Code Geass: Regarding F.L.E.I.J.A.'s void manipulation and durability negation

[AKM sama]

I'll get directly to point. I have some problems regarding how F.L.E.I.J.A. is rated as a durability negating, void manipulating weapon. I went back to search for CRT's related to it but couldn't find any.

Basically, F.L.E.I.J.A. is a bomb created by Nina Einstein (a reference to atmoic bomb created by Albert Einstein), which uses nuclear fission and another mineral called sakuradite.

When fired, it creates a big sphere of explosion that completely obliterates everything within its area of effect, then collapses in on itself. There is no mention in the show that it ignores durability or the explosion uses any principle of void manipulation (whether it be turning targets to nothing, sending them to a void, or creating a literal void).

A bomb explosion that causes complete destruction of matter doesn't mean it has durability negation or void manipulation. It just means it is a very powerful bomb, unless there is evidence to prove otherwise.

Since these ratings lack any real evidence/justification for them, they should be removed from the respective profiles:

Suzaku Kururugi

Damocles

 

[Ogbunabali]

Yes this makes sense. I have no idea where the Void Manipulation comes from, the Durability Negation might be because of radiation or something though.

 

[Schnee_One]

This seems true

There was some other things regarding the movie I wanted to bring up, is that okay or should I make another thread

 

[AKM sama]

No spoilers please.

 

[AKM sama]

the Durability Negation might be because of radiation or something though.

There is no mention of any radiation in the canon. And the original justification for dura negation in the profile was that it completely destroys matter, which is true for any powerful bomb.

 

[Ogbunabali]

Well nuclear fission does release radiation so I thought that's the reason why dura negation is up there. Although it is true that they didn't mention anything about radiation in the show.

 

[Schnee_One]

No spoilers please.

Got it, can't discuss

 

[Shadowbokunohero]

It's been a while but isn't the term Destroying all matter destroying literally everything that the thing is made up of including the atoms and sub-particles?, Obviously the term could easily be seen as a wet blanket statement but the emphasis o matter oppose to "Destroying everything in the vicinity" makes me believe it's the former.

 

[AKM sama]

Well nuclear fission does release radiation so I thought that's the reason why dura negation is up there. Although it is true that they didn't mention anything about radiation in the show.

Yes, there is no radiation involved in the show. They even go take a walk in the middle of the detonation area right after the blast.

 

[AKM sama]

@Shadow That's just a huuuuuge stretch of a simple statement. We can't really go off of that assuming the best possible scenario when there isn't enough evidence. Literally every fiction is filled with statements that can be interpreted as something huge, this isn't new.

Occam's razor suggests the simple interpretation of the statement and extraordinary claims also require extraordinary evidence.

 

[Shadowbokunohero]

ehh I suppose

then I don't have a problem removing those abilities

 

[Yobo_Blue]

Wait a second here. No one was even messaged and these abilities are already being removed?

 

[Yobo_Blue]

The F.L.E.I.J.A. is said to complete annihlate all matter, leaving nothing behind. That's not something you can do with AP.

 

[AKM sama]

Eh? I created a CRT for this, and even messaged a knowledgeable staff member. I don't remember any CRT created for addition of these abilities though.

And I already addressed that point above.

 

[Yobo_Blue]

I must have missed that. Still, the bomb is obviously not a explosive. It's said to obliterate all matter. Doesn't use any explosive force as seen by its deployment, only affects that which it directly touches, leaves behind a total vacuum, and doesn't destroy mechs that have void resistance feats like the Lancelot. If that's not a obvious void manipulation ability, than nothing is.

 

[Yobo_Blue]

@Shadow That's just a huuuuuge stretch of a simple statement. We can't really go off of that assuming the best possible scenario when there isn't enough evidence. Literally every fiction is filled with statements that can be interpreted as something huge, this isn't new.

Occam's razor suggests the simple interpretation of the statement and extraordinary claims also require extraordinary evidence.

However, the issue here is that there is very clearly enough evidence.

 

[AKM sama]

The bomb clearly explodes as seen by the large sphere it forms, its range being limited and not causing any effect outside its range doesn't mean it's not an explosive and is no justification for what you're trying to prove. But that's besides the point.

Where does it say it leaves behind a total vacuum because of void manipulation? It only collapses in on itself, which is blatantly visible.

When did Lancelot ever come into its area of effect? And what is this void resistance feat you're talking about?

 

[Yobo_Blue]

It forms a large sphere, yes, but no actual specifics point to it being explosive, and the radius is referred to as a field rather than a blast radius or something similar. No explosive in existence has either of those qualities, so there is no reason to assume it has. And it doesn't affect things outside that field to any capacity, unlike bombs which without exception have those.

I'll see if I can find the quote, but it never explicitly says void Manipulation. Things do not have to be explicitly stated out loud for every feat, and no actual air is ever see being displaces or blown out like a actual explosion, just sucked in.

In the alternate timeline the Lancelot (of the same make and model mind you) tanked the Zero geass, which reduces all things to nothing. Not the most solid evidence, obviously, but it works as a supporting piece for the most part.

 

[AKM sama]

Yes, it doesn't work like a normal real life explosive would work. That's okay, doesn't prove anything though. Hence why I said it's beside the point.

Yes, please. Explicit evidence is needed for something like Void Manipulation. We can't slap that on everything based on certain far-stretched unfounded assumptions.

I'm only talking about the canon stuff here. Not that your point holds any relevance because Lancelot was never in the area of effect of the bomb.

 

[AguilaR101]

Are there any clips of how it works?

 

[AKM sama]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=exZ7M2HdOJA&t=67s

The explosion expands and vaporizes the buildings in its wake, then collapses in on itself, finally leaving a large crater at its area of effect.

 

[Damage3245]

I agree with removing those abilities.

Just given Suzaku Explosion Manipulation instead.

 

[Yobo_Blue]

Well, perhaps it can be calced then?

 

[AKM sama]

Yes, it should be calculated for complete vaporization. Are you willing to request it here?

 

[AKM sama]

I'd also like to question the other abilities that are listed as being durability negating without a proper CRT. These include Maser Vibration Sword and Radiant Wave Surger.

I didn't find any source hinting that these ignore conventional durability either.

• Maser Vibration Sword: A knife with extremely high oscillation rates and temperatures in order to increase the cutting effectiveness of the weapon that allows the Guren to more easily slice through opponents.
• Radiant Wave Surger: Her radiant wave surger allows her to destroy enemy Knightmare frames from a distance by making them bubble and burst.

You could make a case for Radiant Wave Surger as it causes a reaction in Knigtmare Frames causing the parts to expand and burst. But that only works on Knigtmare Frames, which are machines and doesn't ignore conventional durability of say another character who is much more durable.

 

[Yobo_Blue]

Why wouldn't it ignore the durability of any thing else besides Knightmares? It works by heating internal fluid. As for the first, heat and oscillation count as limited dura Negation iirc

 

[AKM sama]

Because Radiant Wave Surger is specifically made to work on Knightmares. It's exact mechanism is unknown but it looks like it heats the Knightmare Frame (which is metal and hence a conductor) causing its internal materials to expand and malfunction. And heating something from outside doesn't ignore the durability.

Heat and high oscillation rate just increase the cutting effectiveness, don't ignore durability (unless it's explicitly stated/proven to do so). Or every super sharp cutting attack (for example Krillin's Destructo Disc) would have limited dura neg by that logic. Moreover, Suzaku's MVS was blocked by the Guren's radiant shield anyway.

 

[Yobo_Blue]

I'll get back to this later

 

[AKM sama]

Bump