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Chrono series: Revival Discussion Thread

Giratina' world is the reflection, the opposite, its not just nothing outside everything, it's the nothing that is opposite everything. That is what is essential. Just being everything and a nothingness outside it is not going to work without explanation connecting the two as opposing elements.
The DBT here is basically the nothingness outside of the Dreams that make everything in existence, and deleted Dreams/Timelines go there to rot basically, and everything in the DBT gets reduced to nothing as well.

As Dreams are confirmed to make up dualities like beginning/end or love/hate (and the latter is explicitly created from the power of dreams, mind you), then I don't see why the DBT shouldn't get that as well.
 
The distortion world isn't just the nothingness outside everything, it is the reflection of everything, the reverse of everything, the opposite of everything, it is one of half of the duality of the Pokéverse. Unless the DBT has evidence towards a similar nature, then just being a nothingness outside everything won't be enough. Giratina's world isn't outside all dualties, it is part of all dualities. That is what the CRT is about.
 
The distortion world isn't just the nothingness outside everything, it is the reflection of everything, the reverse of everything, the opposite of everything, it is one of half of the duality of the Pokéverse. Unless the DBT has evidence towards a similar nature, then just being a nothingness outside everything won't be enough.
The DBT has that to be fair, as Lavos from there devours dreams on a daily basis.

Plus, everything in-the multiverse is already part of Zurvan, the very Sea of Dreams where existence and Dreams are generated, and the DBT is the Nonexistent void that is outside of it and where the deleted concepts (dreams) and timelines go.

I am not saying that the DBT qualifies only because it's a void, it qualifies because Dreams in Chrono are the basis of existence, including all the concepts and dualities, and the DBT is the non-existent counterpart of Zurvan where Dreams get erased.
 
The main ones which are necessary are:
  • Yakra
  • Ice I, Ice II and Flare
  • All the Lavos stuff I've mentioned above (excluding the Meteor given it's already rated)
  • The Black Hole
  • The Uplift thing
  • UltraNova (if you want to)
  • The CC Meteor stuff
  • Crono's Cyclone speed
  • Lavos crossing stars
  • Harle moving the Moon
  • Ayla's LS thing
  • Serge's LS thing
  • Frog's cloud split
Radical Dreamers stuff is all already covered form the Common Feats stuff lol, the fireball that vaporized 3 goblins is already this calc x3 basically.
To be clear, what keys would all of these scale to?
 
To be clear, what keys would all of these scale to?
Alright, so:

Chrono Trigger:
  • Early Game: Yakra's feat, Ice I and Cyclone's speed
  • Mid Game: Frog's cloud split, Flare and Ice II
  • Late Game: All of the Lavos' feats I've mentioned (including the crossing stars one) and the Chrono Cross' BlackHole (as Lynx is stronger than Peppor and a post game Lucca is implied to be able to fight him)
Chrono Cross:
  • Early Game: Uplift (AP is for the fodders tanking the piece of ground crashing on them, LS from that would only be through TK) and the Meteor (both AP and speed, latter is getting rated as Attack Speed)
  • Mid Game: MeteorShower (both AP and speed, latter is getting rated as Attack Speed), UltraNova, BlackHole, Harle's Moon feat and EarthQuake (I forgot to mention it, EarthQuake is mostly for LS though)
Chrono Cross end game is motly just the Tier 1 stuff so no need to calc much from there. The Serge LS feat pretty much scales to everyone, and the Ayla LS feat definitely does not as her and Robo are potrayed as the strongest CT party members in terms of physical strength to compensate their lack of magic, though people who are an absurdly higher level like anyone who scales to Tier 1 should scale from that imo.
 
Cyclone's speed isn't really anything btw, I'll give it a shot but it's probably not gonna be noteworthy at all
 
Frog feat is 7-B and Hypersonic

Also if the BlackHole stuff (For CT) is just an implication I'd keep it as a possibly at most, although I haven't seen the scans ofc
 
Also if the BlackHole stuff (For CT) is just an implication I'd keep it as a possibly at most, although I haven't seen the scans ofc
Alright, actually Lucca vs Lynx in itself does not really matter, as I said before, it's something that Peppor can already use. Lynx had to personally attack Lucca, and is the entire reason why Kid has Lynx rent free in her head, and said that Lynx has kidnapped her, which is also repeated from Crono's supposed ghost (though Lucca is implied to have been killed later) because of Lucca converting Robo's system in a "virus" which blocked FATE's access to the Frozen Flame.

Thus Lucca would still scale because of Lynx not sending whatever goon to kidnap her, but he had to do himself, implying that fodders like Peppor wouldn't be able to do so.

Though this is a way to pixel scale it, as Lynx has a confirmed height of 6'4" or 193.04 cm.
 
For the record I can give all the heights of the Chrono Cross playable characters:

 
Alright, actually Lucca vs Lynx in itself does not really matter, as I said before, it's something that Peppor can already use. Lynx had to personally attack Lucca, and is the entire reason why Kid has Lynx rent free in her head, and said that Lynx has kidnapped her, which is also repeated from Crono's supposed ghost (though Lucca is implied to have been killed later) because of Lucca converting Robo's system in a "virus" which blocked FATE's access to the Frozen Flame.

Thus Lucca would still scale because of Lynx not sending whatever goon to kidnap her, but he had to do himself, implying that fodders like Peppor wouldn't be able to do so.
Meh, I feel "Big bad guy kills someone" = "Big bad guy didn't think anyone else in his army could kill that someone" is kind of a logical leap. Maybe he just wanted to make sure she didn't run or simply wanted to be there- at best a "possibly" rating would work but honestly I'm not sure about that either.
 
Meh, I feel "Big bad guy kills someone" = "Big bad guy didn't think anyone else in his army could kill that someone" is kind of a logical leap. Maybe he just wanted to make sure she didn't run or simply wanted to be there- at best a "possibly" rating would work but honestly I'm not sure about that either.
I can understand this concern, yes. Though I think that a straight up or a likely/possibly can work anyway (though narratively it's obvious end game CT cast be above that trash come on).
 
That trash probably be large planet level

but yeah i just think it's better to keep it safe and keep a rating for the feats in CT proper
 
@StrymULTRA (kind of) important question, what's the hottest location that Ice 1 can be used in that you would still consider to be part of the "early game"?
 
but yeah i just think it's better to keep it safe and keep a rating for the feats in CT proper
About that, given that Lavos has the DNA of all living and not things in the past, present and future, wouldn't it make sense that Lavos can use it too? As BlackHole is not even a character-exclusive move, as all of the Black Innates can use it, and funnily enough, the move can be stolen from the Time Devourer as well.
 
By that logic wouldn't he be able to use the Low 1-C spell too?
I thought about that, and I think it's more linked to the fact that it's move that FATE can use thanks to it being linked to the Time Devourer's power through the Frozen Flame if anything, and Lynx can do so as well because of him being a physical avatar of FATE that was created from it.

Aka ForeverZero is more an exception here imho.
 
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Hm. I dunno, I guess it makes sense then. Personally I'd keep the Cross stuff as a likely when it comes to CT people but that's more of a subjective thing
 
I think Lavos should get all powers in verse ngl, now i'm sorry i need to disappear, Strym will going after my ass again
About that, I agree that almost all the moves that the playable and boss characters have should be a thing, alongside all the Elements (given the guy literally can create new body parts to use these moves lmfao), but stuff explicitly made to counter him like the Chrono Cross shouldn't (unless you count the CC bad ending where he absorbs it).
 
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All CC stuff possibly for CT dudes imo because i dont like it as much so sometimes i want to disregard it :HappyFrug:
 
Hm. I dunno, I guess it makes sense then. Personally I'd keep the Cross stuff as a likely when it comes to CT people but that's more of a subjective thing
About CT, I have found some things:
  • Ayla can use Boulder Toss, and that's the heaviest enemy I could find at that point of the game. Though I am unsure if Ayla should have an Early Game key, as she's recruited for the first time in a point pretty close to the Magus fight (which is where I separate Early and Mid Game personally), and only a bit later she becomes a permanent party member.
  • For Robo I am not sure anymore if him downscaling from Ayla's Ice LS feat is valid, given there's no direct proof, but I guess we can still scale him to this?
Also am I wrong or you've missed some calcs in the blog?
 
I'm not doing a few of them because they just wouldn't give anywhere near the other results. As for Boulder Toss, honestly with how high she throws it it might be higher than the ice one anyways. I don't have any opinions on whether she should have the early game key but if you can find the strongest mid/late game enemy for it, that'd be nice
 
I'm not doing a few of them because they just wouldn't give anywhere near the other results. As for Boulder Toss, honestly with how high she throws it it might be higher than the ice one anyways. I don't have any opinions on whether she should have the early game key but if you can find the strongest mid/late game enemy for it, that'd be nice
Wait, Flare how much would it be?
 
Somewhere in low tier 8 probably. Maybe just 9-A but probably not. I had a much bigger heat calc get 8-B so I'd be shocked if it got higher than that
 
Definitely not 8-A, but I could see it being like lower 8-B looks like 20 tons imo based on my experience with feats like White Album and Pet Shop's shit.
 
Ok yeah literally, just calced it and got 13.488811056080305 tons, and that was me being generous as ****. Chop like 10% off that.
 
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