Bleach: Las Noches' Size 2.0

[Xulrev]

To be fair to IMade:

His sole argument the entire time from my tenure here has been 'Seireitei visuals are inconsistent', not 'All Bleach visuals are inconsistent'; and I 100% agree that the Seireitei is blatantly drawn differently almost every aerial shot.

Las Noches is pretty visually consistent from my recollection and going through the chapters quickly to check; I think having a strict standard and upholding it is fine, but the impetus for that standard (consistency) needs to met in all cases before moving forward.

 

[Sekkonds.]

Bump

 

[TataHakai]

Las Noches would then have a length of 225 km, a width of 135 km and a height of 84.375 km

Using these measurements Would put destroying las noches at 12 petatons of TNT if we use vaporization by the way, which is an obvious outlier

Now let me look through the chapters and see if Imade is correct, i suggest others do the same too if they really want to know for themselves

 

[Dangai_Ichigo]

Las Noches would then have a length of 225 km, a width of 135 km and a height of 84.375 km

Using these measurements Would put destroying las noches at 12 petatons of TNT if we use vaporization by the way, which is an obvious outlier
Now let me look through the chapters and see if Imade is correct, i suggest others do the same too if they really want to know for themselves

Unless the Power Cliffing is strong...

 

[Naeblis495]

considering that it took zangetsu to take ulquiorra out i don't think it would be an outlier , it would just apply to very few characthers .

 

[Ovy7]

What about pulverization? How high would that be?

 

[TataHakai]

What about pulverization? How high would that be?

105 Teratons, Large Country level, like 10x the Gremmy/Shikai kenpachi feat

"considering that it took zangetsu to take ulquiorra out i don't think it would be an outlier , it would just apply to very few characthers ."

It's by far the best feat in the series for 600 chapters, the next feat comparable to it is SK Yhwach, it's an outlier dude

 

[AnonymousBlank]

Not really when the only people it scales to exist in what is basically a vacuum and the only other feats said characters scale to are all much higher.

 

[Sigurd_Snake_in_The_Eye]

ƒñö the most visually impressive ability which is spammable is an outlier?

 

[Sekkonds.]

Top tiers scale to country level..a top-tier character has country/multi-Cont feat

Not sure if that's actually an outlier

 

[Sigurd_Snake_in_The_Eye]

Well it's not like he gets to decide if it is or not, we'll discuss it whenever the time comes.

 

[AnonymousBlank]

High 6-A is very different from the current Low 6-B/6-B stuff. That being said, Lanza scales to SE Ulq (performs the feat), HM Zangetsu (no sells the attack), Dangai Ichigo (stronger than Zangeetsu), Monster Aizen (harms Dangai) and the TYBW god tiers (already scaling to a higher feat).

Edit: We should probably stop derailing this thread though. Lets just go back to discussing how to get the proportions of LN.

 

[DragonEmperor23]

Have we come to a consensus on this?

 

[Dangai_Ichigo]

Have we come to a consensus on this?

Maybe... Maybe not...

Characters who scale to Lanza : SE Ulquiorra (Did the Attack and can likely spam it and use it as a weapon), Weakened VL Ichigo/Zangetsu, Unohana, Yammy in his strongest state (Literally stated to be stronger than Ulquiorra, Grimmjow and Nnoitora together), Aizen (Literally is said to be stronger than all of the Espada), Yamamoto (Stronger than everyone in the FKT Arc), Merged Zangetsu (Fused with VL Zangetsu and stated by Ichigo to be stronger than him), Dangai Ichigo (Fought Merged Zangetsu for three months even with a power gap between them), Monster Aizen (Kept up with and even injured Dangai Ichigo) and really high Top Tiers (Like Gerard for example)

People who might scale as well : Barragan, Starkk, Shunsui, Ukitake, Cien Granz, Zaraki Kenpachi (Post Yammy fight and Azashiro fight)

 

[IMadeThisOn8-1-2017]

Using these measurements Would put destroying las noches at 12 petatons of TNT if we use vaporization by the way, which is an obvious outlier

Now let me look through the chapters and see if Imade is correct, i suggest others do the same too if they really want to know for themselves

Nothing every fully vaporizes Las Noches.

The original Gran Rey Cero, Cero Oscuras and Lanza calc had different methods:

Gran Rey Cero: Calc'd destruction of Las Noches.

Cero Oscuras: Calc'd vaporization of the shaved portion of Las Noches' roof.

Lanza: Random methods of moving sand.

Also, Las Noches destruction needs to account for hollowness.

Also it can't be an outlier given those who we can confirm for scaling exist in a vacuum.

 

[TataHakai]

I already accounted for hollowness

Also isn't Lanza like REALLY far from Las noches? I've always found the perspective to be kinda weird in that regard

So which ones are Vaporization? Just Cero Oscuras?, and in that case which ones are used for Gran rey cero and Lanza?

 

[Dangai_Ichigo]

I already accounted for hollowness
Also isn't Lanza like REALLY far from Las noches? I've always found the perspective to be kinda weird in that regard

So which ones are Vaporization? Just Cero Oscuras?, and in that case which ones are used for Gran rey cero and Lanza?

Cero Oscuras is a chaddier version of GRC, which is already a chaddy version of a regular Cero and well I guess we could just account Pulverization for Lanza as nothing extremely ridiculous happened except a giant shockwave bringing all that sand and ripping apart one of the giant pillars from miles away

 

[AnonymousBlank]

The distance Lanza goes is actually pretty far considering it went past the horizon as seen from km up in the air.

 

[Dangai_Ichigo]

Well... Ceros can murder people to death

 

[TataHakai]

So are we using fragmentation for the destruction of Las noches?

 

[Dangai_Ichigo]

I guess ? But it kinda depends

 

[TataHakai]

Well if we're not using Vaporization, since there's no visuals and only statements it'd probably be best to use Fragmentation

It should come to Around Low 6-B

 

[USklaverei]

I do not think it makes sense to use fragmentation, since the Cero Oscuras is clearly vaporizing.

 

[Dangai_Ichigo]

I do not think it makes sense to use fragmentation, since the Cero Oscuras is clearly vaporizing.

To be fair Cero Oscuras is a really amped up version of a regular Cero... So maybe a regular Cero does a Fragmentation while a Cero Oscuras vaporizes stuff ?

 

[IMadeThisOn8-1-2017]

Gran Rey Cero destroying Las Noches should use the standard destruction statement method. I assume Tata would know which it is.

Cero Oscuras is the only one that would use vaporization and only the vaporized portion of Las Noches' roof. I can link me discussing this with Soldier Blue even.

I can't speak on Lanza since I don't know what's being calc'd in that, the sand moving? However, it does go past the horizon despite the characters being on top of Las Noches looking over the horizon.

 

[Dangai_Ichigo]

Gran Rey Cero destroying Las Noches should use the standard destruction statement method. I assume Tata would know which it is.
Cero Oscuras is the only one that would use vaporization and only the vaporized portion of Las Noches' roof. I can link me discussing this with Soldier Blue even.

I can't speak on Lanza since I don't know what's being calc'd in that, the sand moving? However, it does go past the horizon despite the characters being on top of Las Noches looking over the horizon.

What is the standard statement method of destruction ?


The winds being blown by it and I guess the fact it still had enough force to rip a chunk of the pillar in Las Noches. Also didn't that sand also hit Las Noches and traveled all the way to the ceiling ?

 

[TataHakai]

Since we have no visuals of the supposed destruction it's best to use Frag or V frag

Fragmentation would give a result of Low 6-B whilst V frag would be 6-B

This would apply to both the GRC and Transformations for 1-4 i assume?

The Lanza i'm not sure about, Cero oscuras will likely be around 6-B since that one will use vaporization i think

 

[Dangai_Ichigo]

Yes, that would apply to both as Ulquiorra literally says that in the same sentence


If you look at bit to the left you can see it completely shattered a castle in half that was "close by"
And that wasn't due to the actual blast... Or was it ?

 

[Dangai_Ichigo]

And I just got the colored panel, here :

 

[AnonymousBlank]

@IMade

From what I remember, Soldier was calcing the horizon based on the group's elevation on the dome to get the distance of the explosion from them, the speed of Ulq's throw and the blast required to cause enough wind speed to move such volumes of sand as high as it did at the previously calced distance.

 

[USklaverei]

We know the explosion raised a lot of sand and dragged it to Las Noches, I calculated that and it gave High 6-A, but I think it has other ways of calculating.

 

[Dangai_Ichigo]

We know the explosion raised a lot of sand and dragged it to Las Noches, I calculated that and it gave High 6-A, but I think it has other ways of calculating.

...Nani...

 

[IMadeThisOn8-1-2017]

Since we have no visuals of the supposed destruction it's best to use Frag or V frag

Fragmentation would give a result of Low 6-B whilst V frag would be 6-B

This would apply to both the GRC and Transformations for 1-4 i assume?

The Lanza i'm not sure about, Cero oscuras will likely be around 6-B since that one will use vaporization i think

Whichever is more standard for an unknown would be best imo.

GRC actually applies to every Espada. Only they can use it and it's banned for any of them to use.

 

[IMadeThisOn8-1-2017]

Who's making the calcs then?

 

[Politebunny7]

So is this agreed on?

 

[Amlad22]

All I'm saying is that these calcs being far above the Gremmy 6-B calc shows that the original High 6-A version should be brought back and used for consistency. There's no reason to call it an outlier anymore.

 

[AnonymousBlank]

Depends how it was calculated. Iirc, the problem was Seireitei's size being inconsistent and thus we had dozens of calcs with different methods to calc the size of it, the meteor, KE from space, just the atmosphere and finally statements.

We settled on the last one as the size is consistent and simply took Gremmy's stated intent to destroy Seireitei with the meteor as our figures to calc the required yield.

Personally I never understood not using the comparison of the meteor and the Seireitei and just calcing from there with the 4km/s speed. Before people call Schroedingers Kubo, I am not saying we should do anything. We finally got that arc sorted for the most part so **** even touching that shit again for at least a year. That said, how bad do people really think Kubo is at drawing to scale that he can't draw a ball next to another ball with roughly correct proportions?

 

[Amlad22]

I've never understood the logic either. Just because Gremmy said the meteor is destroying Seireitei means it can't destroy anything outside of the walls??? Everyone was so set on bleach top tiers not being High 6-A tho so it was whatever. Now that it's not an outlier to have them that high though I think it's worth looking at the old High 6-A calcs again.

 

[IMadeThisOn8-1-2017]

Old calc was bad since it cross-referenced multiple panels even when the panels displayed the meteor as probably a km in diameter at best which would make it only 6-C due to mass.

>That said, how bad do people really think Kubo is at drawing to scale that he can't draw a ball next to another ball with roughly correct proportions?

Incredibly since he never does it.

 

[Dangai_Ichigo]

Old calc was bad since it cross-referenced multiple panels even when the panels displayed the meteor as probably a km in diameter at best which would make it only 6-C due to mass.
>That said, how bad do people really think Kubo is at drawing to scale that he can't draw a ball next to another ball with roughly correct proportions?


Incredibly since he never does it.

I think it only happens when he's trying to draw really large stuff like cities and islands and such, something as simple as a ball shouldn't be a problem