Baki Hanma vs Travis Touchdown (Baki vs No More Heroes)

[BakiHanma18]

I guess vaporize wasn't the best word to use but the move still vaporizes or one shots people who can tank 3 to 4 hit from him before dying and I'm pretty sure it would severely injure Baki. Both Travis and Baki have "Extremely High" stamina and if the fight does get prolonged enough Travis will go into ecstacy mode.

First, I guess we would need to figure out the AP difference. I'll try to find Baki's AP, but what's Travis's?

Stamina ratings are only comparable in verse from my understanding. What are stamina feats for Travis? I can post some for Baki.

Baki also has both Adrenaline and Endorphins to give him more energy and negate any muscle fatigue he'd experience respectively

 

[BakiHanma18]

So as far as AP, Baki scales pretty high above .02 tons. The chain is Baki> Shinogi Kureha> Kosho Kureha>= Hector Doyle, with Doyle being comparable to Spec, who is .02 tons.

As far as endurance, take your pick:

• Baki just up and spits out one of his teeth.[GB]
• Baki fights with his nerves cut, he is even smiling from it. Doppo Orochi even says that having a nerve cut hurts a lot. A man who can go through major surgery without anesthetic.[GB]
• Shinogi Kosho pummels him with attacks and Baki simply catched his strike with his neck and snaps his arm. Shinogi meanwhile is able to splinter wood with his punches, punch through bound bamboo, and pierce boxing bags with his fingers. [GB]
• Baki just shoves his nerves right back into his body. [GB]
• Baki fights around once per month. [GB]
• A doctor claims that Baki would fight even with two broken arms if he needed to. [GB]
• Baki gets up after Mount Toba body slams him into the ground. [GB]
• Baki kept fighting and beat Mount Toba despite these injuries. [GB]
• Shinogi Kureha gives him the worst bone fracture possible. [GB]
• Baki gets lectured by Shinogi Kureha. [GB]
• Baki pushes his body past it's limits and releases endorphines. [GB]
• Baki gets straight up mauled by the Yasha Ape. Baki soon releases endorphines though and brings himself back into the fight. [GB]
• Keeps fighting despite having his arm exploded by Hanayama. [GB]
• Gets up after Hanayama's full powered strikes.The strikes in questio so you don't have to backtrack through the thread. [GB]
• Kept glass in his mouth to prevent himself from beiing knocked out. This is what I was referencing in this feat. [GB]
• Baki gets smashed head first into rock and then legitimately drowned and gets back up to choke the shit out of the guy who hurt him.[GB]
• Just starts beating the shit out of himself to prevent being knocked out. [GB]
• Baki can spend 12 hours just warming himself up. Not only did he go for the full 12 hours but he had 53 extra pounds of weight on him. [GB]
• Baki ends up fighting Yujiro at 13 and he totally gets his body annihilated by him. The ass beating stars at about 169 in the Grappler Baki manga and goes on for about 3 chapters. [GB]

Everything beyond this point is a later version of Baki, but he would scale down from these

• Baki Hanma completely no sells multiple benda whips. Benda is described as being so painful that the body would rather die than endure it. On top of that, the character he was fighting, had poison on his hands. The poison was able to completely skeletonize a man's arm and is said to effect down to the bone marrow. [NGB]
• Baki falls the mindboggling, utterly insane, death defying height of about 100 feet. This feat may seem a little weird but it basically paralyzed Baki with heavy body damage. He still takes it like a man and manages to rage his way out of his situation. [SOO]
• He gets greedy in his fight against Pickle and tries to compare their full raw power. It doesn't end well for Baki. Either way, he survived what should be a full power beating from Pickle who is absurdly strong. [SOO]
• Baki ends up having Yujiro Hanma use his Benda on him. Yujiro Hanma is clearly far stronger than Baki during this fight. And even with that difference Baki is capable of forcing Yujiro to flex all of his muscles to not experience pain. [SOO]
• Gets up after a strong barrage of blows from Yujiro Hanma. [SOO]
• Baki survives Yujiro using the Dress on him.Soon after Yujiro walks over to a car and decides to smash Baki into it. He survives that too. [SOO]
• Finally, for the first time in his life, Yujiro Hanma hugs him. It takes a little while but Baki eventually gets up from this and has an imaginary dinner with Yujiro. [SOO]
• Baki usually trains until he can't move and his little basement thing is coated in his sweat. He then gets up when he hears something. [BD]

 

[Xx.davidparra]

So as far as AP, Baki scales pretty high above .02 tons. The chain is Baki> Shinogi Kureha> Kosho Kureha>= Hector Doyle, with Doyle being comparable to Spec, who is .02 tons.
As far as endurance, take your pick:

• Baki just up and spits out one of his teeth.[GB]
• Baki fights with his nerves cut, he is even smiling from it. Doppo Orochi even says that having a nerve cut hurts a lot. A man who can go through major surgery without anesthetic.[GB]
• Shinogi Kosho pummels him with attacks and Baki simply catched his strike with his neck and snaps his arm. Shinogi meanwhile is able to splinter wood with his punches, punch through bound bamboo, and pierce boxing bags with his fingers. [GB]
• Baki just shoves his nerves right back into his body. [GB]
• Baki fights around once per month. [GB]
• A doctor claims that Baki would fight even with two broken arms if he needed to. [GB]
• Baki gets up after Mount Toba body slams him into the ground. [GB]
• Baki kept fighting and beat Mount Toba despite these injuries. [GB]
• Shinogi Kureha gives him the worst bone fracture possible. [GB]
• Baki gets lectured by Shinogi Kureha. [GB]
• Baki pushes his body past it's limits and releases endorphines. [GB]
• Baki gets straight up mauled by the Yasha Ape. Baki soon releases endorphines though and brings himself back into the fight. [GB]
• Keeps fighting despite having his arm exploded by Hanayama. [GB]
• Gets up after Hanayama's full powered strikes.The strikes in questio so you don't have to backtrack through the thread. [GB]
• Kept glass in his mouth to prevent himself from beiing knocked out. This is what I was referencing in this feat. [GB]
• Baki gets smashed head first into rock and then legitimately drowned and gets back up to choke the shit out of the guy who hurt him.[GB]
• Just starts beating the shit out of himself to prevent being knocked out. [GB]
• Baki can spend 12 hours just warming himself up. Not only did he go for the full 12 hours but he had 53 extra pounds of weight on him. [GB]
• Baki ends up fighting Yujiro at 13 and he totally gets his body annihilated by him. The ass beating stars at about 169 in the Grappler Baki manga and goes on for about 3 chapters. [GB]

Everything beyond this point is a later version of Baki, but he would scale down from these

• Baki Hanma completely no sells multiple benda whips. Benda is described as being so painful that the body would rather die than endure it. On top of that, the character he was fighting, had poison on his hands. The poison was able to completely skeletonize a man's arm and is said to effect down to the bone marrow. [NGB]
• Baki falls the mindboggling, utterly insane, death defying height of about 100 feet. This feat may seem a little weird but it basically paralyzed Baki with heavy body damage. He still takes it like a man and manages to rage his way out of his situation. [SOO]
• He gets greedy in his fight against Pickle and tries to compare their full raw power. It doesn't end well for Baki. Either way, he survived what should be a full power beating from Pickle who is absurdly strong. [SOO]
• Baki ends up having Yujiro Hanma use his Benda on him. Yujiro Hanma is clearly far stronger than Baki during this fight. And even with that difference Baki is capable of forcing Yujiro to flex all of his muscles to not experience pain. [SOO]
• Gets up after a strong barrage of blows from Yujiro Hanma. [SOO]
• Baki survives Yujiro using the Dress on him.Soon after Yujiro walks over to a car and decides to smash Baki into it. He survives that too. [SOO]
• Finally, for the first time in his life, Yujiro Hanma hugs him. It takes a little while but Baki eventually gets up from this and has an imaginary dinner with Yujiro. [SOO]
• Baki usually trains until he can't move and his little basement thing is coated in his sweat. He then gets up when he hears something. [BD]

Most of these are just durability feats ^

For Travis's AP he should upscale greatly from the Ranked assassins from No More Heroes 1 all the way up to Holly Summers.

Travis swam from Texas to Japan and fight goons for a whole day and call it fun,I'm not in anyway comparing these to Baki what all I'm saying is Travis could definitely last a long while in a fight.

And from what it sounds like Adrenaline and Endorphins only increase strength,stamina and pain tolerance

 

[Xx.davidparra]

Also how quick is Baki on the draw with his stat amps cause this match might be a mini version of Yujiro vs Raiden

 

[Stillwinston]

Something about a guy who'd fit right in Jojo fighting an insane weeb who slices things with a royalty free lightsaber feels so surreal. This is looking pretty close, I'm inclined to go Incon with the points we're bringing up here but I'll wait for a bit.

 

[BakiHanma18]

I'll look into AP

Baki seems to have the edge in stamina based on that

Yes, that's their purpose

Depends on what he needs and how much he needs them. Some of them are basically either passive or sometimes they just activate as a byproduct of rules in Baki

 

[NotoriouSoda]

Two things

1) What happened to the low-7C?

2) The more I look into this match while close, I feel like Baki wins this match barely, Travis and Baki have a bunch of amps but I feel Baki are way more useful, plus with all his techniques and skill he barely pulls a win here.

 

[BakiHanma18]

Two things
1) What happened to the low-7C?

2) The more I look into this match while close, I feel like Baki wins this match barely, Travis and Baki have a bunch of amps but I feel Baki are way more useful, plus with all his techniques and skill he barely pulls a win here.

Low 7-C was fine, but was a lot less fair for Travis. Baki at that point is nearing Yujiro levels of monstrosity

 

[Xx.davidparra]

it was stomp if I use low 7-C Baki and it was a stomp if I used the hax-rapey third key Travis

 

[Xx.davidparra]

I'll look into AP
Baki seems to have the edge in stamina based on that

Yes, that's their purpose

Depends on what he needs and how much he needs them. Some of them are basically either passive or sometimes they just activate as a byproduct of rules in Baki

Which amps are his fastest? it also doesn't matter if Baki outstaminas him if within a couple seconds Travis will be bloodlusted and way faster and slice baki in tiny pieces(Darkside mode). Baki and Yujiro have never been the type to use stat amps unless they're mocking their opponents or when their lives are in true danger,but by then it will be too late,Hence why the latter of the two lost to Raiden.

 

[BakiHanma18]

A lot of the minor ones come out first. For example, there's some kind of rule that's brought up about fighter clenching their teeth, which means we're likely to see Perfect Natural Power pretty early on. Things like Dynamic Vision and Death Concentration only make an appearance if he's being blitzed, and while Endorphins and Adrenaline can be activated, some times they just activate as a sort of Plot Armor when he's getting his shit rocked. Goutaijutsu is a last ditch effort kinda move (according to Yujiro)

 

[Xx.davidparra]

Whats Goutaijustu?

 

[BakiHanma18]

https://s7.mkklcdnv7.com/************/g2/grappler_baki/vol3_chapter_71/16.jpg

Basically, like most of Baki's amps, he's not actually amping, he's just hitting harder/moving faster or whatever have you due to the nature of the technique

 

[Xx.davidparra]

Also Baki getting hit with Travis's Anarchy in the Galaxy will no doubt kill or severely incap Baki (people who can take 3 to 4 hits from Travis get one-shotted with this attack)from what I know in his 9-A form Baki isn't immune to heat and he can't really dodge it since it vaporizes nearly everything within a few dozen meters and Most of Baki's speed amps only speed up the acceleration of his movements temporarily i.e. cockroach tackle,sangan,hand pocket, etc. but full on borderline time-stop type speed amps and without a doubt Travis is quicker on the draw with his amps,with a mix of being bloodlusted and borderline blitz potential I don't see how he can lose. skill is no doubt on Baki's side ,people can see Travis's aura and vise versa so Travis will know Baki is not to be ****** with in CQC.

 

[BakiHanma18]

I don't see where his 9-A rating comes from, but the 9-B part only scales to grenades. If something like that were to happen, Baki can just use his aforementioned Death Concentration or Dynamic Vision, maybe even both if he's still in danger, to get away. I'm doubtful that Travis will use his amps first regardless, as Baki will be able to judge how much of a threat he is almost immediately with Info Analysis. Travis won't really have a choice in the matter due to just dodging and closing in

 

[Xx.davidparra]

If there's no calc then its baseline, the 9-A also comes from the fact that Travis can take 4 grenades and landmines to the face and shrug them off, fight Holly Summers who has a cybornetic leg that can shoot 10 homing missiles at a time, Dr. Peace who has exploding bullets (which he spams), again Travis has Anarchy in the Galaxy that can vaporize people and not mention he scales above the 6 assassins and his amps can help with ap and dura, I know Baki will use endorphins early on in the fight and he definitely outskills Travis there would no point arguing in that department, analytical prediction, Death Concentration and Dynamic Vision are also big issue's for Travis but at this point in the story Baki has had some of his attacks parried or blocked (and sometimes he's been caught off guard) as seen in his fights with Retsu, Hanayama and Jack, to get rid of your doubt with Travis's amps all he really needs is to block an attack from Baki (which is possible with his level of instinctive reaction) with Darkstep he could land a deathblow in the 6 to 7 seconds Baki is frozen and go into Darkside mode.(Travis can also use his other amps while in DS mode)

 

[Xx.davidparra]

I found some gifs of Travis's pain tolerance and amps

- Anarchy in the Galaxy

- When Travis loses all HP he can defy death for a while longer with sheer will

- Travis's pain tolerance

-Strawberry Chocolate Sundae (this move is not and amp as it just slows down Travis's perception of time and as you saw Travis doesn't need to death blow or match slots and what not)

- Blueberry Cheese Brownie

-Strawberry on the Shortcake

-This is the End!

- Travis's pain tolerance 2

 

[Xx.davidparra]

Also found that Travis can go into Darkside mode through ecstacy mode

Ecstasy and Darkside Mode

Fighting and killing really inspires Travis, and it often inspires fanaticism in the people he's fighting. This has combat benefits for Travis. The more he fights, the more passionate he gets, which fills his "ecstasy meter". If he fills his ecstasy meter, he can enter one of several godlike battle trances. This is called Darkside Mode. He also has a chance to enter this mode every time he performs a special finishing move on an opponent.

 

[Xx.davidparra]

And I forgot to mention Travis never grapples unless his opponent is severely stunned

 

[BakiHanma18]

If Travis is baseline 9-A, Baki is at a 4x AP advantage.

Darkstep won't be a problem because 1) Baki is just going to grapple him and 2) He still be able to analytically prediction the sidestep and react with Death Concentration and or Dynamic Vision

With these endurance feats, I'd definitely give endurance to Baki. Like I linked prior, he gets his nerves ripped out, but just smiles, pushes his nerves back into his body, and even Doppo, who got his hand stitched back on nerve by nerve, muscle by muscle, and skin piece by skin piece with no pain killers, though that that was painful. Also, like, resisting Yanagi's Benda 5 or 6 times casually

If Ecstasy Mode only happens after away, I wouldn't be concerned. Baki is going to King Tiger Travis long before then

What Travis does is irrelevant. I'm not saying he's going to grapple, I'm saying he's going to get grappled whether he wants to or not.

 

[Xx.davidparra]

If Travis is baseline 9-A, Baki is at a 4x AP advantage.
Darkstep won't be a problem because 1) Baki is just going to grapple him and 2) He still be able to analytically prediction the sidestep and react with Death Concentration and or Dynamic Vision

With these endurance feats, I'd definitely give endurance to Baki. Like I linked prior, he gets his nerves ripped out, but just smiles, pushes his nerves back into his body, and even Doppo, who got his hand stitched back on nerve by nerve, muscle by muscle, and skin piece by skin piece with no pain killers, though that that was painful. Also, like, resisting Yanagi's Benda 5 or 6 times casually

If Ecstasy Mode only happens after away, I wouldn't be concerned. Baki is going to King Tiger Travis long before then

What Travis does is irrelevant. I'm not saying he's going to grapple, I'm saying he's going to get grappled whether he wants to or not.

- Again, Travis scales above 6 baseline 9-A's mixed with amps so AP will hardly be a factor

- My point was, Baki even with his borderline precog was still getting his attacks parried and blocked by Retsu and even caught off guard sometimes, even brawlers like Jack and Hanayama where getting a couple hits in. I brought this up to point out inconsistency in most of his fight during the max tournament arc.(death concentration barley did crap in those fights)

- I wasn't comparing those feats to Baki, as I stated there would be no point in arguing in that area. I was saying Travis can take a good ass-whooping before going down.

- Travis will use the range to his advantage, during his fight the Dr. Peace who is a master gunslinger, Travis knew to close the distance asap and skill-**** in CQC and in his fight with Jeane he knew not to get close because she's a MMA master and she would just as easily fold him like baki could

- Let's say Baki managed to close the distance and crumple Travis up like paper, Travis by this point would have at least lasted a while. With his pseudo-resurrection he could just get right back up and with more health and go into ecstacy mode

 

[BakiHanma18]

How far above baseline are the 6? 6 at once doesn't really matter for AP, just how strong the strongest one is.

Its been shown Baki's analytical prediction can also be read, like with his fight against Kosho Kureha, but Travis doesn't have Analytical Prediction. Jack was likely several times faster and stronger, as Baki needed DB to beat him. Hanayama there have also been several times where Baki literally had to force himself to get hit by Hana as training because he would just Instinctively dodge his attacks.

The point in arguing the area is to see who would tire out first if Travis tried to range spam: Travis distancing and range spamming, or Baki running after him

It wouldn't matter what choice of action he would take, Baki would take actions to close the gap regardless. Baki would basically be Travis in the Travis vs Dr. Peace fight

He can't get back up. Baki isn't beating him up, he's using King Tiger to incap him. It's a hold where his neck is trapped between Baki's two legs and his are pulled behind his back. If Baki has even hit him, that would be 1 thing, but he's not hurting him, just incapping

 

[Xx.davidparra]

-Travis scales above Helter Skelter(doesn't have a profile), Dr. Peace, Shinobu Jacobs, Holly Summers, Destroyma, and Death Metal who are all stronger than the last (in order of their rankings) there are no calcs for the amps, but some one-shot people who can tank 3 to 4 hits from Travis before dying. and Anarchy in the Galaxy one shots and vaporizes people who can hurt Travis

-I just realized that Baki's Analytical Prediction and Travis's IR border pretty close to precog with what you're telling me and this [1] [2] both of these were done without Travis paying attention. In the first one he's literally half-asleep. Jack and Hanayama were probably different cases then, but my point still stands with Retsu, who doesn't have AP or IR still was handing Baki his own ass throughout their match, again the inconsistency

-If that's the case, a friendly reminder the Ecstacy Mode exists and so does Cranberry Chocolate Sundae (Travis can use this amp without having to death blow or go into Darkside mode and it lasts around 30 seconds which is a long time for casual bullet-timers)

-If Baki managed to close the distance let's say and King Tiger'd Travis, this is a fight to the death so Baki would have to kill Travis or get up eventually which is when Travis can pseudo resurrect with more health and in darkside mode

 

[Xx.davidparra]

Btw when this match concludes I'm gonna do round 2 with their strongest low 7-C keys so keep an eye out for that.

 

[BakiHanma18]

So his AP is unquantifiably above baseline, the amps are unqualifiable, and Anarchy is unquantifiable? I'll have to message someone as to how to go about this.

If we're talking about consistency, Retsu highly likely has Analytical Prediction and Information Analysis due to 1) scaling above even Baki during the Maximum Tournament in skill and 2) scaling vastly above the likes of someone like Shumei Kano, who can analyze, copy, and predict all the movements of a style just by seeing it's stance. Kano is the equivalent of a C-League fighter according to Tokugawa, whereas Retsu is not only an A-League fighter, he was a Finalist in the A-League Tournament.

Right, and Baki has Endorphins and Adrenaline to both negate the muscle fatigued and to give him energy so long as his brain can produce the drug.

SBA says King Tiger can incap win, so no kill necessary.

 

[Xx.davidparra]

- If you start from baseline (Death Metal is the weakest of the assassins) you times the ap by either 1x or 2x I'm not sure.The amps let him blitz opponents comparable to him which I know blitzing someone is quantifiable I just don't know the number and some let him one shot people comparable to him which is a 7.5x AP boost and Anarchy can do the same so a 7.5x boost also

 

[Xx.davidparra]

- If Retsu does I've personally never seen him use those in a fight even when he fought Musashi he relied on xiao-lee

-Those two amps only increase stamina and pain tolerance Travis's increase all his stats (AP, dura, and speed)

- I intended it to be to the death and since Baki has a cornucopia of ways to kill Travis it's still fair

 

[BakiHanma18]

- If you start from baseline (Death Metal is the weakest of the assassins) you times the ap by either 1x or 2x I'm not sure.The amps let him blitz opponents comparable to him which I know blitzing someone is quantifiable I just don't know the number and some let him one shot people comparable to him which is a 7.5x AP boost and Anarchy can do the same so a 7.5x boost also

Why do you times the AP by 1x or 2x?

While the amp lets him blitz opponents comparable to him, Baki still has CoD and DV, as well as Afterimage Creation if it actually comes to that

So 7.5x above unquantifiably above baseline. If we use baseline, Baki is already 4x stronger, and just by clenching his teeth he gets another 1.3x multiplier from Perfect Natural Power. Other amps I'll have to look into, but for now, Baki would be 5.2x above baseline

 

[BakiHanma18]

- If Retsu does I've personally never seen him use those in a fight even when he fought Musashi he relied on xiao-lee
-Those two amps only increase stamina and pain tolerance Travis's increase all his stats (AP, dura, and speed)

- I intended it to be to the death and since Baki has a cornucopia of ways to kill Travis it's still fair

Because Musashi can literally read people's minds. Analytical prediction doesn't much help against that

Yes, why would he need to be stronger or faster when he's just trying to close the gap? The goal is to get to Travis for the King Tiger. If he's range spamming, all Baki has to do is chase him until he tires out first, where Baki can King Tiger

But under SBA, Baki can just incap and win with King Tiger

 

[Xx.davidparra]

- If you start from baseline (Death Metal is the weakest of the assassins) you times the ap by either 1x or 2x I'm not sure.The amps let him blitz opponents comparable to him which I know blitzing someone is quantifiable I just don't know the number and some let him one shot people comparable to him which is a 7.5x AP boost and Anarchy can do the same so a 7.5x boost also

Why do you times the AP by 1x or 2x?
While the amp lets him blitz opponents comparable to him, Baki still has CoD and DV, as well as Afterimage Creation if it actually comes to that

So 7.5x above unquantifiably above baseline. If we use baseline, Baki is already 4x stronger, and just by clenching his teeth he gets another 1.3x multiplier from Perfect Natural Power. Other amps I'll have to look into, but for now, Baki would be 5.2x above baseline

- I apologize if that sounded dumb but I'm pretty sure you increase each time but If Travis is stronger than 6 9-A's that should mean something higher than baseline

- Travis already has experience fighting with afterimages Death Metal's were so good they were basically clones. and besides that as I stated earlier Travis can stack amps on each other while in DS mode

- There's plenty of other fights with Retsu that don't show any of those Joe Frazier,his first encounter with Dorian, and he even fell for Jyaku's handshake move, all of these were just due to better skill

-Because Travis can amp and blitz without death blowing with Cranberry Chocolate Sundae and then stack up more amps

- Again Baki has a shit-ton of ways to kill Travis so it's still fair all he has to do is snap his neck or vice grip him with better lifting strength

 

[BakiHanma18]

Nah it's cool. The problem is we don't know how much higher than baseline, so Baki, with concrete scaling, would have the AP advantage iirc. Like I mentioned, I'd like to consult an expert on this.

Afterimages would still definitely help, considering their both stacking perception speed amps, bringing them to a roughly comparable speed

Just because it's not mentioned doesn't mean it isn't used. Itagaki has barely mentioned the use of Analytical Prediction since the Maximum Tournament, it has just become a part of what fighters do. This however makes it difficult to tell the difference between outspending and predicting, however, we know for a fact that Retsu's analytical prediction scales above someone like Kano, who as I mentioned can copy and analytically predict an entire style at a glance. It's also been shown during the Baki vs Kureha fight that even if you analyze and predict an opponent's entire offensive capacity, if they're too swift, the predictions will be off. As for Joe, I'd have to re-read it, but for things like Jyaku, the first time he did it was as an intro to the fight. Retsu wasn't analyzing and predicting because he had no reason to believe the handshake was an attack. Every time after the first time, he intentionally let Jyaku try because he knew Jyaku's intentions were pure, the handshake was all he could do offensively, and that it would ultimately fail. With Dorian, it could be argued that he predicted the hair, seeing as they are of similar speed and it was a surprise attack, but its debatable.

Baki would still have both CoD and DV as well as analytical prediction and a massive skill advantage, all of which combined make blitzing nearly impossible. Add to that Baki's Danger Sense and Instinctive Reaction, and a blitz becomes even less likely. Then it's just a matter of Baki tiring him out.

Yes, but that doesn't mean incap still isn't a viable win condition. Also, what would stop Baki from just doing it again, or using a different hold?

 

[Xx.davidparra]

before I make my arguement how many amps does baki have in this key speedwise?

 

[BakiHanma18]

I'll look, one sec

 

[BakiHanma18]

Those 3 are the only ones: CoD to perceive the world in slow motion, Dynamic Vision to see the world in slow motion, and Perfect Natural Power to increase his physical ability by 1.3x

 

[Xx.davidparra]

do any of them a have a time limit or debuff of somekind?

 

[BakiHanma18]

do any of them a have a time limit or debuff of somekind?

Not that I've seen or that has been mentioned. CoD usually can only be used when close to death, but Baki and Yujiro overcame that by throwing themselves off of a cliff backwards. Dynamic Vision is just a way of looking at something, like Yujiro being able to see each individual raindrop when it was raining while he taught this to Baki, or Yuri being able to see his arm getting Vice Gripped in slow motion. Perfect Natural Power is as long as Baki can clench his teeth, as it's his teeth and spine being realigned for this power increase.

 

[Xx.davidparra]

How much faster does CoD and DV make Baki?

 

[BakiHanma18]

It doesn't make him faster, it makes him see in slow motion. CoD is slow enough that despite throwing himself off a cliff backward with his eyes closed, he was able to turn around and dodge, block, or parry every rock in his way as he fell to slow his landing and survive. Dynamic Vision as mentioned allowed Yujiro to see every individual raindrop while it was raining and allowed Yuri to see Vice Grip inflate his arm skin, blow out his muscles and splatter his blood despite it all happening fast enough that nobody else knew what happened

 

[Xx.davidparra]

so it just slows his perception of time right?

 

[Xx.davidparra]

I will probably continue this thread tomorrow or later tonight as I didn't really sleep last night. I know this is off-topic but I'll mention this anyway, Travis's lifting strength should be higher, I'm pretty sure swinging around a huge sword made with futuristic metal at transonic speeds and with one-hand casually should be more athletic human DM's Sword DM's Sword 2, Travis also did this after their fight DM's Sword 3