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Dark Souls Upgrades

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@Hell If there's no contradicting evidence to say its not like the regular sun, then there doesnt need to be any supporting evidence to say it is
 
Hellbeast1 said:
Nah the links working for me but i do agree we need to have links that genuinely work.
Click to expand...
Hold up. The link is working? I just clicked and it worked? I thought NF links were broken?
 
"In 1 second the Su generates 3.8 x 1026 Joules"

Is what I found online. That's only High 6-A, which would be sustaining the sun, rather than Destroying the sun or Creating one.
 
@Rage Keeping the sun in existence is not the same thing as maintaining the energy the sun gives off.
 
Aren't they only maintaining the light of the sun? Not the physical matter that makes it up? Also the High 6-A could be seen as a Highball since not all of the Sun's energy/light falls on the planet.

"1.74 x 1017" Joules fall on the planet, and that is only 7-B City Level. So it we were being really accurate about the Light of the entire planet, it'd only be City Level per second.
 
It seems safer to go with the High 6-A for the light of the Solar System, rather than saying they maintain the physical mass and matter of the sun.
 
Why would we go with something they dont (Maintain the light througout the solar system) do and not go with what they actually do (Maintain the existence of the sun)? That makes no sense whatsoever.
 
RageComment said:
I'm pretty sure for duration based things, this wiki just counts the output for one second.
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Ehh, it depends but generally no.

Edit: Not even warhammer's sun guns are 6-A anymore based on a similar statement.
 
But even the output of the sun for 1,000 years is only

1,000 x 365.25 x 24 x 60 x 60 = 31,557,600,000 seconds

x3.8e+26 Joules/second (Total Solar Output per second)

1.1991888e+37 joules = Large Planet level (5-A)
 
RageComment said:
But even the output of the sun for 1,000 years is only
1,000 x 365.25 x 24 x 60 x 60 = 31,557,600,000 seconds

x3.8e+26 Joules/second (Total Solar Output per second)

1.1991888e+37 joules = Large Planet level (5-A)
Click to expand...
Okay so 5-A dark souls?

Cool.

Assuming of course Ever is right.

I dont know. Nor do I care enough to push the issue.

But also, maintaining the existence of the sun is 4-C.

Because keeping a sun alight even for 1000 years or rekindling it would require near 4-C levels of energy.

Since the chosen undead 'rekindled the sun'.

That would be 4-C
 
4-C is the energy to destroy a star. Not keep it functioning. Destroying something takes way more energy than keeping something functioning. Look at computers, the amount of energy to keep them running is less than the energy to turn them to slag. The energy humans require for calories is less than the energy to destroy their physical forms.

Just become something sustains something does not mean it has the power to bust that thing in an instant.
 
Not entirely sure honestly like, he rekindled the flame, but the sun didn't flicker out Entirely yet, it would if faded but it had yet to. But the age of dark , didnt it come.already in the past ir something?.
 
RageComment said:
4-C is the energy to destroy a star. Not keep it functioning. Destroying something takes way more energy than keeping something functioning. Look at computers, the amount of energy to keep them running is less than the energy to turn them to slag. The energy humans require for calories is less than the energy to destroy their physical forms.
Just become something sustains something does not mean it has the power to bust that thing in an instant.
Click to expand...
You missed my point entirely.

I said "rekindling it would require near 4-C levels of energy."

I think the math is high end High 5-A or Low 4-C

Dont quote me on that.

Also, 4-C is also GBE dude.

GBE is for creation AND destruction.

This is not a one way street.
 
Age of Dark never truly comes until some endings of DS3

The First Flame fades to embers, but it never actually goes away, and then it gets relit, restarting the Age of Fire without ever allowing the Age of Dark to happen

If you are referring to the dark version of the world with Champion Gundyr, that's like, an alternate timeline that was sealed away iirc
 
I agree with Rage

@J i dont think the age of dark happened before in the games, the most i can think of is the incursion in the Abysswalker DLC and the fragments of the Pygmy causing several kingdoms to collapse.
 
Also flickering out. Like if you turn a lightbulb out and it does not produce light anymore, that's not the same as busting the lightbulb. The object is still there, just dark. Even if darkness caused the sun to fade, the physical object would still be there. It would just need a power source (magical powerful souls or whatever). It's not like they are building stars or such.

That is why I am pretty sure the upper limit of this feat is the energy output of the sun. Which is High 6-A for one second, or Possibly 5-A for 1000 years. Putting it at 4-C is too high.
 
Hellbeast1 said:
I agree with Rage
@J i dont think the age of dark happened before in the games, the most i can think of is the incursion in the Abysswalker DLC and the fragments of the Pygmy causing several kingdoms to collapse.
Click to expand...
In all honestly, I am neutral.

I just don't see the arguments presented as against the idea of 4-C dark souls other then.

"Maintain the existence of the sun.'

Okay, reigniting the sun is in tier 4.

Keeping it lit for thousands of year? 5-A.

At this point, it is semantics.
 
thoughtthe age of dark had come and passed multiple times prior, which would that it would of been rekindled entirely.


But if that didbt happen than I'd go with the 5-B tier .
 
RageComment said:
Also flickering out. Like if you turn a lightbulb out and it does not produce light anymore, that's not the same as busting the lightbulb. The object is still there, just dark. Even if darkness caused the sun to fade, the physical object would still be there. It would just need a power source (magical powerful souls or whatever). It's not like they are building stars or such.
That is why I am pretty sure the upper limit of this feat is the energy output of the sun. Which is High 6-A for one second, or Possibly 5-A for 1000 years. Putting it at 4-C is too high.
Click to expand...
Even your analogy is iffy. Sure if a lightbulb goes out and it doesnt produce energy, that doesnt mean the lightbulb is gone aka busted, but that lightbulb has no energy.

Reigniting it = converts energy.

Again, I am neutral on 4-C dark souls.
 
Reigniting the Flame, just requires fuel. That fuel is the soul of a powerful being. Their Lord soul. Since the process is a constant thing, it should be the High 6-A (3.8e+26 J/s) Since they don't shove all their energy in the sun at once and let it burn that. If it was in an Instant, then it would be (For Lord Gywn at least) 5-A.

It is not however 4-C, because they are not creating or destroying a star anew. So the GBE should not come into play. The darkness isn't threatening to disjoin the Star's gravity, rather it is trying to swallow up the Star's light, heat and warm.

As far as I know anyway. I am open to scans/screenshots or quotes that back the Sustaining the physical Gravitational Binding Energy of the Sun though.
 
high 6-A would be if they did that for 1 second, but the lords of cinder are costanlty doing that high 6-A without recovering power for a lot of time (gwin did it for 1000 years and still had enought juice to fight the chosen undead)
 
But AP measures how much you output, not how much you hold. And the High 6-A is how much Gywn would be outputting to fuel the Sun per second. 5-A would be the total energy over the period of time. But in a fight, you would not suddenly output all of the energy equal to how much you output over a thousands years. In fact, the fight with Gwyn is likely below High 6-A because the fire is fading as Gwyn is no longer in his peak.
 
@Rage

Dude, nothing implies the sun would just "go out". Never mind that that's impossible and needlessly over thinking it, but such a thing is never implied.

Occam's Razor applies here dude.
 
Yes we should definitely apply Occam's Razor. It is much more believable that sustaining the sun means powering it and fueling it's output (High 6-A to 5-A), rather than creating a Star (4-C). Rekindling is just that, rekindling, not Creation of a new heavenly body, thus ideas of 4-C can be discarded as evidenceless.
 
No dude, you got that backwards.

It's a far simpler assumption to assume the sun ceases to exist. Never mind that it's literally impossible for the sun to "go out" without black dwarf nonsense, but it's rekindling the First Flame because they're rekindling the First Flame, not the sun literally.
 
the sun is just part of the first flame, it the first flame goes out, the sun will dissapear too and in one of the endings is implied that the soul of cider can recreate the first flame
 
That's absolutely backwards. The sun ceasing to exist would shift the gravity of the entire solar system, not to mention if a fading sun is losing it's physical mass, it would visibly shrink, not go dim/fade. Where is that mass going? What is gravically keeping the solar system together. The idea the the sun just poofs out of existence is unsubtantiated by anything. Thus Occam's Razor it away.

It is easier to assume that the heat and warm of the sun fades. Because that is exactly what the Rekindling of the Flame, and the Lore of the First Flame implies.
 
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