All Might VS Maui (Disney)

[Kingofwolves999]

Wait, how does Maui destroy AM in hand to hand combat? The stat difference is no where near that high, Prime All Might scales heavily above 4.82 gigatons with just his air pressure, and one shots people who get hurt by that with his actual punches. Maui doesn't win in cqc since, despite his age, he doesn't seem to have any actual hand to hand combat skills or training. AM has extensive h2h experience, so he could just beat Maui down that way.

 

[Jackythejack]

Hold up retracting my vote for a moment

 

[Kingofwolves999]

Also, if there's one thing I've learned from this wiki for a while now, it's that LS does not help you against being blown away by something that has to do with your size rather than strength. Just cause Maui has higher LS does not mean he can't be thrown around by AM. He can outmuscle him, but if he gets tripped up and punched in the jaw or picked up and tossed, he doesn't just ignore it. He gets blown away because it has to do with size not lifting strength.

 

[Abstractions]

Maui wins in hand to hand if he succeeds in any sort of grapple, Toshinori will be immobilized by vastly superior strength,. He doesn't need to be more skilled for that.

Maui can also of course use his shapeshifting to make himself less predictable, which helps.

 

[Kingofwolves999]

How does he grapple someone who is way smarter than him in actual combat?

Shapeshifting is not going to trip up All Might, who deals with even weirder and stranger powers on a daily basis. He's figure it out and begin countering it very easily

 

[Kingofwolves999]

Does Maui even try to grapple in character? He seems to just swing his fish hook and try to hit stuff. All Might will see through his fighting style and beat him into submission. A couple hundred punches to the face are ready to be thrown at a moments notice, and it's not like Maui is capable of severely injuring AM outside of grabbing him. Like I said, the actual aP/Dura difference is WAY smaller than it would appear if you only look at weakened AM's 4.82 gigaton feat

 

[Kingofwolves999]

Prime AM > one shots > Prime Air Pressure >>>>> Weakened AM > one shots > Air Pressure = 4.82 gigatons

 

[Kingofwolves999]

But seriously, what are Maui's actual combat feats? How does he even attempt to get a grab off on AM?

 

[Abstractions]

How does he grapple someone who is way smarter than him in actual combat?

Shapeshifting is not going to trip up All Might, who deals with even weirder and stranger powers on a daily basis. He's figure it out and begin countering it very easily

By being at least three times stronger physically and by being able to lift many, many times more than his opponent can? All Might is a skilled brawler, not some insane martial artist that can make up for his glaring disadvantages, his solution to the Noumu was punching it harder for gods sake.

Obviously but he needs exposure to it, and it's not like the standard Quirk that's limited very specific things, Maui can shapeshift into what animal he desires, he'll need to analyze for a while to find its limits to make a counter.

 

[Joaco0902]

Then again, it's not like Maui never fought before.

 

[Kingofwolves999]

Being capable of getting grabs off does not allow you to get a grab off. Him being stronger doesn't mean anything if his opponent just dodges around his every attempt.

He's a skilled brawler who has way more experience actually fighting than Maui. That's like saying a black belt for 10 years can't beat a 300 year old person who's never fought in their life. Also, the Nomu solution worked because there was literally no other way of beating Nomu. He tried to seal him in concrete but Kurigiri intervend, so he had to end the fight quickly. He's not an idiotic brute.

How much exposure does he need to make the guess that Maui can just turn into animals?

 

[Kingofwolves999]

I know Maui has fought before. But he has no where near the level of skill in fighting his age would have you think he has. He's not like a god of war or something. His fighting experience, at least from the movie, is not skilled at all.

 

[Abstractions]

Being capable of getting grabs off does not allow you to get a grab off. Him being stronger doesn't mean anything if his opponent just dodges around his every attempt.

He's a skilled brawler who has way more experience actually fighting than Maui. That's like saying a black belt for 10 years can't beat a 300 year old person who's never fought in their life. Also, the Nomu solution worked because there was literally no other way of beating Nomu. He tried to seal him in concrete but Kurigiri intervend, so he had to end the fight quickly. He's not an idiotic brute.

How much exposure does he need to make the guess that Maui can just turn into animals?

Of course, which is why his shapeshifting can come in handy for this very thing.

Implying Maui has never fought before, despite clearly having battled with Tamatoa many times in the past.

I never said he was an idiotic brute, but his solution to dealing with someone stronger was to just keep punching it, there's little technique involved which you imply All Might is full of.

Maui can turn into animals but All Might won't know to what extent without witnessing it firsthand, we have no proof of him encountering a shapeshifting quirk with as much applications as Maui's.

 

[Kingofwolves999]

How skilled is Maui in using his Shapeshifting vs someone his size with better actual combat ability?

I know he's fought before, I commented about it. His fighting experience is not as much as his age, given by his terrible style and lack of combat feats. He spent most of his time on an island doing nothing.

All Might literally tried everything he could to stop Nomu before just "punching it harder". He figured that since it had shock absorption, not nullification, he could overwhelm it, blow it away and save his students. You downplaying his intelligence vs Nomu is appalling.

> All Might sees Maui turn into a bird to dodge his punch.

> "he must turn into a bird"

> Maui turns into a different animal

> "ah, so he turns into different animals."

Literally how do you think AM won't pick up on this with his several decades of fighting super powered people.

 

[Kingofwolves999]

Also, it's not like shape shifting makes Maui invisible or something. AM will still know where Maui is when he transforms, so even then he can't surprise change back and grapple him without likely getting punched in the face.

 

[Abstractions]

We don't know, but shapeshifting is what he tends to do most of the time, assuming he's suddenly a dunce just because his target is his size is silly.

Not downplaying his intelligence, I'm driving a peg into the skill pedestal he's being put on. This is the exact scenario as the Noumu but instead of Regenerationn and shock absorption it's physical strength. My point is that overpowering something with punches alone isn't a heavy indicator of skill, and since All Might trashes everything in verse and has next to no peer save AFO, it's hard to see where he can garner up amazing skill feats.

Literally said All Might just needs time to pick up on it because Maui's shapeshifting is more extensive than other transformation Quirks he may have seen, but this is time that Maui has the advantage because of that.

 

[Kingofwolves999]

And 3x is an overstatement. If Prime AM's air pressure is even just 2x as strong as his weakened forms, the difference is lower than 2x between his and Maui's AP/Dura.

 

[Kingofwolves999]

So his skill with shape shifting is to just do it to dodge, right? In which case AM will catch on quickly and begin anticipating him shifting back, or just punching him while he's transformed.

I'm not putting him on a skill pedestal, I'm pointing out how much better he is than Maui in actual combat. He's fought more enemies, trained more and thinks more in combat than Maui does. His immediate thoughts on seeing Nomu were to punch his head to disorient him, then to restrain him, then to overwhelm and BFR him. That is more thinking and planning than Maui has put in.

Maui has an advantage maybe two times with his shape shifting. Then he just starts getting punched regardless of his form.

 

[Abstractions]

Well, it's not like Maui had a hard time pulling the islands from the sea or found it difficult to hold up the sky judging by how his tattoo showed it, those feats could easily be considered casual on his part.

 

[Kingofwolves999]

That doesn't make the scaling chain any less. AM can one shot people that are hurt by his air pressure. Even if it was casual, it was not so casual as to make the AP difference any more than 2-3x, which is not big enough to be shrugging off dozens of AM's attacks.

 

[Kingofwolves999]

Heck, if Maui goes into a small form or tries to fly, All Might can just do a Nebraska or Oklahoma Smash to wrap him in a tornado and damage him that way.

 

[SakuraDorms]

I'm leaning towards Superma All Might on this for Kingofwolves' and others' reasons

 

[Moritzva]

Maui FRA.

 

[Kingofwolves999]

When would Maui even try to grapple AM anyway? He doesn't do that in character, and any attempts to do so after AM figures out his powers will get dodged, negged by tornadoes or will just get Maui punched.

 

[Ricsi-viragosi]

The tornadoes would fail to push Maui away, and all he would need to do is become an insect and the shock waves wouldn't even be concentrated enough to hurt at all.

A long ranged fight will just exhaust All Might. A close ranged one gives Maui a changlce to grab all might, and with the difference even literally grabbing with index and pinkie finger would be enough for all might to be unable to undo the grip regardless of how much effort he puts in.

And Maui can just transform into an insect and go to All Might while he looses sight of his enemy a id's the tornadoes.

 

[Therefir]

All Might's air pressure isn't pushing back someone with ridiculously higher LS, and Maui doesn't need to begin the engagement by turning into a hawk.

I'm pretty Maui having Class E in lifting strength doesn't mean he can't be pushed by anything not close to that, the weight of his body is still the same, and if he has nothing to hold on to, he'll be pushed easily.

This is basically the same treatment we have with Telekinesis, it doesn't really matter the character's lifting strength, but their weight.

 

[Ricsi-viragosi]

That would be true if he didn't have wings.


And if he is simply pushed, then the whole force that is supposed to hurt him... doesn't, because pushing takes away majority of the hit anyways. At best that means that all might prolongs the fight.

 

[Kingofwolves999]

Well, AM got downgraded again and is no longer 6-C. So oof this match.