Calcs Implementation

[KobsterHope07]

So, is everyone okay updating Enel's page and the verse page with the new calculation

 

[Mr.Cinos15]

Yeah, it should be fine.

 

[CinCameron20]

@Whis - Doflamingo is greatly underestimated simply by losing to Luffy and due to Cracker and Katakuri simply performing better against his Bound Man transformation, I think. Personally, the only one who I think is definitively "stronger" over-all is Katakuri, but that's another topic. It'd be a whole essay to try and discuss it, really, but I'm just gonna touch on Cracker.

Ignoring the hot mess that is the anime, Cracker simply outlasted Bound Man just like Doflamingo did, and we know it took Luffy's strongest attack at the time (KKG, and he even recognized how Kong Gun was no where near enough to take Doffy out). Cracker hadn't taken a single blow the entire fight from what we've seen, yet a single attack from Tank Man KO'd him. It's not a fair comparison to say "Hey, Luffy used a new form, meaning Cracker had to be stronger" when Gear 4th transformations are specialized in specific areas: Bound-Man is more of a juggernaut with a balance in both power and speed, Tank-man is ... a Tank, Snake-man is an aggressor with high speed and focus on homing attacks.

• And besides, their respective performance against Luffy says nothing about what would happen if each of them came into contact. Doflamingo has a severe advantage in DF ability at the bare minimum due to compatibility and environmental manipulation as opposed to Cracker's shown power.

Kuma has no justification. Boa Hancock is like Law in terms of hacks--she just needs to land one strike and bam, she either insta-wins or has a serious advantage (unless Doffy defends with Haki). Is she stronger? Unknown. Can she cope with Doflamingo's attacks and not risk taking damage? Unknown. Can she win in close quarters? Again, unknown.

For Jinbe, yes he has a feat against Big Mom, but she was physically affected by her hunger, so to assume she was near full power at the time would be folly. Not to mention Jinbe was still overpowered, and even one of his strongest shown attacks merely pushed her back and didn't seem to actually hurt her. Ace actually does have a feat against Aokiji, and he did clash with Akainu, but that's it.

• If we're talking feats, Doflamingo openly challenged Sengoku, Aokiji (and was even about to fight him if not for the whole Law/Caesar situation), and Fujitora (again, ready to fight on the spot)

Doflamingo used his threads on Jozu--it's not hax. One method of his manipulation is via Parasito, which we don't even know if he used (very likely he didn't because he has only ever employed it within the Bird-Cage the 3 times we've seen it), where the other method is treating his opponent like a marionette, which he did against Luffy and specific targets he wanted control over (Parasito is more random and automatic). Luffy could overpower the threads and break them. Jozu was stuck in place and couldn't free himself.

Doflamingo has the following feats to support him: 1) He stopped Jozu and kept him in place despite the fact that his threads have been broken by Gear 4th Luffy quite easily, suggesting he is at least comparable if not superior to Jozu--at least with his threads (Still took quite a number of blows from Gear 4th Luffy while injured, so it scales to his physical durability as well), and 2) He tanked and broke from Aokiji's ice. While an argument can be made that Aokiji merely did it as a warning, he had no justification for holding back as he owed Doffy nothing, and was aiming to save Smoker. and 3) (This only matters if Fujitora scales higher in the future), Fujitora could do absolutely nothing about Doflamingo's Bird Cage, and he also left Luffy to deal with him despite a) the citizens were in danger if Doflamingo was left unchecked, meaning he had no obligation to sit back and watch, and b) he had already threatened to have Doflamingo dealt with to his face, so he obviously had very little against trying to take Doflamingo out right there.

• Not to mention Doflamingo got nerfed hard by Law. Bound Man Luffy couldn't take out a weakened Doffy, and required the strongest attack to actually pull it off.
  • Also, also, Diamante asks about dealing with the marines due to them being within the cage, and Doflamingo points out that they made a deal (which Fuji obv broke), and that after the coliseum + SH alliance was dealt with, he would deal with Fujitora (despite admitting it would be no easy feat)

But a side-note: Current Wano Luffy post-training would absolutely defeat Doflamingo, Katakuri, and Cracker in combat at this point. There's just no argument for them anymore. He mastered the technique he learned fighting Katakuri, he acquired hax, and he can fire off a KKG on a whim--the same attack that overpowered Doffy's strongest attack and defense that we know of very easily. Yeah, rip Doffy hype.

 

[CinCameron20]

Overall, ignoring performance against Luffy (Strictly focusing on POWER [Though a case like Luffy's KKG is a one-time use in Dressrosa, which is a factor why he's lower than he would be in general] and no strategy) here's my opinion currently:

Yonko > OG 3 Admirals ?/>/= Monkey D Luffy (Post Udon Training) > Katakuri/Doflamingo (Top Commanders) >/= Ace/Jinbe > Dressrosa Luffy/Jozu/Cracker.

Current Admirals (Except Kizaru duh) have nothing to compare them to anyone on this list, especially if Sabo and G3 Luffy have evidently caused Fujitora issues.

 

[Tetsucabrah]

I agree with Cin

 

[KobsterHope07]

I have updated Enel's profile and the Verse Page with the new Enel's calculation

 

[Mr.Cinos15]

Nice, what else do we have to talk about?

 

[KobsterHope07]

Nice, what else do we have to talk about?

Besides talking about Thriller Bark characters like Zoro, Brooks, and Sanji in relations to the Ursa Shock feat and work out some scaling for the arc, not much else.

 

[Damage3245]

I believe I have a method for calculating their durability in relation to the Ursa Shock, but scaling the distances between the characters is the difficult part.