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COWBOY VS A TYRANT

AguilaR101 said:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eSouYYs5mK4&t=70s
headshots are only barely enough to stun, and at best it only results in temporal (30secs) of incapacitation in the remake, it's the same regardless of which weapon you use, including the shotgun which destroys zombie heads and severs them in half.
Click to expand...
pulverization >> severing in half, but it would most likely not have much effect.

Again, Arthur will resort to setting traps everywhere and eventually lure the Tyrant into an explosive-laden room to finish the job.
 
I have never seen any decision that his weapons reach the 9-A rank. If so that better be changed because the only tier he has pointed out is 9-B, Higher with firearms. That doesn't translate to 9-A so I don't know what's happening.
 
Arthur beat Johnah Hex, an 8-C character and the people on his side in that thread said he was scalable to that level. Also as for that trapping the room thing remember no prep time and the distance is only 50 meters (roughly 164 feet) so I am not convicned Morgan can sufficiently rig a room before Tyrant closes in and without the Tyrant simply seeing him do it
 
Guns in the verse pulverize boulders provided they hit them with sufficent amount of bullets.

Explosives aren't that good at dealing damage compared to bullets since they're not concentrated, but ignoring that, he is most certainly not carrying around enough explosives to reach 9-A without prep-otherwise he'd be 9-A off the bat.
 
I am only pointing out what a now closed and official thread concluded. I do not personally agree with the 8-C ruling myself

Also for clarity can everyone tell me their votes as of right now?
 
Yeah I'm surprised I haven't asked but what makes Arthur's guns higher than 9-B? Same goes with the GTA protagonists since they have "Higher" tiers as well
 
No idea. Alright here how about this. For this particular thread I will just say in this particular battle "Higher" qualifies 9-A. Will that make it better?
 
Insecurity97 said:
Yeah I'm surprised I haven't asked but what makes Arthur's guns higher than 9-B? Same goes with the GTA protagonists since they have "Higher" tiers as well
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GTA characters can blow up cars with their guns and they hit harder than they can punch. But they're just below the best weapons, which are 9-A (They will get upgraded to High 8-C once the aeroplane bust calc gets approved).

Same with Arthur Morgan's guns. They punch out harder than he can with his fists, much harder, but, they're only weaker than his best explosives. Same with Goblin Slayer, he has an attack that dwarves his AP.

I'd also suggest giving Arthur some prep to make this fight fairer. 2 hours should get the job done.
 
You know what. Ill just add it to the conditions of the fight. Just to make it official so we can get back to the discussion
 
KLOL506 said:
I'd also suggest giving Arthur some prep to make this fight fairer. 2 hours should get the job done.
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I added that he has 9-A weapons. He already has a range edge I think prep time would be a pure stomp. So. Let us continue with what we have.

Can I get initial votes from everyone?
 
Unless he actually has 9-A weapons, can't really do that. That's the whole reason why I asked what's the AP difference from him to Mr. X. With the super range advantage, having lower AP but still enough to hurt him little by little makes things fairer, as he has to cross a lot of ground before he gets to him and is still gonna be burdened by Deadeye meaning a ton of bullets in his face, if not Shotgun shots.
 
LSirLancelotDuLacl said:
Unless he actually has 9-A weapons, can't really do that. That's the whole reason why I asked what's the AP difference from him to Mr. X. With the super range advantage, having lower AP but still enough to hurt him little by little makes things fairer, as he has to cross a lot of ground before he gets to him and is still gonna be burdened by Deadeye meaning a ton of bullets in his face, if not Shotgun shots.
Click to expand...
So I take it your voting Arthur than?

Also Leon did hurt Mr.X even with a lower AP so this fight is still fair. Did you read up because me and KLOL did do a lot of discussion of Arthur Morgans guns vs Tyrants limiter coat and such
 
Because I still don't see the evidence for 9-A. Either there is no 9-A or someone forgot to add it because it's quite clearly not pointed out in his profile

Last I saw, Leon decisively kills Mr. X with the Rocket Launcher, which seems to be put at High 8-C.

Asking someone that knows about RDR2 to clear out where Morgan's AP is placed with weapons would be a better choice.
 
Probably a good idea. Does anyone here know any RDR2 experts?

Also if not would 2 hours prep time (morgan is able to bring down a train i believe with prep time) be enough to make the battle fair? Or should we wait for soemone to clear out the AP
 
Could also make a thread in the questions and asking section or however was it called showing the dynamite level of power and asking if that should count for 9-A, or how high Arthur's weapons scale into 9-B.
 
Leon wasn't actually able to put down the Tyrant until he got a rocket launcher, the most you can manage in-game with whatever weapon you have prior to that is incapacitation, going by the original that's a win condition since it takes probably around one hour or so before he comes back, in the remake it's not because it only takes 30 seconds before he recovers.
 
AguilaR101 said:
Guns in the verse pulverize boulders provided they hit them with sufficent amount of bullets.

Explosives aren't that good at dealing damage compared to bullets since they're not concentrated, but ignoring that, he is most certainly not carrying around enough explosives to reach 9-A without prep-otherwise he'd be 9-A off the bat.
Click to expand...
It is weird how even though that feat shows even the standard weapons in RE can get into the 9-A range and RDR2 weapons are considered far more powerful that irl weapons that Arthur Morgan is not 9-A with his weapons himself.

Also given the abnormal size of the animals in RD shouldn't that classify as 9-A (seeing as large animals fall into that category)

I do not know something just seems weird about it all
 
LSirLancelotDuLacl said:
Even an adult Elephant falls into 9-B though. From lowest to the highest end, the difference is about 1395x or something like that.
Click to expand...
Yet for their sheer size they flatten cars with ease and can uproot trees.
 
Instead for some arbitrary measurement of what is 9-A, get those kind of feats calced and refer to the Attack Potency page.

A full speed tackle by an african bush Elephant can produce up to 125000 jules, or up to 125 kilojules, or up to 0.000,029,876 tons of force. The high end of 9-B is 0.005 tons - so not even close. You are not getting 9-A for punching one to death, simple as that.
 
But you are arbitraliry giving him 9-A without a proper CRT or calc, or knowledgeable member to back it up.

Evelyn brought up the abnormal size of the animals, I merely pointed out something as big as an elephant is far from even the middle of 9-B. Or how it's weird that the RD explosives get to High 8-C, forgetting that's heavy ordinance high explosives.

None of this suddenly justifies Morgan having 9-A.
 
LSirLancelotDuLacl said:
But you are arbitraliry giving him 9-A without a proper CRT or calc, or knowledgeable member to back it up.
Evelyn brought up the abnormal size of the animals, I merely pointed out something as big as an elephant is far from even the middle of 9-B. Or how it's weird that the RD explosives get to High 8-C, forgetting that's heavy ordinance high explosives.

None of this suddenly justifies Morgan having 9-A.
Click to expand...
Arthur is only At least 9-A via dynamite rolls, which require some prep-time. Which is why I suggested giving Morgan some prep to make this fight fair.

Wow, didn't know that RD explosives could get that high. But stuff like that didn't exist back in the 1890s.
 
And again, I know how much that destroyed, but is this backed up by literally anyone else? A feat can be lower on the scale than it looks.

And yep, just look at Leon's profile.
 
LSirLancelotDuLacl said:
And again, I know how much that destroyed, but is this backed up by literally anyone else? A feat can be lower on the scale than it looks.
Click to expand...
Blowing up bridges is flat-out 9-A though. Same goes for trains.
 
Do you think all bridges are the same size or the same weight? Or destroying a part is like destroying the whole of it? Or that blowing up a part is the same as the entire bridge falling on you?

Ask someone that knows to make sure, then we are talking.
 
LSirLancelotDuLacl said:
Do you think all bridges are the same size or the same weight? Or destroying a part is like destroying the whole of it? Or that blowing up a part is the same as the entire bridge falling on you?
Ask someone that knows to make sure, then we are talking.
Click to expand...
Therefir says that it's 9-A. I'd trust him because he's a calc member.

Even DMUA, who is proficient with his calcs, agrees it to being even slightly higher than 9-A.

Not to mention that even if the dynamite wasn't overpowered compared to the already-powerful 1-megajoule dynamite sticks of real life (Wikipedia is ze source), 21 of them would easily penetrate 9-A, an amount Arthur has no problems carrying around at any given time (The max he can hold is 99).
 
There's no good way to estimate it but it's definitely more then 9-B.
 
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