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Neutral on this. A lot of the connotation seems to be flowery language but is equally likely to be literal.
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Above Heaven and Below Earth, 0 Alone Surpasses 13
- Thread starter Arc7Kuroi
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Arcker123
He/Him- 8,087
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This is a nonsense statement.
It literally incomprehensible. Do you know what connotation.
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- #123
The notion of it being flowery is refuted in the OP, so if you’d like to substantiate your claim and provide reasoning for it go ahead. But if you simply disagree because your own personal reasons then go ahead as well. I just won’t need to or will have to address your disagreement. But if you’re okay with that more power to you.
Hasty12345
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As obnoxious as they may be, I do see Neco’s argument. Clearly with the DB BoG feat we do not see the waves travel through time, there’s no evidence of such and the feat is still considered tier 2 - which is more or less similar to this feat.
So it’s not like the wiki consistently applies these standards.
But it’s obviously 4-A, so I agree with the thread.
So it’s not like the wiki consistently applies these standards.
But it’s obviously 4-A, so I agree with the thread.
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Doesn't need to show that tbh our standards say it must be shown to "significantly affect" the universe the time thing isn't an end all be all by any means
See here so you can be familiar with our standards
Tiering System
The following is a comprehensive overview of the hierarchical system the VS Battles Wiki utilizes to properly categorize and index fictional characters, entities, and objects based on the scale of their feats and the varying scopes that they can affect or create/destroy. Though Destructive...
vsbattles.fandom.com
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Isn't the BoG feat considered Tier 2 because there are several statements of universal destruction, with a universe in DB consisting of several space-times? Something lacking here.
I agree with 4-A, neutral on possibly T2
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You are correct. The comparison here simply does not apply. DB doesn't have tier 2 just with realm shakes, but statement of outright destruction (in the case of Super) and showcase of the actual space-time of the realms being affected (in the case of Toei).
Overall, I agree with Arc here.
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- #130
So are you in favor of just 4-A or 4-A, likely/possibly 2-C?
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Agree with 4-A upgrade, neutral about 2-C tier fra.
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Only 4-A for now.
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When this goes through which characters are supposed to get updated? Squad Zero, Ichigo, Yhwach, Aizen & Kenpachi?
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- #134
Mfs just don’t read the OP huh. Is it that hard to just not derail the thread. Again the scaling is not changing, as in who scales to who is not changing, merely the tiering would change. If you want to ask off topic questions ask them outside of this thread. Does everyone understand 
Hasty12345
Username Only- 5,350
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I am familiar with the standards, I think you've misunderstood what I was referring to, the DB example is comparable given Elder Kai explicitly only ever mentioned there would be nothing left in the universe.Doesn't need to show that tbh our standards say it must be shown to "significantly affect" the universe the time thing isn't an end all be all by any means
See here so you can be familiar with our standards
Tiering System
The following is a comprehensive overview of the hierarchical system the VS Battles Wiki utilizes to properly categorize and index fictional characters, entities, and objects based on the scale of their feats and the varying scopes that they can affect or create/destroy. Though Destructive...
But that's neither here nor there, I'll drop it.
not like I just asked people to stop derailing or anything
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There is no showcase of the space-time of the realms being affected. There is a showcase of the universe being affected, but no space-time.
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So the statement is, "With just a wave of our sleeves, the universe/heaven and earth of all three realms shake". The important thing comes from when she does in fact wave her sleeve and nothing happens. Things only kick in once she uses her bankai, and then we only see the realms shaking and not the universe. The statement ties itself to Buddhism which refers to something higher than one's self which in this case would be the universe. This way of speaking could easily be to assert superiority which is consistent with the super flexy term of "a wave of our sleeves" and also Senjumaru's character. Furthermore this whole scene's purpose is to show the power of Squad Zero, its the season finale as well. Taking both of those things in mind, showing something as grandiose as the universe itself shaking would be something that you would want to show if it was actually happening.
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- Thread starter
- #139
Wave of our sleeves is metaphorical speak for casual, as the passive reiatsu that spreads out from activating her Bankai causes everything to shake. So you’re correct, she isn’t saying literally moving her arm. But that doesn’t address the argument at hand, and furthermore all you’re doing is assuming the intent of the episode writers and animators. As I addressed in the OP, us not seeing the entire universe is not evidence of it being excluded from the feat and thus contradicted Shutara. Arguing from the position of “oh it’s a season finale and like they would’ve done x y and z” is a “feelings argument” and thus incredulous. Because what your claim boils down to is “I think that if the animators thought x they would’ve animated y” and “it’s only super impressive because it’s a season finale”. None of those are actual arguments that address what we are told and shown. Lastly, yes the scene is meant to show Squad 0 being superior to the Elite Sternritter, that is not mutually exclusive to what I claim in the OP. Nothing you presented is a defeater to the argument provided, it’s still okay to personally disagree but recognize that arguments from emotions are not logically valid.
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And that's why I don't support even a possibly 2-C, thank you.
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im talking about db here. db did not require such a showing,
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- #142
What don’t you understand about stop mentioning dragon ball in a Bleach thread dude, like do I have to report you to RVR or get a thread mod to warn you to understand?
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Arcker123
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I'll address this tomorrow. Ima tired.
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- #147
Good luck and good night
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you cant show a space time continuum shaking because it is not a physical object.
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- #149
You absolutely can represent tier 2 constructs in fiction visually. So yes you can show such in fiction. Is it always shown? No, but can it? Yes.
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there's a reason why its called"space-time"
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In fiction where the assumed universe is like our own, it cannot. Unless it is shown to be separate, you have to assume it is connected, as that is how it works in real life.
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- #152
Nope lol, if Kubo wants to show the entire dimension he can. Nothing you say can disprove that. He can absolutely represent the spacetimes visually if he wants. End of discussion. Like you understand that as per your very own claims there is a level of uncertainty in the claim about the 2-C shaking, hence why at best it’s being proposed for a likely rating. Do you understand that at the very least?
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Literally not possible.
Spacetime - Simple English Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
This is shown by the dangai, as ichigo spends months in there, but in the human world, only a few hours has passed.
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- #155
Artistically, you can illustrate whatever you like. Just because irl we cannot see 4D objects, because we are 3D doesn’t mean authors cannot depict 4D objects. You’re appealing to reality. Your argument is absurd and lead to conclusions like, characters cannot be faster than light since FTL is impossible irl, or characters cannot have more than infinite energy, etc etc etc. You’re an absurdist and just blatantly wrong.Literally not possible.
Spacetime - Simple English Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
simple.wikipedia.org
This is shown by the dangai, as ichigo spends months in there, but in the human world, only a few hours has passed.
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they should threadban you first for contributing nothing except snide remarks.
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I'm not saying this isn't possible at all, but this is not possible in the current setting because the human world is supposed to represent our current universe.
Some appealing to reality is necessary, unless you have things like, calcs cannot be used because the concept of physics is completely different, cold is hot and hot is cold, etc.
This is not what im arguing. Appealing to reality is only a fallacy if in that specific case, it has been proven wrong. Otherwise, an appeal to reality is necessary. We have no scans or feats that show the space-time of the bleach universes to be different from our universe of relativity. We do have feats that prove the opposite though, like I presented.
ok lol
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I should mention I agree with 4-A, nothing else though of course my opinion doesn't hold much value but that's alright
Hasty12345
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dude you've said your piece, just drop it.
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