Not really I'm making a point Ichibei has never been sensed by another shinigami not even in Bankai and we don't treat him as transcendent. The same thing for second fusion Aizen really. It's not even a Grimmjow would fight stronger opponents he didn't even know he was strong to begin with lol didn't sense his level at all
Second Fusion Aizen and Ichibe don't have comparable situations at all... Ichibe has no statements that his reiatsu is unsensible and he has no scaling that places him on that level. That's just a baseless assertion by you. Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence. Grimmjow wanting to fight Ichibe means nothing, Grimmjow concedes that he would fight characters he thinks he can't win against. It's just part of his nature as someone who wants to be the king. We don't treat Condom Aizen as transcendent either, transcendence starts at Fourth Fusion Aizen, we just treat Condom Aizen as having an unsensible gap in power between like top tiers of the verse like the Bleach Sannin.
Shouldn’t oetsu be above Bankai shutura although we don’t know is full power he’s considered to be second strongest zero division after ichibei
This is just stupid tbh. Has never been sensed by anybody in the series and nobody even noticed his Bankai but because it specifically didn't say his reiatsu is unsensible it doesn't count? I'm sorry but this is just stupid. This is what I mean when I say y'all pick and choose when something is important. Unohana says Kenpachi would have beaten Royd? Legit. Unohana says shes stronger than everyone but full potential Kenpachi? Nah.
Then stop. Reio literally mentioned 3D and you liked the comment
Right so the gap isn't so high he can't be damaged so it doesn't prove he's above his shell. Because they couldn't sense the Aizen underneath? Is the shell supposed to have its own reiatsu??
Yet Osho
He didn't get hit or tank it at all. He diverted it just enough with a massive amped technique to barely avoid it.
Incredulity + Bulverism + Nonsequitur. No one gives a fvck if you think it's absurd. That doesn't counter the argument so concession accepted.
I liked Reio's comment cuz he disagreed with your scaling, that doesn't mean I fully endorse Reio's scaling. I've already explained to you why it's idiotic to just extrapolate intention from me liking a message.
Condom Aizen isn't damaged tho. It's verbatim stated he took 0 damage. The shell is it's own thing with its own durability that's weaker than Aizen's actual power yes. I've already provided evidence and reasoning behind that.
Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence. Just because no one explicitly says they can sense Ichibe doesn't mean that no one can sense Ichibe.
Thank you my friend lol. Was there another point in the novel where Tokinada did tank a Getsuga from a weaker form of Ginjo? Just asking cause his profile states he tanked a Getsuga
CFYOW profiles are horrendously outdated. I wouldn't take anything you read on them as like concrete. But no Tokinada doesn't tank any Getsuga from Ginjo. In fact Ginjo almost splits Tokinada in half.
Yeah that’s what I thought while looking at it lol. Was like no way he tanked a Getsuga like that
It is stupid. Because not every transcendent was said to be unsensible it's just they have direct scaling. This is why it's stupid cause your own logic doesn't even get used anymore. Characters aren't stated to be unsensible anymore which is why you bring up examples like Ichigo lowering his reiatsu.
Shell protected
It's just a protective layer. Did they say "the shell can be sensed but the real him can't" I doubt it says this specifically. Remember how u mocked the fact I think it's stupid Ichibei reiatsu isn't stated to exactly be unsensible? Plus sensible is relative to the person. He's not transcendent... Meaning he's not wsk level. So if kisuke couldn't sense him there is no proof Ichibei wouldn't. So your logic of "needs to be said to be unsensible" doesn't work as whether you can be sensed or not depends on your opponent..
Right but this logic isnt used when they don't say "I can't sense this person" anymore. Arguing with you is impossible because we take everything u say as true
I don't care what you find absurd Raven, take your incredulity elsewhere. Characters not being stated to be unsensible doesn't debunk or refute my logic. In fact that isn't a part of my argument at all. My argument is that absence of evidence is not evidence of absence. The onus is on you to prove that Ichibe's reiatsu is unsensible if you wanna scale him to that level. And the argument of "oh well Grimmjow was gonna fight him and we aren't explicitly told his reiatsu is sensible" isn't an argument, as per my refutations.
No it didn't cuz the Getsuga burst through the shell. The shell explicitly did not stop the attack.
That doesn't need to be said specifically, this is a nonsequitur to my argument. Again you're asserting that absence of evidence is evidence of absence, which is a logical fallacy.
I agree that Condom Aizen and Ichibe aren't WSK level. As I said before, I think Fourth Fusion Aizen is WSK level.
You'd have to prove Ichibe can sense Aizen, if you want to make that claim.
That's not my logic, stop strawmanning my arguments.
Because nobody is unsensible and it depends on your opponent. So you saying unsensible as if it means Aizen can't be sensed by any Shinigami, but we accept him as not transcendent. You're treating him like he's on another realm of Shinigami yet don't accept him as such. This means he isn't unsensible thus u don't need that statement especially since we don't accept him as transcendent and nobody is truly transcendent. Nice try
He didn't sense his power at all not just fact he's stronger ur gunna have to prove he sensed him when I explained how nobody in bleach could sense ichibei
It was covering him so yea it did
Wtf does this even mean can u use normal words
It is
Because he's far beyond Kisuke and hasn't been sensed by anybody in the series. And he doesn't have a sealed state like Senjumaru so you're gunna have to prove he does cause when I brought up there being one seal left y'all said it just represented who was alive according to their pack n now we accept Ichibei as having a seal I should of debunked this
I don't even know wat this means
Grimmjow if he actually had to fight any version of Vollständig quilge or any version of Askin in a 1 v 1 ☠
Couldn't sense Ichigo
Classic
Hahahahahahahahahahaha
Is a non sequitur fallacy because nothing arc said leads to the conclusion that this needs to be said.
You're equivocating transcendence to the inability to be sensed. And then you're claiming I said that. That is a strawman, as you are asserting that I am arguing something I never claimed. This is a complete and utter nonsequitur as I never made such a claim.
No I don't, stop shifting the burden. You claimed that Grimmjow cannot sense Ichibe, you must prove that claim, the onus is on you.
No it didn't. This point isn't relevant to the debate anyway, since prior to one shotting the Bleach Sannin Aizen wasn't going all out. Isshin's attack doesn't limit the durability of a full power Condom Aizen.
Google it. I'm not going to explain the most simple debate terminology to you, you've clearly got access to the internet, which means you have access to a dictionary.
Cool you're agreeing to committing a logical fallacy. Nice concession.
Prove he hasn't been sensed. You've continuously claimed such without any evidence or logical proof. Via Hitchen's Razor I can dismiss such claims with equivocal claims lacking any evidence or logical proof. Ichibe having or not having a seal isn't relevant to the debate, it is again a nonsequitur.
You know you're having a good debate when they don't even know what strawmanning means.
I just explained it to you
He's calling your explanation aka your argument ass Raven.
Define and show a modus ponens argument
You're arguing it by default with unsensible as the term isn't technically real
I shifted yes because there is no proof he was able to tell Ichibei was strong at all or ts Ichigo
No
Because Senjumaru a hax bankai shook the realms and was sensed (not really but for this argument let's say so) Ichibei also a hax bankai wasn't sensed. And Senju should be > Sealed Ichibei even tho sealed Ichibei isn't a real thing. So Ichibei should still be above the Senjumaru that was sensed as his power isn't sealed
Hitchens razor gg unfortunately axioms aren't justified
Somebody needs to prove Ichibei is sealed otherwise I proved he can't be sensed. Nothing he said is proof
You're compromising the dialectic.
What is it, in your worldview, that is ultimate, and grounds possibility and impossibility
No takers?
No I'm not. The inability to be sensed is a thing in Bleach.
You have to prove that. You're conceding that you attempted to shift the burden, and thus are conceding you didn't prove your claim.
"In the age of the internet and vastly accessible information, ignorance is a choice."
This isn't coherent english but pop off. You spouted a bunch of unjustified claims. You made a bunch of assertions and didn't actually prove anything. I made no claim in this debate about a Ichibe being sealed. This is just a complete tangent and nonsequitur to the debate. You're making a bunch of speculative claims.
She doesn't know what that means.
This logic doesn't follow. Ichibe being sealed or not holds no barring on whether or not he can be sensed. Proof entails evidence, that which you have not provided.
Wait no Arc he did use shirafune ichimonji tho?
I'm not engaging with you at all idiot
