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BB (Fate) revision

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"Due to taking over the Moon Cell and its ability to simulate countless timelines along with its ability to explicitly transfer to any one of an infinite number of timelines, she would probably be closer to 2-B or 2-A if this upgrade goes through." -Rep

That's what he said here of what BB would be at. Again, this would depend all on whether this gets through or everything stays the same...or some things pass and others don't.

Also @Cal, you're not explaining a bit of why you said it would be of another tier than one that points out to another.
 
@Cross Between 2-B and 2-A sounds about right. I'm content with either if this goes through. In terms of what would go through and what wouldn't though, if it does go through I'd think it's safe to assume Gilgamesh will be placed alongside her so, what would be done to the other 3 and all the types? How would they scale/be placed?

  • ofc they'd scale off BB but around where would they be tiered?*
 
With all due respect, let's please try to avoid fighting in public. None of us are perfect, but if there are problems, we can talk about them via PMs in private. Thank you.
 
@Ant: If our staff can actually bother maybe make a sort of explanation rather than one line or one word or two (Though at least Cal bothered to do something of it but still), i'll stop then.
 
Well, we are not perfect, and are bound to make mistakes, but most of us have spent a lot of time trying to take care of this wiki, so let's all please try to stick together. Thank you.
 
@Aizenishere: I'm not sure still of that. I'm fine as to whether we do scale or just don't (I'm pretty well-rounded to anything depending on how it is like and all here). It just depends strongly on what others say.

Hence why i said i'm of the neutral here. But if i do had to say of which, i'm more of slightly (just slightly) leaning to no and keeping things as is but only to keep the ratings as "safe" and "stable" as possible.
 
The problem has already been perfectly summarized by Reppuzan and the other staff agains this: These "feats" are all outliers. BB's best destructive feats are 5-B and she is a complete fodder to a huge number of characters who haven't demonstrated anything beyond 5-A, and are at the very best 4-B.

This is not the same issue as Castlevania, don't even try using that as an argument. In that series Belmonts defeating Dracula are the main plot.

The issue here is akin to having a series where everyone is Wall level and where bullets are very much a real threat, and suddenly a character who isn't even that strong defeats a Reality Warping Planet-buster.

The feats are not compatible, and BB's feats have to be considered outliers because of her relatively low position within the Nasuverse. She is not a Higher-Dimensional or Multiversal threat, specially since she has demonstrated no cosmic feats beyond simple hearsay. It is pure speculation.
 
@Cross

I'm also not sure if this can or should go through given what it would do to general power-scaling, but I agree that I'd appreciate more than one-sentence zero-context opinions.

Regardless, I feel we should wait until the rest of the Nasuverse supporters show up because this is pretty important.
 
@Matthew: Much better. I feel less grouchy now, thank you.

@Rep: Yeah, that's my main issue of there as i feel of the need to hear also of those that...also, know this verse as well. So far Prom assumes it as being outlier-ish, that's one. If those like Kami, Ramesses(?), and NotHuman can perhaps provide their thoughts, then that would allow me to fully solify on what to think here afterwards.

But still IMO, it stays the same for the most part but we'll see..
 
By the way, her supposed power of warping infinite timelines isn't even a 2-A feat. It's very haxed Time / Probability Manipulation.

"Since she became an existence of the archival space, BB, who can travel back in time and rewind reality, must have known of 'this present'"

"Meanwhile, the core of the Moon Cell is a simulator of parallel worlds, calculating all kinds of possibilities, past and present and future all existing at the same time"

Key word here is simulator. It can influence branches in the timeline and both calculate / simulate all possible future, but that is not even remotely the same as even destroying a single universe.

Is Marty Mcfly Universe level+ now for destroying a timeline with his actions? No, and neither is BB, and you shouldn't be trying to put things out of context to overhype her.

It's akin to people thinking that the Akashic Records from Vampire Hunter D is Universe level+ because it "records all time", and can be used to warp any point in time. That's not a Universe level+ destructive feat. It's simply very potent Time Manipulation.

By the same logic applied here, any Time Manipulator would be Low 2-C because by stopping / warping time, you are affecting the entire space-time continuum.
 
@Cross

All main Nasuverse supporters I've showed this agree it's at best an extreme outlier and at worse vastly out of context.
 
Well, if this is not accepted, we should probably insert a footnote explanation why into BB's page.
 
@Ant

This is the first time it's been brought up AFAIK, I don't think we need a footnote just yet.
 
I'm sorry, Cross. I know literally nothing about the Nasuverse. I answered the best I could with what I've read in this thread, what I've seen from the profiles, and what I heard through hearsay. Which is why I was as vague as I was.
 
But even if AP revisions don't go through, there are still some things we can add.

Based on the above, BB is probably Nigh-Omnipresent (Exists in past, present, and future simultaneously and can freely travel back in time and interfere with all eras recorded in the Moon Cell) but with Massively FTL+ combat speed. There's also the whole traveling an infinite distance feat with her hax.
 
Also, I notice people here are simply loving to use "But Castlevania!" as a strawman argument to say that this isn't an outlier, because in their minds it has Wall-level vampire hunters scaled to a Multi-Universal Demon God.

Firstly, the amount of evidence for Low 2-C to 2-C Castlevania is far greater than what it's been given to BB, and applies to multiple characters, and unlike BB they are all concrete destructive feats.

  • Time Reaper destroying the fabric of time on two universes
  • Aeon creating a universe
  • Fake Dark Lord destroying 6 universes upon dying
  • Dracula powering up 6 universes
  • Chaos having its own universe and being the equal opposite to the Creator God
  • Dracula's Castle being a dimension of infinite Chaos
Combine all that with the lore of the Vampire Killer wielded by the Belmonts being one of the few weapons powerful enough to harm Dracula and scaling is very much acceptable.

So no, please stop bringing up Castlevania as evidence. When regular bosses start acting as the core of entire solar-system sized dimensions and BB creates a 4-A dimension as a side-effect of her powering up, then we can talk.
 
Reppuzan said:
But even if AP revisions don't go through, there are still some things we can add.
Based on the above, BB is probably Nigh-Omnipresent (Exists in past, present, and future simultaneously and can freely travel back in time and interfere with all eras recorded in the Moon Cell) but with Massively FTL+ combat speed. There's also the whole traveling an infinite distance feat with her hax.
Click to expand...
Temporal Nigh-Omnipresence and Massively FTL+ Applicable speed are things I'm fine with.
 
Rin did say that BB reaching the Moon Cell cannot be changed, no matter what. It could be proof of immunity to Time Paradox, the same way Tiamat has it.

What about possible size of Moon Cell's Reality Marbles?
 
There are few misconceptions here:

Quantum Time Locks are done by "The Great Tree of Time", not by the World or the Moon Cell. It doesn't cull the universes, just removes their back up (Gaia & Alaya) meaning the world doesn't have any defense method.
 
ThisIsMySwagPack said:
Rin did say that BB reaching the Moon Cell cannot be changed, no matter what. It could be proof of immunity to Time Paradox, the same way Tiamat has it.

What about possible size of Moon Cell's Reality Marbles?
Click to expand...
I don't think it's Time Paradox Immunity but more like she can influence with the timeline and stop people from interfering in the past. But it is possible.

Reality Marbles are explicitly pocket dimensions:

"That is, the Reality Marble is the result of switching the Self and the World while keeping the boundary the same. At this time, the size of the Self and the World is switched, and the World is enclosed in a little container. This little World is the World egg and the name of the theory."
 
It seems far more likely that her raw hax is far more potent than her natural attack potency and durability then. To my knowledge, characters have been rated differently based on different abilities before.

I personally do not think that this can be 2-A in any regard or higher because we know how Quantum Time Locks work. Only a select number of realities survive, not the total infinite amount.
 
That's more to due with her having a Nigh-Omnipresence across time and being able to influence the timeline in many points at once. She views it like a book in the sense that she can flip to any page she wants and read it at ny time.
 
I believe that would have to fall under some sort of Time Manipulation or Cosmic Awarenes hax. Due to other things mentioned in this thread, I don't think it can be classified as any evidence for her being higher.
 
If anything, this should be another powerful upgrade that makes her even more versatile, even without the change to AP. When it comes to her hax, it has specific requirements that need to be overcome. Whether or not that is possible is up to the combatant she is pitted against.
 
Lmfao cal's edit is even funnier than the first one


@Aizen It really speaks to the resistances of everyone who can fight her, but especially Gil, yes. Hax resistance has always been a plus of the Nasuverse, though.
 
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