Crimes Against Curvature

[AguilaR101]

The only way to ensure the globe we see isn't affected by that is by comparing the apparent size of landmarks with those of a proper view of the planet.

 

[Callsign_Castle]

This suggestion is perfectly fine for calcs that go like "an energy wave explodes and some hints of curvature are shown". For calcs that show pretty much the whole planet and especially calcs that show said planet from afar, this is absolutely not fine.

Pretty much this, though DT has a different opinion about planetary shots.

 

[Dargoo_Faust]

The only way to ensure the globe we see isn't affected by that is by comparing the apparent size of landmarks with those of a proper view of the planet.

I mean, if the planet is so far away that the horizon view limitation can't come into play, we could just use the size of the planet.

If I'm not mistaken that would be one Earth-radius away from Earth, or around 4,000 miles.

 

[Antvasima]

So what are the conclusions so far here?

 

[Dargoo_Faust]

I would personally appreciate it if Kep commented again here, as well as a response from Ugarik to Kep's points.

But we've concluded that we need to look over numerous from-orbit calculations and either disregard or fix them to the best of our ability. Iirc someone upthread made a list of calcs to review.

 

[Antvasima]

Okay. You can use their message walls to request help if you wish.

 

[Revan_Laha]

I personally think curvature calcs involving big live action houses like Marvel and DC should be fine

 

[Callsign_Castle]

Still waiting.

 

[Jasonsith]

How is this doing?

 

[KLOL506]

How is this doing?

Kep said that planets shown from outer space will have to use planet size no matter what, so I think this is fine.

 

[Dargoo_Faust]

Kep said that planets shown from outer space will have to use planet size no matter what, so I think this is fine.

Honestly Kep's conclusion didn't really address the argument as much as it did state an opinion and discuss issues with one of the sample pictures.

The second sample picture still hasn't been addressed, and even in Kep's opinion we still don't see "pretty much the whole planet" on that picture, so it could very well have issues.

I would very much appreciate it for Kep and Ugarik to comment again here.

 

[Ugarik]

I think I found the solution. I'll post it later today when I'm home

 

[Jasonsith]

I think I found the solution. I'll post it later today when I'm home

Thanks. And I think I can give my two cents:

Whether one knows an Earth curvature is properly bracketed can be checked with a few means:

1) is that a heavy outlier in the first place or is the range common in the verse?

2) do the details on the ground and in the air contradict with the earth curvature if they are properly drawn?

If the range is common and there are concrete proof the object size match with the earth curvature then it should be okay to go.

 

[Antvasima]

I will unsubscribe from this thread. You can send me a message later if you need my help with something.

 

[Ugarik]

I'm sorry about the delay but apparently it is was proven to be way more challenging than I originaly thought. I still think I can solve it though.

Tell me exactly what do you want to know from the apparent curve? Distance to the hoziron, chord of the horizon or height of the curve?

 

[Dargoo_Faust]

Ideally, a measurement that can be used to scale to objects/explosions in the immediate vicinity.

 

[Revan_Laha]

I want to use the curve to calculate how far an object is.

For example in this case

 

[Ugarik]

Okay

 

[Revan_Laha]

Coz this will upgrade speed in MCU

 

[Ugarik]

This is not the method you are looking for but I'll use it anyway to compare the results
Screen - 358 px

Lake Superior - 33 px ~ 260 km

Distance: 260000*358/[33*2tan(70/2 deg)] = 2014121.46 m

 

[Revan_Laha]

Damn this is fast. Because she travelled this distance in less than a minute and dodging attacks mid-flight. Ill put this into a blog

 

[Ugarik]

Screen - 456 px

Height of the curve - 76 px (typed 72 by accident)

note: the chord of the segment needs to be 3/2 times of the screen height. 684 px in this case

Anglular size of the curve: : 2atan(tan(70deg/2)*[72/456]) = 12.6178936 deg

Using this simulator I got a similar ang size of the curve at the distance of 840000 m

 

[Ugarik]

The biggest problem with the simulator is that it doesn't show angular size of the curve as an input. It needs to be calculated manually as "2asin(DipHeight b / 2 / HorDistView v)"

 

[AKM sama]

Let's not turn this into a MCU thread. We have to try to come up with a solution regarding the problem in general.

 

[Ugarik]

Isn't that what I'm doing? I just made some examples of how to sove this on Revan's calc

 

[AKM sama]

Okay, my apologies. My comment was directed to "this will upgrade MCU", "damn she is fast" and such.

But how should our standards change regarding this issue?

 

[Revan_Laha]

Thanks.

 

[Callsign_Castle]

Thanks. And I think I can give my two cents:

Whether one knows an Earth curvature is properly bracketed can be checked with a few means:

1) is that a heavy outlier in the first place or is the range common in the verse?

2) do the details on the ground and in the air contradict with the earth curvature if they are properly drawn?

If the range is common and there are concrete proof the object size match with the earth curvature then it should be okay to go.

For the second point, you'll only see the horizon curvature, and even that is heavily exaggerated. You logically cannot see the curvature of a planet when you're still within its atmosphere.

 

[Callsign_Castle]

Also @Ugarik how can the curve be 840km as measured, when the diameter is much larger?

 

[Damage3245]

So... was this ever implemented or was a consensus ever reached?

 

[Elizhaa]

I believed a consensus was never reached, @Damage3245.

 

[Ugarik]

https://vsbattles.com/vsbattles/594431

 

[Spinosaurus75DinosaurFan]

Question: If there are 2 calculation of something's size, one based on curvature and the other one based on another method, should the other method be more prioritised than curvature scaling?

 

[Spinosaurus75DinosaurFan]

Question 2: Have we agreed on any standard on when curvature should be used?