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Bloons Tower Defense Profiles

The Smashor said:
Also, anyone who can single-handedly take down a BFB should scale to the Sun Avatar, since they struggle to do that.

Anyone who can solo ZOMGs can scale to a Sun Temple without sacrifices for the same reasons.
Click to expand...
I'm 100% against this. Lore wise both towers are noted as being massively above the rest. We shouldn't scale anything to them without good reason.
 
I disagree with your disagreeing.

The original Sun God (BTD4 and 5) just uses some poetry and says something vague about "Fearing no bloon". The Sun Temple/Temple of the Monkey God are just considered to have "Awesome" and "Incredible" power. Literally nothing implies that the Sun Avatar is immensely above everyone else, especially with another tower being an "Avatar" of something (The Druid's Avatar of Wrath Upgrade). The True Sun God just has things in all caps and "Awesome" again.

The only difference between these towers and every other tower is them being connected to the True Sun God, who isn't even the strongest charcter in the verse (This being the "Vengeful Monkey" that the AotVM is the avatar of)

We don't assume Magnus is stupidly below the bosses who are gods in Kid Icarus just because they're gods. What is and isn't a god means almost nothing in fiction at this point. We literally have a 10-B god character, heck, a 10-C god character.
 
The original Sun God (BTD4 and 5) just uses some poetry and says something vague about "Fearing no bloon".

Sure, but we know from BMC that the Temple is canonically much stronger than any other tower, at least Tier 4 wise. I guess there's a possibility for the avatar, but I'm against a hard rating when such scaling would put the towers massively above their respective feats.
 
Since I'm finished (more or less) with the Special Agents (letting Walker do Watermelon Spitter though I'm not sure of the quality), I was going to look at working on the Bloons pages tomorrow morning when I have time.
 
Well as a note 4D no longer means High 3-A or Tier 2 automatically. There needs to be supporting evidence that the object is capable of effecting something on that scale. If it doesn't that evidence then it's just whatever tier it fits in.
 
Qawsedf234 said:
Sure, but we know from BMC that the Temple is canonically much stronger than any other tower, at least Tier 4 wise.
Click to expand...
Not really. The description of the building that lets you use the temple just says it requires immense investment.
 
Qawsedf234 said:
Well as a note 4D no longer means High 3-A or Tier 2 automatically. There needs to be supporting evidence that the object is capable of effecting something on that scale. If it doesn't that evidence then it's just whatever tier it fits in.
Click to expand...
Pretty sure it would count, but as already stated it would be an outlier so this isn;t really necessary discussion
 
The Smashor said:
Not really. The description of the building that lets you use the temple just says it requires immense investment.
Click to expand...
It says

  • The Temple of the Monkey God requires immense investment both financial and spiritual. The Temple Complex is a hub of devotion, mediation and study of bloon destruction techniques unrivaled by any other Monkey institution.
Unrivaled destruction techniques gives me the impression that its canonically the strongest tower in-universe up to that point.
 
I suppose that makes sense. However, this is contradicted by how much damage they do to the blimps compared to other towers.
 
Lore should take precedence over gameplay. Else we'd have all the Pokemon be Tier 2 due to gameplay mechanics. Having Tier 5 towers that can solo stuff the Temple can't is maybe reson for a "possibly 6-B" rating, same with the Sun Avatar, but I'm not for just hard scaling everyone up to Country busting
 
Qawsedf234 said:
Lore should take precedence over gameplay. Else we'd have all the Pokemon be Tier 2 due to gameplay mechanics. Having Tier 5 towers that can solo stuff the Temple can't is maybe reson for a "possibly 6-B" rating, same with the Sun Avatar, but I'm not for just hard scaling everyone up to Country busting
Click to expand...
Well, again. The only two towers that show the same level of strength (beating ZOMGs) are the Submarine and the Alchemist. Alchemist has already been marked off as hax since it's his transmutation potions, so it doesn't apply to AP, but Submarine's First Strike Capability is basically the absolute pinnacle of bloon-popping weaponry Monkey-kind has to offer (disregarding Super Monkey's cyborg path)
 
So, here's my WIP Bloons profile. I'll add more images later just so I don't spam the image section with several dozen pictures of Bloons at once.

Though BATTD is it's own game separate from the rest of the TD series, I added the attributes from that game since only the Shielded provides a stat difference, though the Shielded from BSM2 trumps it anyways, which I'll discuss in a moment.

First of all, my plans for the Bloon Bosses are that, like the Wizard Lord (BTD), they'll be their own separate profiles. I'll work on them AFTER the Bloons profile is 100% completed, so I have a sense of scale.


But then comes the question of how to address the Bloons from the "Bloons" and "Bloons Super Monkey" series. Are they just being treated the same as the standard Bloons? How would they be listed on the profile? Would the Golden Bloon from Super Monkey 2 just be added on top of the Golden Bloon from BTD6? How will the Bloon Bosses from BSM have their attacks addressed? Will the Dart Monkey and Super Monkey from those games get their own profile?


  • Also, I realized that the Bloons Supermonkey 2 Mobile version is completely different, so I'll go through that later as well
 
A few things.

Rainbow Bloons lack the resistances of Whites, Blacks and Zebras.

Being made of metal dosn't give you Metal Manipulation. Same with Earth Manipulation for Ceramics.

Ceramics are not immune to glue, at least I think

MOABS lost their Glue resistance in BTD6.

ZOMGs just have enough durability to tank most of those abilities, though they should have resistance to Existence Erasure since that's what Annihilate is. The BAD should have that, too.

Syphon Funding is just statistice reduction. The extra money thing is definately not Mathematics Manipulation.

BTD6 ghost bloons are probably non-canon since their only in Sandbox mode

As for the other stuff, I don't exactly know how Bloons and BSM would fit into the profiles. Probably another key.
 
Rainbow Bloons lack the resistances of Whites, Blacks and Zebras.

Could have sworn I saw it, but looking back over, you're right.

Being made of metal dosn't give you Metal Manipulation. Same with Earth Manipulation for Ceramics.

Got it.

Ceramics are not immune to glue, at least I think

They can't be slowed down by glue in BTD4 and BTD5 Flash, but if I'm not doing composite, then got it.

MOABS lost their Glue resistance in BTD6.

Huh, didn't recall seeing that. Probably missed it. But if I'm not doing composites, I'll remove it

ZOMGs just have enough durability to tank most of those abilities, though they should have resistance to Existence Erasure since that's what Annihilate is. The BAD should have that, too.

Well, some of the abilities are specifically stated to deal less damage to them

Syphon Funding is just statistice reduction. The extra money thing is definately not Mathematics Manipulation.

Got it

BTD6 ghost bloons are probably non-canon since their only in Sandbox mode

Yeah, I wasn't really sure if I should address them or not, so I just did for now, since I knew I'd be getting the profile checked a few times.

As for the other stuff, I don't exactly know how Bloons and BSM would fit into the profiles. Probably another key.

That's what I was assuming. Main question is just whether or not I combine the Golden Bloons into one or keep them separate.
 
Probably keep them seperate. In fact, probably don't use BSM Golden Bloons since aside from being kind of fast they just provide a power-up
 
Updated my Bloons blog. Got all the bosses from Super Monkey.


Everyone still lacks stats, but what can you do.
 
Only stuff left would be calcing the True Sun God and the AotVM.
 
Also the towers that lack profiles.

By the way, should we have BFB durability be 4x MOAB durability, ZOMG durability be 4x BFB durability, etc...?

It makes sense that they would at least be equal to the sum of their parts, and their in-game health frankly makes this a lowball. Most towers that can take out a BFB can casually take down MOABs, so it seems pretty consistant.
 
That's basically why I stopped working on the Bloons pages. Didn't know how to do the stats.


well... that and being gone for two weeks.


I'll have access to a computer soon, so I'll start working on it again then.
 
So, I was looking at some common feats and I looked over the Freezing Humans calc...


Though Snap Freezing obviously negates durability, shouldn't the Ice Monkey have "Possibly Small Building Level" added to the profile since the artwork for its upgrades consistently shows the Ice Monkey freezing not only Bloons but also itself in massive blocks of ice?
 
You would need to calc the ice first since the monkies and bloons are so tiny.
 
Not to mention that freezing water is most of the feat. And Bloons don't have water.
 
Well, I was more thinking about the monkey anyways. Just thought I'd bring up the Bloons since their ice blocks are bigger relative to the Bloons, especially in mass numbers.
 
So, this is interesting. It turns out Game of Thrones had talked to Bloons about making a crossover game back before GoT was really popular, but it was turned down
 
I think that looks okay.


Also, I just want to note that my estimates for the banana trees in-game are interesting
 
Robot972 said:
So...

Just gonna put this here for reference.
Click to expand...
What are you going to calc?

Also the Quincy profile looks pretty good. If you're not sure with 9-A durability you may want to make it "At least 9-B" or something.
 
Could someone else see if they're able to upload the remaining images I'm missing?

I can't tell if it's the actual images or just the computers I have access to sucking, but they're saved to the computers as a format I can't use (despite being .png)

Sprockets, Sentry Expert, the different Sentries for SE, Sentry Paragon, Cleansing Foam, and XXL Trap
 
I think the linked format in the source version of the page is messed up. So there's not a valid image for the tabs or something.
 
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