Archie Sonic High 2-A?

[Sound_of_Infinity]

Also if the downgrade is applied then stuffs like True Enerjak or Aurora would be downgraded as well right?

 

[Ricsi-viragosi]

yea

 

[Dark649]

Yes, the Source of All would become at least 2-A.

 

[Sound_of_Infinity]

RIP then.

Also forgot but I agree with the downgrades.

 

[Sound_of_Infinity]

Anyways, since many people agreed to this, should we close the thread and change it to 2-A...?

 

[Dark649]

They might be downgraded to Infinite speed unless i find the scan that says that Solaris can see through time.

 

[Dark_Matter557]

Destroying the concept of the Chaos Force =/= the CF is a concept.

If you destroyed the concept of "human" everyone would die, but humans aren't living concepts.

@Easy

Even Dark agrees with 4-D Chaos Force tho

You know even a dog is a concept (just concrete), right? In addition, all of Chaos Energy is just a physical manifestation of Chaos Force, all Chaos Energy comes from it. There is nothing that is not a concept, the only difference is that there are the Universal concepts and concrete

 

[Sound_of_Infinity]

Then they're pretty much nothing different than Game Sonic. Except for AP.

But wow, that's a massive downgrade.

 

[Kaltias]

@DM

But only manipulating the abstract concept grants you conceptual manipulation.

And source of energy =/= the very concept of energy.

 

[Dark_Matter557]

Destroying the concept of the Chaos Force =/= the CF is a concept.

If you destroyed the concept of "human" everyone would die, but humans aren't living concepts.

@Easy

Even Dark agrees with 4-D Chaos Force tho

Also, the Chaos Force is literally the fundamental energy of the verse, basically the Chaos Force is the cause of all and any existing energy besides having a form beyond the physical and astral. I do not know what else it need for Chaos Force to have platonic nature than this

 

[Dark_Matter557]

@DM

But only manipulating the abstract concept grants you conceptual manipulation.

And source of energy =/= the very concept of energy.

It turns out that Chaos Force is the fundamental energy of verse, everything related to energy comes from it

And okay, I've already explained that the Chaos Force something is abstract same, this need not be explicitly quoted in the franchise if have evidence of it

 

[Dark649]

Here is the scan.

 

[Sound_of_Infinity]

So is the speed getting downgraded or no?

 

[Dark649]

Depends if Kaltias says that Solaris feats qualifies or not.

 

[Kaltias]

I don't think that he is immeasurable, he is bound by linear time according to that scan.

 

[Executor_N0]

Well, I've walked away from Sonic for now about more specific things like this, but this Solaris issue is something simple to explain. Solaris clearly is not limited by linear time.

The whole idea of Solaris is "A super-dimensional transcendental life-form that exists in the past, present, and future." Defeating it here and now will do nothing, it will consume all axes of time erasing the meaning of Time.

If Solaris were limited to linear time, there would be no reason to say that defeating it in the present would have no effect. It would have no effect because it exists also in all past and future. In order to beat Solaris you would have to attack through all the time.

That's what Sonic, Silver and Shadow did. The three attacked Solaris through all the time destroying it after destroying his mind. With the Solaris entity destroyed they had to go back in the past and destroy the Solaris flame, which would be the manifestation of power that had not yet been destroyed by the three hedgehogs.

When the flame was erased, time was rewritten. But Solaris was only erased when it was destroyed through all past, present and future.

Summarizing: Flushing the flame in the past was not what really destroyed Solaris, which destroyed Solaris was the three hedgehogs attacking through the past, present and future. What Sonic did was erase the events that started all this, ending up with the existence of Solaris (What did not happen, because Solaris still existed on the timeline. Apparently he was one of the Mago Ixis created by Mogul, I remember having seen a statue of Solaris next to that of Mogul in one of the last editions before the Reboot, but I may be confusing things).

And being sincere, if Solaris were killed for having "his past destroyed" then there would be no point in him destroying the time itself, much less being told that he could not be vanquished unless they destroyed him at all of time.

 

[Sound_of_Infinity]

So no speed downgrade or yes?

 

[The_real_cal_howard]

@Ex. Wasn't the transcendental nature only in the games?

 

[Sound_of_Infinity]

Bump

 

[Kaltias]

In this case i'm not sure if it counts as immeasurable or not tbh.

Would the CF be 2-A?

 

[Sound_of_Infinity]

In this case i'm not sure if it counts as immeasurable or not tbh.

Would the CF be 2-A?

Probably. Unless someone can prove CF is 5-D.

 

[Executor_N0]

@Ex. Wasn't the transcendental nature only in the games?

The nature is the same of the games, when Achie does not create an adaptation of a game, then the original version of the game is the one used. Just look at Sonic Adventure 2, it was not adapted for the Comic version and so Archie said "play the game to understand the story". In addition to the "Pre-SGW" already has mentions of "Go see the games to understand this story we do not adapt" as when Tails mentions the Launch Base and then it says "Play Sonic 2 to understand", which is something valid because Sonic 2 has not been adapted.

So much so that in the forums of Ian Flyn he discussed about 06 using the game version to talk about the characters, how to try to explain the history of the 06 being that Blaze had already been presented without any relation with Sonic 06. Then he spoke to see the Japanese version of the game to understand that the problems were caused by the bad adaptation in the English version.

In addition, the basis of the Solaris story is literally the same as the games. The only difference is that there is the theory that Solaris (Just like Chaos) were in the past Ixis created by Mogul. I do not think there would be any reason for Ian to literally explain the whole 2006 story using only one page of an encyclopedia, which was not to explain it (Actually, the information contained in the encyclopedia mostly when it is new was made only to confirm information that Ian had explained in his forum, but that he could not find a way to explain them in the comic).

So by default, the history of the games is applied in Comic as long as there is no contradiction, or at least similarly. (At least it is the production team's explanation for the claim that Sonic Adventure 2 was canonical being that many things would be strange to apply in Comic)

 

[Executor_N0]

In this case i'm not sure if it counts as immeasurable or not tbh.

Would the CF be 2-A?

Well, I see no real reason why it would be immeasurable.

Chaos Force in the case is just a different plane of reality, the power is gained when someone merges with it. At least if there was no balance (This is why Knuckles had to stay in Chaos Force, keep his balance. Since he did not stay, Mogul gained all the power of Chaos Force and used it to destroy all zones and thus create his new multiverse)

 

[UltimateSaiyanGoku23]

I Don't think archie sonic should be 2-A At all. Only 2-C Or Low 2-C.

 

[Dark649]

I Don't think archie sonic should be 2-A At all. Only 2-C Or Low 2-C.

Now, you are downplaying.

 

[Epsilon_R]

I Don't think archie sonic should be 2-A At all. Only 2-C Or Low 2-C.

So much downplaying in one sentence...

 

[Sound_of_Infinity]

So are we all agreeing with Infinite speed? Or it stays at Immeasurable?

 

[UltimateSaiyanGoku23]

I Don't think archie sonic should be 2-A At all. Only 2-C Or Low 2-C.

So much downplaying in one sentence...

Im not downplaying Archie Super Sonic is Only 2-C. Including Enerjak.

 

[UltimateSaiyanGoku23]

So are we all agreeing with Infinite speed? Or it stays at Immeasurable?

No. Archie Sonic Does Not Have Immeasurable Speed. Nor Infinite.

 

[ShakeResounding]

You... Really hate Sonic, don't you?

 

[Epsilon_R]

Im not downplaying Archie Super Sonic is Only 2-C. Including Enerjak.

Arguments ?

 

[The_real_cal_howard]

Even I'm certain that Super Sonic and co. are at least 2-A.

 

[Epsilon_R]

Also I'm surprised to see a downgrade for the Archie Universe already. That's only two weeks since their upgrade x)

 

[The_real_cal_howard]

Lasted longer than when Azzy downgraded Kirby from 3-A not one day after I did an upgrade ovo.

 

[Epsilon_R]

Even I'm certain that Super Sonic and co. are at least 2-A.

I think it could be At least 2-A, possibly High 2-A or At least 2-A, High 2-A with reality warping/hax.

 

[Epsilon_R]

Lasted longer than when Azzy downgraded Kirby from 3-A not one day after I did an upgrade ovo.

Oh... nvm

 

[Sound_of_Infinity]

Should we apply this now?

 

[Dark_Matter557]

Apply platonic nature to beings that merge with Chaos Force too

 

[Bobsican]

Even I'm certain that Super Sonic and co. are at least 2-A.

I think it could be At least 2-A, possibly High 2-A or At least 2-A, High 2-A with reality warping/hax.

I agree with this.

 

[The_real_cal_howard]

But what would High 2-A even come from though? This thread's about the Chaos Force being 2-A, not High 2-A.