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Canopus High 2-A
- Thread starter Yobo_Blue
- Start date
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Also, let's look up Higher-Dimensional Existence.
Canopus belong to a higher-world than all reality even the Admin system that has countless of admin like Polaris which would be 4-D. That is enough qualification that he would be 5-D to me.
Canopus belong to a higher-world than all reality even the Admin system that has countless of admin like Polaris which would be 4-D. That is enough qualification that he would be 5-D to me.
- Higher-Dimensional Existence on this wiki refers to characters who belong to higher worlds or planes of reality with a number of dimensions greater than three-dimensional universes.
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Well, you were the one who brought it up. Perhaps finish fixing the DeSu 2 profiles before discussing this?
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I don't like where this is going.
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well, gonna give some of my though : I think the profile Yobo made for Canopus is really great, going from what everyone have argreed in the discussion thread.
Since the judgement that i made about 3 years ago was quoted, it's should be noted in that time our dimensional tiering was working differently from how it's now. Back in those time, i was alway in the impression that the higher realm that define the lower ones is indeed Higher Dimension (Which in this case, Providence define the multiverse of Akasha Stratum). But time changes and hearing how the Higher Dimensional tiering actually works, now i'm not even sure what i said back then was correct. And i do not know what is the Chaos Force that Sera mentioned before, but i think it's description perfectly match the Providence. If we dont allow such force is 5-D, then surely the Providence should get the same treatment. But i'm not an physic expert so i will leave that to the actual expert to decide if Canopus High 2-A or not.
And i cant really understand why the administrators are treated as 4-D beings. Their 4-D time-space, fate, data powers come directly from the Heavenly Throne. If there's anything that Record Breaker taught us, it's that how weak is an administrator when they lost their right to govern the Throne. A good example is how Arcturus struggle to destroy a city, and he's lack power to do so, the best thing he could do is speed up the void to swallow the entire city.
And i think the Heavenly Throne/Akashic Record should get a downgrade, since it govern "countless" universes, not "infinite" number of universe. Countless could be "infinite", but it's could just also mean too many universe to count, so "possibly 2-A" would be better
Since the judgement that i made about 3 years ago was quoted, it's should be noted in that time our dimensional tiering was working differently from how it's now. Back in those time, i was alway in the impression that the higher realm that define the lower ones is indeed Higher Dimension (Which in this case, Providence define the multiverse of Akasha Stratum). But time changes and hearing how the Higher Dimensional tiering actually works, now i'm not even sure what i said back then was correct. And i do not know what is the Chaos Force that Sera mentioned before, but i think it's description perfectly match the Providence. If we dont allow such force is 5-D, then surely the Providence should get the same treatment. But i'm not an physic expert so i will leave that to the actual expert to decide if Canopus High 2-A or not.
And i cant really understand why the administrators are treated as 4-D beings. Their 4-D time-space, fate, data powers come directly from the Heavenly Throne. If there's anything that Record Breaker taught us, it's that how weak is an administrator when they lost their right to govern the Throne. A good example is how Arcturus struggle to destroy a city, and he's lack power to do so, the best thing he could do is speed up the void to swallow the entire city.
And i think the Heavenly Throne/Akashic Record should get a downgrade, since it govern "countless" universes, not "infinite" number of universe. Countless could be "infinite", but it's could just also mean too many universe to count, so "possibly 2-A" would be better
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If Canopus gets knocked down, then Brahman and YHVH get knocked down too. YHVH is High 2-A via cross-universe scaling to Canopus and Brahman's tier is based on YHVH's tier. I bet now the resistance force will show itself. I'm not trying to hear all that noise.
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I pretty sure Sonic's context was based on the pretext of the Choas being outside of space-time and many verses like DB from Demigra's space-time statement and also Xehanort's space-time statement didn't get 5-D from the beyond space-time statements. Canopus's case is that it is Exists even beyond the Devil Survivor 2 Multiverse is it a false analogy to say their case is similar.
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@Sera
yeah... i also dont understand why are we doing the cross-universe scailing Canopus to YHVH. Not only the hierachies dont match as all, the cosmologies also dont work really well.
in SMT series, the gods and demons exist because the human's observation define them, giving the concepts form and personalities to become what is called gods.
in DeSu2 series however, this is completely reversed. the human are defined by the datas that stored inside the Akashic Record, just like any other demon. They dont worship the administrators nor even acknowledge their existence. So the system of SMT is out of synch here. Which is why i dont argree the cross scailing in the first place. But that's just my opinion, what do you guy think ?
yeah... i also dont understand why are we doing the cross-universe scailing Canopus to YHVH. Not only the hierachies dont match as all, the cosmologies also dont work really well.
in SMT series, the gods and demons exist because the human's observation define them, giving the concepts form and personalities to become what is called gods.
in DeSu2 series however, this is completely reversed. the human are defined by the datas that stored inside the Akashic Record, just like any other demon. They dont worship the administrators nor even acknowledge their existence. So the system of SMT is out of synch here. Which is why i dont argree the cross scailing in the first place. But that's just my opinion, what do you guy think ?
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The idea is that YHVH as the main antagonist and omnipotent god of the MegaTen multiverse, he should be superior to the likes of Canopus. The only exceptions are Digital Devil Saga (due to Brahman, another possible avatar of the Axiom), and Persona (due to spawning from SMT if, a what if scenario where the events of SMT 1 never happened and therefore YHVH's influence is immensely weak there).
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@Elizhaa
i see. If that is correct then i see no problem for Canopus having "possibly High 2-A" in his stat
i see. If that is correct then i see no problem for Canopus having "possibly High 2-A" in his stat
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Yes, i do know that the reason why YHVH having alot of abilities from Canopus. But unlike Persona, we have no clue on whether DeSu2 has any relation with the rest of Megaten franchise, DeSu2 is pretty much it's own thing. But if someone can proven otherwise then i will gladly accept thisSera EX said:
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Matt (who knows his ish when it comes to SMT) also mentioned in the old YHVH vs. Canopus fight, that SMT 4 Final implies that the entire MegaTen cosmology is part of YHVH, this seems to be especially true to his higher dimensional nature. The only difference is YHVH's influence is not the same in every universe, due to him being dependent on humanity's faith in him.
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Devil Survivor 2 is definitely part of the overarching MegaTen Multiverse, considering the Abyss / Expanse is mentioned a handful of times in it, there is even a trio of Jack Frosts who mention that they ended up in the DeSu2 world by travelling through the Demon World, IIRC.
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The only two Mega Ten sub-series out of YHVH's influence are Persona and likely Digital Devil Saga.
In the former's case I go into a lot more detail as to what happened that made Persona branch off from mainline MegaTen cosmology in my upcoming blawg. It's a very interesting story ^u^
In the former's case I go into a lot more detail as to what happened that made Persona branch off from mainline MegaTen cosmology in my upcoming blawg. It's a very interesting story ^u^
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UWU
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- Thread starter
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On the subject of Arcturus, the man is definitely not 7-B. He shows the main powers of the administrator (void deletion and information manipulation), and is superior to lower Triangulum who have 2-A scaling.
Its also important to note that the city in question is protected by the Dragon Stream, which decimated Septentriones like nothing and is far more powerful than a endgame Yamato. And he did it far faster than Polaris ever did while it was being used by Miyako, who is better at using it and is weaker than it despite having casual 2-A feats.
Its also important to note that the city in question is protected by the Dragon Stream, which decimated Septentriones like nothing and is far more powerful than a endgame Yamato. And he did it far faster than Polaris ever did while it was being used by Miyako, who is better at using it and is weaker than it despite having casual 2-A feats.
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- Thread starter
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As for YHVH having things that Canopus does, probably. YHVH has a higher level of omnipresence across greater area, and its noted to be pretty much impossible to best him in anyway without a Messiah (who should probably get resistances to the stuff Four Prime Factor has btw)
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- Thread starter
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Look, I don't want to be rude, and I know this is going to be sound overtly hostile, so I apologize in advance but...Elizhaa said:
Holy **** what part of "that scan means nothing on its own" didn't you understand? Just putting the same thing as the argument over and over again is a classic Ad Hominem that meets zilch here.
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If you do believe it this is fair, it is your opinion, Yobo. Many notable fans believe it does and likewise the rating is still supported by Higher-Dimensional Existence definition. It is nowhere near a Fallacy like ad hominen, both opinions are valid, but 5-D would be more valid from our wiki definitions of Higher-Dimensional Existence, the fact there no contradictions in the story as Canopus is stongest characters out of countless admins who should scale to Polaris who is At least 2-A, and by Occam's Razor.
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I feel like "At least 2-A, possibly High 2-A" would be better.
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Also, doesn't this downgrade YHVH as well?
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Perhaps we need more staff input then?
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well,you already has my approve for "possibly High 2-A" Canopus and his profile. And i am convinced about the relation between DeSu2 and adminisyrator topic
And since we're still on the topic "5-D Providence", i remember someone had told me that since the 5th dimension is where the abstract concepts are visible and that's fit with Providence since the 4 prime concepts are visible (and can get punched by the cast). But i though this evidence is pretty weak since it had never been brought up by the characters. But what do you guy think ?
And since we're still on the topic "5-D Providence", i remember someone had told me that since the 5th dimension is where the abstract concepts are visible and that's fit with Providence since the 4 prime concepts are visible (and can get punched by the cast). But i though this evidence is pretty weak since it had never been brought up by the characters. But what do you guy think ?
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Providence world: https://youtu.be/OSB7R4tXP6g
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