have forcefields and can dodge attacks and cancel attacks with their own attacks, as a form of defense. Not to mention Rei has precognition, danger sense, and telepathy and can sense distortions in space.

 

[Topaz404]

Reimu's got Type 4 Acausality, Precog probably wont work on her.

Reimu's Fate Manip basically works as her passively altering the probability of something happening, theres more to it, but thats generally how it works- and its been able to bypass the Type 4 Acausality of other Touhou characters

Not to mention 4D passive Power Null, mainly her ofuda being able to destroy enemy projectiles

I think the biggest thing Reimu has going for her is that she shares a degree of Yukari's Boundary Manip, hell, even Okina directly compared it to Yukari's as well

Defensive wise, she also has Instinctive Reaction, Subjective Reality (being able to form barriers with her willpower), or just giving Rei's attacks a name (thus putting them under the Spell Card Rules, which would make attacks non-lethal), and concerning Optional Equipment, she has the Ultramarine Orb Elixir, granting her Immo Type 5 and Precognition (they experience their death, and then time rewinds to the point before they died)

Does Rei have anything to counter that orrrr?

 

[Iamunanimousinthat]

just giving Rei's attacks a name (thus putting them under the Spell Card Rules, which would make attacks non-lethal),

Can you explain that more? Rei's attacks already has names, and her strongest attacks are living things with consciousness. Would that still work?

Reimu's Fate Manip basically works as her passively altering the probability of something happening, theres more to it, but thats generally how it works- and its been able to bypass the Type 4 Acausality of other Touhou characters

The senshi have shown resistance to Queen Nehellenia's fate manipulation. I don't think that's on the current profile, but if the probably of hitting is lowered, as long is its not zero, mars can spam attacks. The characters do have Acausality.

Subjective Reality (being able to form barriers with her willpower),

Mars can penetrate barriers and magic seals and can even burn spacetime.

she has the Ultramarine Orb Elixir, granting her Immo Type 5 and Precognition (they experience their death, and then time rewinds to the point before they died)

Mars attacks bypass Immo Type 5.

 

[Topaz404]

I dont know how to reply to everything, but ill use bullet points

Thats.....an interesting predicament, but if they already have names, Reimu could potentially just "gameify" the attack, making them non-lethal.


This should explain how Reimu's Fate Manip works, to add some extra context. Make of it as you will

Mars's attacks can bypass Immo Type 5? Might i ask for some proof with that?
(Mars spamming attacks against someone who considers a giant wall of bullets a small amount of practice, yeah, shes gonna be fine lol)

(tbh i should maybe see if i can call someone who has a better knowledge of the verse) (also i hope the link works)

 

[Iamunanimousinthat]

Mars's attacks can bypass Immo Type 5? Might i ask for some proof with that?
(Mars spamming attacks against someone who considers a giant wall of bullets a small amount of practice, yeah, shes gonna be fine lol)

Senshi attacks erase can beings from existence which the immorality page says works against type 5.

This should explain how Reimu's Fate Manip works, to add some extra context. Make of it as you will

From my understanding, she can influence the outcome to her favor, but its not always 100%. A disadvantage for Mars but not something absolute.

 

[Mad_Dog_of_Fujiwara]

The senshi have shown resistance to Queen Nehellenia's fate manipulation. I don't think that's on the current profile, but if the probably of hitting is lowered, as long is its not zero, mars can spam attacks. The characters do have Acausality.

Reimu's fate manipulation is heavily layered.

Can you explain that more? Rei's attacks already has names, and her strongest attacks are living things with consciousness. Would that still work?

A "name" in Touhou is a highly specific thing, being the concepts from which all of existence was formed during the age where everything existed as part of a primordial and indistinct chaos. Characters can bestow names upon various things to change their properties, such as how Reimu's Fantasy Nature was given a time limit alongside its name.

tl;dr it's power modification on a type 1 conceptual level lol

Sailor Mars starts in Eternal Form (Crystal) and Reimu has everything, including Optional Equipment​

Good lord, what are you doing lol

Anyways, I'll give my own two cents. Mars can't resist Reimu's passive power null, which functions on a 4D conceptual level, so that's a pretty major disadvantage (I assume Mars' resistances aren't quite on that level). Reimu can also just... adapt to and grow stronger from whatever Mars does to her with her busted RE which works instantaneously, so that's fun. Fantasy Nature is a quick and easy wincon, since it floats beyond the extent of Touhou's cosmology and I ain't seeing 2-B range on Mars.

From my understanding, she can influence the outcome to her favor, but its not always 100%. A disadvantage for Mars but not something absolute.

Reimu's fortune is on a level greatly exceeding that of Shion Yorigami's misfortune aura, whose aura guarantees a loss for anyone affected by it. Even if that weren't the case, Reimu's fortune ensures attacks simply swerve away from her, so she'll be fine regardless.

 

[Topaz404]

Oh crap, its Fuji, i think your doomed buddy

(Look, Mars is Reimu's best MU besides Arle, and since Arle cant touch her.....yeah. Also, if i started Mars at base, she wouldnt even get to do shit before getting destroyed in every which way.)

((but thanks for the help anyways lol))

 

[Mad_Dog_of_Fujiwara]

Also, let's not even get into the fact that Reimu has all her optional equipment, which includes multiple speed amps that'll let her blitz Mars several times over, multiple instant resurrections, the UMOE (which defends against conceptual EE, though it's not on the profile), even further enhanced luck, and subjective reality that says "No" to a fight by turning the whole affair into a dream that the user then "wakes up" from.

 

[Topaz404]

Also, let's not even get into the fact that Reimu has all her optional equipment, which includes multiple speed amps that'll let her blitz Mars several times over, multiple instant resurrections, the UMOE (which defends against conceptual EE, though it's not on the profile), even further enhanced luck, and subjective reality that says "No" to a fight by turning the whole affair into a dream that the user then "wakes up" from.

Should i restrict Optional Equipment, then? Or would Reimu win without?

 

[Mad_Dog_of_Fujiwara]

Should i restrict Optional Equipment, then? Or would Reimu win without?

Reimu would win without it, I think.

You gotta remember that Reimu is currently in a very comfortable 3rd place in the strongest non-smurfs list. Junko may be carrying that tier, but Reimu still sweeps most of the other contenders, especially now that I've finally added her RE and passive power null.

 

[Topaz404]

Well, lets see what the Mars supporter has to say. Im most likely going to restrict OE so it, well, most likely isnt a complete shitstomp

my biggest mistake is underestimating the absolute bullshit that Touhou is, eh?

 

[Mad_Dog_of_Fujiwara]

And to think Reimu still has another 30+ abilities sitting in one of my CRT drafts.

 

[Iamunanimousinthat]

Well, based on what Mad is saying, I don't think Mars can win with this version and her speed equalized. So I will give it to Reimu.

 

[Topaz404]

I mean, i dont see Mars getting out of 2-C anytime soon, would unequalizing speed help in any case or is Reimu's Fate Hax that obscene?

 

[Iamunanimousinthat]

Mars is immeasurable and has stronger hax in her evil form.

 

[Topaz404]

I see, well, i guess lets see what Fuji says before i signal this thread as a stomp

 

[Iamunanimousinthat]

It's not a stomp. It's fair fight.

 

[Topaz404]

I mean, going with what Fuji mentioned, even with OE restricted and speed unequalized, Reimu's fate hax are- well. Funny.
Obscene doesnt even begin to describe it-

 

[Topaz404]

Alright, theres a few things we can do
Go along with the original ruling, and go ahead and close the thread because its most likely a Reimu stomp
OR
We can unequalize speed and restrict Reimu's OE and go with that, see if it makes the match more fair

What do yall think?

 

[Topaz404]

Just gonna ask this and then let this thread here die
With everything we know in mind
Could Reimu just solo the Sailor Moon verse? Or is a haxxlord about to meet her match?