Asriel Dreemurr vs YHVH

[Elvis_Adika]

Oh wow, I didnt notice of the upgrade lol

YHVH wins now because of this upgrade however, this wont be added to the victroy list since this is technically a stomp match

 

[Salavtore]

we'll see what an admin thinks, i dont think it was too far off from a stomp anyway

 

[Elvis_Adika]

Ohh it is.

High 2-As stomps 2-As now.

Asriel fought another High 2-A being before who is also a 5-D being like YHVH, it was a stomp and they didnt accept it as a victory for the High 2-A being since it was the gap between High 2-A and 2-A is absurd. Its like comparing a High 3-A and a Low 2-C

 

[Elvis_Adika]

This thread is a total stomp now, request someone to close it

 

[Blahblah9755]

It's clearly been stated in the OP that this is only first form YHVH, so no it isn't a stomp

 

[Elvis_Adika]

I dunno who to choose then

 

[CrossverseCrisis]

Well i know for one thing. The High 2-A that was recently put in YHVH's page only refers to his True Form, Base YHVH is 2-A.

 

[Salavtore]

OP said "ever said Angel of Death form wasn't allowed. I just said he starts in base."

So both forms for asriel is allowed.

Okay, first thing first.

Angel of death form vs Base YhVh, who would win?

 

[Blahblah9755]

Personally I think YHVH for his superior intelligence, instant death magic, and superior immortality.

 

[Elvis_Adika]

I dunno about YHVH VS Angel of Death Form

YHVH first form already ROFL stomp many 2-A beings in his verse, so that means he is a rather very powerful 2-A being.

Angel of Death form far surpassed Asriel First fom by an IMMENSE AMOUNT, and his first form is already powerful enough, his first form dwarf other 2-A beings by literally an ∞ amount.

Dunno, I give it to Asriel due to him many attacks and abilities that will aid him in his battle against him. Since a single attack from Asriel causes "∞ damage", he can spam his attacks on him many times as each attacks gets increasingly harder to dodge after each attack passes.

 

[Tivanenk]

Too bad YHVH won't give him the time to spam his attacks and one shot him with the Voice of God.

 

[Elvis_Adika]

Too bad YHVH won't give him the time to spam his attacks and one shot him with the Voice of God.

YHVH's voice of God attack wont work on Asriel. It may work on others back in his own game but you have to remember the people who were killed by that attack was way below YHVH.

Asriel has a similiar attack, and that is Angel of Death (Tecnhique, not form). The moment when Asriel turns into his ultimate form, it will completely makes his opponent stuck in place. The opponent cant move, cant attack, cant use any items or even do anything at all. This attack works on Frisk, who is again, way below Asriel.

You saying The Voice of God will kill Asriel in one shot is the equalvilent of of saying Asriel's Angel of Death technique will make YHVH unable to move, attack or do anything.

 

[Tivanenk]

Voice of God worked on Nanashi, Flynn and Aleph, who are comparable to YHVH in power. So no, it will work on Asriel.

 

[Elvis_Adika]

Voice of God worked on Nanashi, Flynn and Aleph, who are comparable to YHVH in power. So no, it will work on Asriel.

Comparable to YHVH power? So you mean he wasnt the strongest in his own game in the first place?

One-Shot attacks will always work on beings far below them especially in Tier 2 and Tier 1 battles. How can they be comparable to YHVH, if they got absolutely destroyed by him? Espeically by an attack with the same amount of power they have?

Also, do you realise that your statement is the equalvilent to saying "Asriel's Angel of Death fom will make YHVH unable to move, attack or do anything and all of his stats will be lowered drastically"

 

[Amelia_Lonelyheart]

It's been years since I played SMT II so I'll probably be wrong. I wouldn't say Aleph is comparable to YHVH, but strong enough to pose a threat, and the fact that he was backed up by Hiroko, Beelzebub, Lucifer and other demons certainly helped.

 

[Tivanenk]

Nanashi and Flynn beat YHVH (the stronger version) so they are in fact stronger than him. And YHVH isn't even the strongest in the verse, the Great Will is. And Voice of God still worked on them.

 

[Salavtore]

it took 2 to beat 1 along with summoned pals to beat his true form

 

[Tivanenk]

it took 2 to beat 1 along with summoned pals to beat his true form

High 2-A / 2 = High 2-A and even base YHVH was using Voice of God on them.

 

[MagiSinbad]

Comparable to YHVH power? So you mean he wasnt the strongest in his own game in the first place?

Who the hell said that YHVH is the strongest in his own game ??? O__o

Even in the classic SMT 2, The Great Will (AKA the Will of the Universe) is already above him. Aleph killed him, Nanashi killed him, Flynn killed him so NO ! YHVH was never the strongest in the Megami Tensei Franchise

One-Shot attacks will always work on beings far below them especially in Tier 2 and Tier 1 battles. How can they be comparable to YHVH, if they got absolutely destroyed by him? Espeically by an attack with the same amount of power they have?

*facepalm* okay pal, i think you should buy a copy of SMT 3 Norctune or Persona 2 to learn what the hell is the Instant death spells ! It's a hax, it doesnt has anything to do with the attack potency. Heh, with the instant death spells, i can even kill the demon that have 5 level higher than me. For an example of the Instant death spell, take a look at the battle between Persona 2 cast and Philemon, each member of the Persona 2 cast can goes toes on toes with Philemon and possibly defeat him. Buuut ! here come the Amagerdon R

Also, do you realise that your statement is the equalvilent to saying "Asriel's Angel of Death fom will make YHVH unable to move, attack or do anything and all of his stats will be lowered drastically"

Rikaja : Remove all debuff, all alies

yeeeeeeaaaaah... i think he will be okay

Also, killing YHVH ? i dont think it would work like that o3o You would need to wipe out entire humanity who believed in him so that he can not revives. If you dont, he will keep come back over and over again ! Guess what, this is a Asriel vs YHVH match, not Asriel vs YHVH and the humanity

Also, is Asriel gonna fight all of YHVH's bald heads ? because from what i remembered, 1 bald head is already a big problem for Lucifer and Satan in SMT 2 :|

 

[SeiryuShin]

Flynn never killed YHVH on his own, he isn't as powerful


Aleph only temporarily defeated him in II an he immediately revived and beat him so bad he's forced to reincarnate without his memories and die endlessly in the Amala


nothing posted puts Arisiel above True Kagutsuchi


Metatron ***** on Kagutsuchi casually


Lord Demiurge ***** on Metatron casually


Fused Lord Demiurge ***** on berserk demiruge casually and still doesn't have all of YHVH's power


this is a stomp

 

[SeiryuShin]

And why the hell is anyone bringing up spoilers for a still untranslaed game, either cite the source for this information or drop it for what is, uncformied information with no context

 

[Tivanenk]

Flynn = Nanashi. Both of them are the chosen messiahs by the Great Will.

 

[MagiSinbad]

Oi ! Boss ! is that you ??? :O it's been a long time ! where have you been ? :O

Flynn never killed YHVH on his own, he isn't as powerful

Hmmmm... but still fighting with another High 2-A is still considered to be a High 2-A though o3o

nothing posted puts Arisiel above True Kagutsuchi

Ummm...isnt Asriel also infinitely above another 2-A ? that would probally put him at least Metatron level ? sorry, i havent play Undertale yet

And why the hell is anyone bringing up spoilers for a still untranslaed game, either cite the source for this information or drop it for what is, uncformied information with no context

weeeeel... it's still confirmed that YHVH has a true form right ? =3=

 

[Tivanenk]

To be honest, Flowey is not a definite 2-A, but more of a maybe 2-A kind of thing. It's not really clear if he stands on the high 2-B or 2-A scale. So Asriel being above him would just be a 2-A feat. And besides, all he has is just control over the timelines which is pretty much what Kagutsuchi is.

Though, I'm not sure what Metatron has over Kagutsuchi. I thought that Kagutsuchi is now almost confirmed to be part of the Great Will and not YHVH, right?

 

[Blahblah9755]

I don't get why people keep bringing up that Asriel is above a 2-A, when that 2-A being is only capable of destroying a finite number of timelines, he's only possibly 2-A anyway since the amount of timelines he destroyed is unknown

 

[Azathoth_the_Abyssal_Idiot]

To be honest, Flowey is not a definite 2-A, but more of a maybe 2-A kind of thing. It's not really clear if he stands on the high 2-B or 2-A scale.

^^^^^

That's why he's listed as likely 2-A, and he's definitely not on the infinite universes end of that scale.

Base Asriel should probably be Kagutsuchi level. Not sure about Angel of Death mode, but I reeeeaaallly don't think it can match up to YHVH, who is ridiculously powerful even by SMT standards.

 

[SeiryuShin]

Oi ! Boss ! is that you ??? :O it's been a long time ! where have you been ? :O
Flynn never killed YHVH on his own, he isn't as powerful

Hmmmm... but still fighting with another High 2-A is still considered to be a High 2-A though o3o

nothing posted puts Arisiel above True Kagutsuchi

Ummm...isnt Asriel also infinitely above another 2-A ? that would probally put him at least Metatron level ? sorry, i havent play Undertale yet

And why the hell is anyone bringing up spoilers for a still untranslaed game, either cite the source for this information or drop it for what is, uncformied information with no context

weeeeel... it's still confirmed that YHVH has a true form right ? =3=

for 1) Satan was part of the party which defeated YHVH with Aleph, but he's still not as powerful as Aleph or YHVH is

for 2), the Amala network is endless in the original japanese version, the billions of universes is just how many are underoing conception at one time


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KEudV31xQR0

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I_x6UNF1MdQ


"The Amala Universe contains infinite parallel worlds (universes). This is seen in the description of time as infinite, when the Amala Universe is where "time and space meld together and flow as one". Additionally, the word used for countless when talking about the number of worlds in the Amala Universe is þäíµò░, which can be translated as infinite. Now, any one avatar of Kagutuchi only delegates to one universe. These avatars being defeated is normal, and what's supposed to happen in the creation of a new world.


TDE Demi-fiend killed Kagutsuchi so hard that the entire entity died, taking time and the entire Amala Universe with it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ruXy9nkRfAA"


I won't be debating 4 Final until someone sources these spoilers properly, or until the game is properly translated and released.

 

[SeiryuShin]

To be honest, Flowey is not a definite 2-A, but more of a maybe 2-A kind of thing. It's not really clear if he stands on the high 2-B or 2-A scale. So Asriel being above him would just be a 2-A feat. And besides, all he has is just control over the timelines which is pretty much what Kagutsuchi is.
Though, I'm not sure what Metatron has over Kagutsuchi. I thought that Kagutsuchi is now almost confirmed to be part of the Great Will and not YHVH, right?

You have it backwards here, SJ confirms Metatron is the superiour Avatar as he is what is required for YHVH to achieve his full power, not Kagutsuchi. Even in Nocturn alone Metatron shook the entire Amala Multiverse just by speaking

 

[MagiSinbad]

Not really understand why you have to bring up Amala Netwwork here, since most of us are already saw ThanatoSeraph's quote a ton of times o3o

Anyway, this thread is pretty much concluded, YHVH win this easily. Anybody disargree with this result ?

 

[Tivanenk]

But Kagutsuchi isn't even an avatar of YHVH. Shiryu, so how can they be compared? Or did SJ directly compare them?

 

[SeiryuShin]

YHVH created Kagutsuchi himself and he is an avatar, just an uneeded one. He sits at the bottom of the top tier give or take. Metatron is called the strongest warrior of Light according to Lucifer and is stated to be One with God (YHVH)

 

[Amelia_Lonelyheart]

I did a quick count up of the votes. Sorry if I got anything wrong.

YHVH: 6-7, kind of hard to tell who Elvis was going with when I skimmed

Asriel: 1

Stalemate: 1

 

[Tivanenk]

YHVH created Kagutsuchi himself and he is an avatar, just an uneeded one. He sits at the bottom of the top tier give or take. Metatron is called the strongest warrior of Light according to Lucifer and is stated to be One with God (YHVH)

Where does it say that Kagutsuchi is YHVH's avatar? Because I've seen evidence that he is the Great Will's avatar.

 

[Amelia_Lonelyheart]

YHVH created Kagutsuchi himself and he is an avatar, just an uneeded one. He sits at the bottom of the top tier give or take. Metatron is called the strongest warrior of Light according to Lucifer and is stated to be One with God (YHVH)

Where does it say that Kagutsuchi is YHVH's avatar? Because I've seen evidence that he is the Great Will's avatar.

I've yet to play Nocturne, but I found this on Kagutsuchi's page on the SMT wiki.

"Kagutsuchi is the embodiment of the sun, and like YHVH is an avatar of the Great Will."

http://megamitensei.wikia.com/wiki/Kagutsuchi#Trivia

 

[The_Everlasting]

SMT III treats YHVH as the Great Will, it was retconned in SMT IV Final.

 

[Tivanenk]

SMT II treats YHVH as the Great Will, it was retconned in SMT IV Final.

YHVH himself states that the will of the universe (TGW) will bring him back, so how exactly is he treated as the Great Will?

 

[The_Everlasting]

Because Lucifer states in SMT III that the Great Will is his creator, but we know YHVH created him.

 

[Salavtore]

It's a very complicated thing with SMT series, they stopped making sense when the 3rd game came out.

 

[Tivanenk]

Because Lucifer states in SMT III that the Great Will is his creator, but we know YHVH created him.

Since when? I've always viewed Lucifer as YHVH's equal who grows in power between games.

 

[SeiryuShin]

SMT IV Final spoilers need to be sourced or I'm ignoring them. As it stands in Nocturne the Great Will and YHVH are one and the same, which makes Kagutsuchi an avatar of YHVH aong with MEtatron.