BAN-KAI! Bleach General Discussion

[Arc7Kuroi]

Apple social IQ checking himself rn

 

[Excellence616]

Renji is still weaker than Shutara, just not that much weaker

How would the scaling look like?

 

[Arc7Kuroi]

How would the scaling look like?

Renji's weaker except when he takes 20 seconds to charge up his attack.

 

[Excellence616]

Kubo fr is literally cooking with every episode.
He knows those characters who were done dirty in the manga and redeem them.

 

[LordGriffin1000]

Potentially, my speed revisions are coming after the AP revisions. So a bit longer still, but Bleach fans have been waiting for a while anyway, what’s a little longer

My thoughts every time I think about dropping a tier 1 thread for my favorite verse. Just a little longer (proceeds to wait months to a year)

 

[LordTracer]

I have to wonder where they came up with the dates. As far as I remember, we aren't ever told what month The Lost Agent arc or the Thousand-Year Blood War arc takes place.

From Chapter 536, when Isshin is telling Ichigo about Masaki and he says that the current day is June 17th.

 

[KingogKings777]

Potentially, my speed revisions are coming after the AP revisions. So a bit longer still, but Bleach fans have been waiting for a while anyway, what’s a little longer

TBH getting rid of Gin shit is the best speed thing ever.

 

[ShiftCtrlAltDeleteTabFn]

From Chapter 536, when Isshin is telling Ichigo about Masaki and he says that the current day is June 17th.

Oh, I forgot about that. Dang, then everyone is in fact 17. Wait, I just realized that means that Masaki died a little under a month before Ichigo's birthday... that's sad.

 

[ReaperAndBlues]

The whole scene gets worse when you realize that Isane (the white-haired girl) got shot while trying to help her little sister, Kiyone (the blond-haired girl).

Bro they did Kiyone dirty, I felt so bad when she just dropped dead

 

[ShiftCtrlAltDeleteTabFn]

Bro they did Kiyone dirty, I felt so bad when she just dropped dead

Squad 13 has had a very bad day...

 

[Excellence616]

Wtf?

 

[Ped2018]

Crying, he said "here damn"

 

[AppleLord]

Apple, just spoiler tag your post. Griffin and many others are anime-onlys.

Didn’t know. Alright.

 

[AppleLord]

Wtf?

The fans need to tell him to add Ichigo slicing the moon of Soul Society in half with a Gran Getsuga Tensho that Yhwach reflects up to the skies and make planets, stars, galaxies crumble and disappear in his battle with Ichigo in the background.

 

[ShiftCtrlAltDeleteTabFn]

The fans need to tell him to add Ichigo slicing the moon of Soul Society in half with a Gran Getsuga Tensho that Yhwach reflects up to the skies and make planets, stars, galaxies crumble and disappear in his battle with Ichigo in the background.

True.

Didn’t know. Alright.

Thank you.

 

[ShiftCtrlAltDeleteTabFn]

Wtf?

I need to see this post from Kubo, because I don't believe that otherwise.

 

[GOATMAN1232000]

I haven't been watching the anime. Are we cooked, powerscaling wise?
I heard Renji fought Sklaverei Uryu

He did fight, but once Uryu pulled out VS + Sklavarei, the fight was over. Renji did very well against Base Uryu and VS only Uryu.

Wtf?

Would be hilarious if true. But it's extremely unlikely that this is true. No sources are give.

 

[Naeblis495]

I need to see this post from Kubo, because I don't believe that otherwise.

Make sense to me. We already knew that the team was also suggesting ideas to him and he validate them or not.

 

[ShiftCtrlAltDeleteTabFn]

Make sense to me. We already knew that the team was also suggesting ideas to him and he validate them or not.

That's true, but all of the fights? I don't think so.

 

[Hellscream]

Uhh yeah no, im not believing some random bleach fanpage.

 

[Peterdenman156]

Potentially, my speed revisions are coming after the AP revisions. So a bit longer still, but Bleach fans have been waiting for a while anyway, what’s a little longer

From what I’ve seen, Ichigo TS has a speed of around FTL+ 19c, right? Or is it higher than that, based on his fight with Yhwach Post-Auswahlen

 

[Bastolan27]

 

[ShiftCtrlAltDeleteTabFn]

Kiyone & Isane are adorable, Shuhei is dressed like Shuhei (which ends up being pretty good), but my god, why the hell does  Omaeda, all of people look so good?!

 

[Guacamolefletcher]

Not a 2 year one bucko

If you do the math, Ichigo is 17 but a few months away from being 18 at the end of the lost agent arc, so it's not 2 years, it'd only need to be one year.

 

[Guacamolefletcher]

Eva gettin put on a list

they changed it temporarily because I convinced one of the mods last year

Didn't look like fall, trees were all very green

there is literally no need for speculation, because we know the date of Masaki's death, and that's june 17, so they're in june

TBH getting rid of Gin shit is the best speed thing ever.

ya'll aren't gonna like what arc thinks of mach 500 gin

 

[Guacamolefletcher]

Wtf?

If this happens, then I won, but not in the way I would've wanted. It's actually so funny if this is the case though.

If the new fights aren't canon, we can still use statements and feats as secondary canon maybe, IDFK. We might actually be so cooked. We flew too close to the sun {Renji > Yamamoto scaling}, and now we're boutta have our scaling ****** over {shit not being canon}.

Uhh yeah no, im not believing some random bleach fanpage.

I don't want to be the bearer of bad news, but I've followed this page for a bit, and the've never said something about Klub outside that's not true, so I would take it seriously.

 

[Deceived3596]

Eva doomer posting on main

 

[Adam1396]

I was referring specifically to the Antithesis. It's not an AP-based ability, it's a hax one.

Yes, I know that Uryu scales anyway, but that wasn't what I was talking about.

I'm talking abiut askin.
Not uryu.
Askin scales to ichigo by same logic.
2C askin incoming.
If bleach most of characters start to get 2C scaling like DB, it will be hella funny

 

[AppleLord]

Didn’t Yhwach said “give unto me all that you are” or something like that before slicing the Soul King? I assume all the Elite Quincy are nerfed afterwards since his statement would mean they gave him every bit of their power. What happened is they are giving back the power he gave to them? That means Renji vs Uryu isn’t that far fetched. And the whole Ichigo holding back adds up.

 

[Adam1396]

Didn’t Yhwach said “give unto me all that you are” or something like that before slicing the Soul King? I assume all the Elite Quincy are nerfed afterwards since his statement would mean they gave him every bit of their power. What happened is they are giving back the power he gave to them? That means Renji vs Uryu isn’t that far fetched. And the whole Ichigo holding back adds up.

Good point

 

[Excellence616]

I don't want to be the bearer of bad news, but I've followed this page for a bit, and the've never said something about Klub outside that's not true, so I would take it seriously.

Yeah, that what i thought since the account is know for giving accurate new from Kubo.. but the thing is that are we gonna ignore the number of times Kubo stated that he would add somethings that he wanted to add in the manga to the anime

 

[AppleLord]

Yeah, that what i thought since the account is know for giving accurate new from Kubo.. but the thing is that are we gonna ignore the number of times Kubo stated that he would add somethings that he wanted to add in the manga to the anime

We need raws because it could be a bad translation.

 

[Guacamolefletcher]

Whatever it is, it's just not canonically possible for Renji to become stronger than Yamamoto in any way. It's extremely consistently portrayed that Yamamoto is a static pillar of strength in the story, far beyond just CFYOW, and Kubo has explicitly confirmed that veteran captains are static in power several times (look below). Furthermore, it is a significant narrative point in CFYOW that things work in this grounded way, where (most) CFYOW captains don't powercliff Yamamoto. It wouldn't be a simple statement getting retconned, these narratives which are consistently established through the manga, guidebooks, interviews, and novels would be completely broken. Also, there is no indication Kubo has radically changed his mind on the story and how things work in it, based on his Klub Outside answers.

Shunsui is still relevant, and he'll go on to fight a Post-Auschwahlen Royal Guard member. At the start of the TYBW, Kubo explicitly said this about him:

Q (some Shonen Jump guy): The senior captains won't undergo changes, so Kyoraku hasn't changed either?
Kubo: That's correct. Captains who have been in their positions for a long time don't tend to change much. They've gone through many battles in the past. However, in the future battles, you will see different and new sides. I believe that Kyoraku will use Bankai. Also, there is a certain significance to the haori that Shunsui wears.

The most consistent and logical way of looking at this is that we made a mistake analyzing the characters or scene, and Renji didn't become that strong. Even contextually, based on the stuff we saw in the last cour, Rukia is narratively shown to be relative to Renji, and she wasn't completely wrecking As Nodt, a regular Sternritter in every way. She didn't flick him away, which she'd clearly be able to do if she was even somewhat relative to Renji.

We need raws because it could be a bad translation.

I saw people discussing this on twitter, and based on his explicit statements from the interview he did with Viz, it seems unlikely that the tweet is fully accurate.

 

[Excellence616]

But still tho, the anime is still valid even if we go by the manga since Kubo is involved in it.
We can use Technique from the anime.
The only valid fights are those that happened in the manga e.g Yhwach vs Ichigo, Uryu vs Ichigo.

 

[SilentBob34]

I’m more interested to see if Kubo bringing back transcendence has an effect on CFYOW scaling. With no one sensing Yhwach as the SK and Aizen’s statement of having transcendent reiatsu and no one sensing him, while Kenpachi and Hikone could both be sensed it’d put them around Bankai RG level but below 2nd fusion Aizen.

Which I forgot if everyone gets upgraded to 2C after this cour it wouldn’t effect the scaling in the slightest since they’ll all be 2C lol

 

[Khaostichny]

Whether or not the fights were planned to be in the manga doesn't change their canonity, the only thing that matters is that Kubo is involved and that he considers the anime a better reflection of his vision for his Work. It doesn't matter if some fights are there for the purpose of filling time, if Kubo approved it, then it's canon.

 

[Peterdenman156]

Q&A Klub Outside

Q: When Hitsugaya faced Aizen in the Central 46 Compound, Aizen defeated Hitsugaya but did not attack Unohana or Isane and instead moved to the Sokyoku.

Was it because Aizen thought he could not win against Unohana?

A: I don’t think he believed he couldn’t win, but he was certain it would require a great deal of effort.

 

[ReaperAndBlues]

Q&A Klub Outside

Q: When Hitsugaya faced Aizen in the Central Execution Grounds, Aizen defeated Hitsugaya but did not attack Unohana or Isane and instead moved to the Sokyoku.

Was it because Aizen thought he could not win against Unohana?

A: I don’t think he believed he couldn’t win, but he was certain it would require a great deal of effort.

Oh this is going to definitely be useful later

 

[zylieo]

Whatever it is, it's just not canonically possible for Renji to become stronger than Yamamoto in any way. It's extremely consistently portrayed that Yamamoto is a static pillar of strength in the story, far beyond just CFYOW, and Kubo has explicitly confirmed that veteran captains are static in power several times (look below). Furthermore, it is a significant narrative point in CFYOW that things work in this grounded way, where (most) CFYOW captains don't powercliff Yamamoto. It wouldn't be a simple statement getting retconned, these narratives which are consistently established through the manga, guidebooks, interviews, and novels would be completely broken. Also, there is no indication Kubo has radically changed his mind on the story and how things work in it, based on his Klub Outside answers.

It doesn’t matter if the TYBW anime breaks manga scaling because it represents Kubo’s updated and definitive vision for Bleach. Kubo’s direct involvement ensures that any changes or additions, even if they contradict the manga, are valid within the canon, as the anime was designed to expand and complete ideas he couldn’t fully explore due to the constraints he faced during serialization. Eg. In the anime, Robert Accutrone never directly confronts Liltotto, Jugram doesn't shit his pants when he sees Gremmy's meteor, and The Quincies utilize Blut and Sklaverai in fights they didn't use it in. Once the anime concludes, we can more clearly distinguish what was newly added (like scenes or interactions that weren’t in the manga), what was retconned (if anything), and what remains consistent with the original story. This approach will allow us to have more of a comprehensive understanding of how the anime fits into Bleach’s canon, with Kubo’s personal input giving the final authority to what should be considered part of the official storyline.

 

[Adam1396]

Whatever it is, it's just not canonically possible for Renji to become stronger than Yamamoto in any way. It's extremely consistently portrayed that Yamamoto is a static pillar of strength in the story, far beyond just CFYOW, and Kubo has explicitly confirmed that veteran captains are static in power several times (look below). Furthermore, it is a significant narrative point in CFYOW that things work in this grounded way, where (most) CFYOW captains don't powercliff Yamamoto. It wouldn't be a simple statement getting retconned, these narratives which are consistently established through the manga, guidebooks, interviews, and novels would be completely broken. Also, there is no indication Kubo has radically changed his mind on the story and how things work in it, based on his Klub Outside answers.

Shunsui is still relevant, and he'll go on to fight a Post-Auschwahlen Royal Guard member. At the start of the TYBW, Kubo explicitly said this about him:

Q (some Shonen Jump guy): The senior captains won't undergo changes, so Kyoraku hasn't changed either?
Kubo: That's correct. Captains who have been in their positions for a long time don't tend to change much. They've gone through many battles in the past. However, in the future battles, you will see different and new sides. I believe that Kyoraku will use Bankai. Also, there is a certain significance to the haori that Shunsui wears.

The most consistent and logical way of looking at this is that we made a mistake analyzing the characters or scene, and Renji didn't become that strong. Even contextually, based on the stuff we saw in the last cour, Rukia is narratively shown to be relative to Renji, and she wasn't completely wrecking As Nodt, a regular Sternritter in every way. She didn't flick him away, which she'd clearly be able to do if she was even somewhat relative to Renji.


I saw people discussing this on twitter, and based on his explicit statements from the interview he did with Viz, it seems unlikely that the tweet is fully accurate.

Renji simply doesn’t scale to 2C version of uryu, he didn't face this version.
And uryu simply doesn’t scale to emotionally balanced ichigo. Even base ichigo.
Yeah kenpachis might be obvious anomaly but yama and aizen has been constantly potrait to be the peak of shinigami within soul society.
Renji beating shunsui, yamamoto, base aizen is hella funny. He ain't even taking on rukia.