𝟨-𝐵 𝒯𝑜𝓊𝓇𝓃𝒶𝓂𝑒𝓃𝓉: 𝒲𝑜𝓇𝓁𝒹 𝑜𝒻 𝑀𝒶𝑔𝒾𝒸, 𝐿𝑒𝒮𝒽𝒶𝓎 𝓋𝓈 𝒜𝓇𝒹𝓎𝓃 𝐼𝓏𝓊𝓃𝒾𝒶

[Arnoldstone18]

Welcome to the 6-B Tournament: World Of Magic. Please see here for more information on this tournament.

---

@Kazuma_kuwabara vs @Mr._Bambu ​

ℑ𝔫 𝔞 𝔯𝔢𝔞𝔩𝔪 𝔬𝔣 𝔪𝔞𝔤𝔦𝔠 𝔞𝔫𝔡 𝔪𝔦𝔤𝔥𝔱,
𝔚𝔥𝔢𝔯𝔢 𝔥𝔢𝔯𝔬𝔢𝔰 𝔞𝔫𝔡 𝔳𝔦𝔩𝔩𝔞𝔦𝔫𝔰 𝔠𝔩𝔞𝔰𝔥 𝔦𝔫 𝔰𝔦𝔤𝔥𝔱,
𝔄 𝔱𝔬𝔲𝔯𝔫𝔞𝔪𝔢𝔫𝔱 𝔴𝔞𝔰 𝔥𝔢𝔩𝔡 𝔱𝔬 𝔣𝔦𝔫𝔡,
𝔗𝔥𝔢 𝔪𝔬𝔰𝔱 𝔭𝔬𝔴𝔢𝔯𝔣𝔲𝔩 𝔴𝔞𝔯𝔯𝔦𝔬𝔯 𝔬𝔣 𝔞𝔩𝔩 𝔨𝔦𝔫𝔡.

𝔏𝔢𝔖𝔥𝔞𝔶, 𝔱𝔥𝔢 𝔦𝔪𝔪𝔬𝔯𝔱𝔞𝔩 𝔢𝔩𝔳𝔢𝔰,
𝔚𝔥𝔬𝔰𝔢 𝔭𝔬𝔴𝔢𝔯 𝔢𝔳𝔢𝔫 𝔱𝔥𝔢 𝔤𝔬𝔡𝔰 𝔱𝔥𝔢𝔪𝔰𝔢𝔩𝔳𝔢𝔰 𝔡𝔢𝔩𝔳𝔢,
ℜ𝔲𝔩𝔢𝔡 𝔬𝔳𝔢𝔯 𝔐𝔬𝔬𝔫𝔰𝔥𝔞𝔢 ℑ𝔰𝔩𝔞𝔫𝔡𝔰 𝔳𝔞𝔰𝔱,
𝔗𝔥𝔢𝔦𝔯 𝔱𝔯𝔲𝔢 𝔫𝔞𝔱𝔲𝔯𝔢 𝔥𝔦𝔡𝔡𝔢𝔫, 𝔱𝔥𝔢𝔦𝔯 𝔭𝔬𝔴𝔢𝔯 𝔪𝔞𝔰𝔨𝔢𝔡.

𝔒𝔫𝔢 𝔏𝔢𝔖𝔥𝔞𝔶 𝔩𝔢𝔡 𝔱𝔥𝔢 𝔊𝔞𝔯𝔯𝔬𝔱𝔢,
𝔗𝔥𝔢 𝔡𝔢𝔞𝔡𝔩𝔦𝔢𝔰𝔱 𝔞𝔰𝔰𝔞𝔰𝔰𝔦𝔫𝔰 𝔱𝔬 𝔤𝔩𝔬𝔞𝔱,
𝔑𝔬 𝔬𝔫𝔢 𝔰𝔞𝔣𝔢 𝔣𝔯𝔬𝔪 𝔱𝔥𝔢𝔦𝔯 𝔡𝔢𝔞𝔡𝔩𝔶 𝔟𝔩𝔞𝔡𝔢,
𝔑𝔬𝔱 𝔢𝔳𝔢𝔫 𝔱𝔥𝔢 𝔡𝔦𝔳𝔦𝔫𝔢, 𝔴𝔥𝔬𝔰𝔢 𝔭𝔬𝔴𝔢𝔯 𝔴𝔬𝔲𝔩𝔡 𝔣𝔞𝔡𝔢.

𝔄𝔯𝔡𝔶𝔫, 𝔱𝔥𝔢 𝔦𝔪𝔪𝔬𝔯𝔱𝔞𝔩 𝔨𝔦𝔫𝔤,
𝔅𝔢𝔱𝔯𝔞𝔶𝔢𝔡 𝔟𝔶 𝔥𝔦𝔰 𝔟𝔯𝔬𝔱𝔥𝔢𝔯, 𝔥𝔦𝔰 𝔡𝔢𝔰𝔱𝔦𝔫𝔶 𝔞 𝔣𝔩𝔦𝔫𝔤,
ℭ𝔥𝔞𝔦𝔫𝔢𝔡 𝔣𝔬𝔯 𝔱𝔴𝔬 𝔱𝔥𝔬𝔲𝔰𝔞𝔫𝔡 𝔶𝔢𝔞𝔯𝔰 𝔦𝔫 𝔄𝔫𝔤𝔢𝔩𝔤𝔞𝔯𝔡,
ℌ𝔦𝔰 𝔯𝔞𝔤𝔢 𝔞𝔫𝔡 𝔱𝔥𝔦𝔯𝔰𝔱 𝔣𝔬𝔯 𝔯𝔢𝔳𝔢𝔫𝔤𝔢 𝔡𝔦𝔡 𝔫𝔬𝔱 𝔡𝔦𝔰𝔠𝔞𝔯𝔡.

𝔚𝔥𝔢𝔫 𝔣𝔯𝔢𝔢𝔡, 𝔥𝔢 𝔞𝔡𝔬𝔭𝔱𝔢𝔡 𝔞 𝔫𝔢𝔴 𝔫𝔞𝔪𝔢,
ℑ𝔷𝔲𝔫𝔦𝔞, 𝔱𝔥𝔢 𝔬𝔫𝔢 𝔴𝔥𝔬 𝔴𝔬𝔲𝔩𝔡 𝔟𝔯𝔦𝔫𝔤 𝔰𝔥𝔞𝔪𝔢,
𝔗𝔬 𝔱𝔥𝔢 𝔗𝔯𝔲𝔢 𝔎𝔦𝔫𝔤 𝔞𝔫𝔡 𝔱𝔥𝔢 ℭ𝔯𝔶𝔰𝔱𝔞𝔩 𝔥𝔢'𝔡 𝔡𝔢𝔰𝔱𝔯𝔬𝔶,
𝔚𝔦𝔱𝔥 𝔥𝔦𝔰 𝔭𝔬𝔴𝔢𝔯 𝔞𝔫𝔡 𝔠𝔲𝔫𝔫𝔦𝔫𝔤, 𝔥𝔢'𝔡 𝔟𝔯𝔦𝔫𝔤 𝔱𝔥𝔢𝔪 𝔱𝔬 𝔢𝔪𝔭𝔩𝔬𝔶.

ℑ𝔫 𝔱𝔥𝔢 𝔱𝔬𝔲𝔯𝔫𝔞𝔪𝔢𝔫𝔱 𝔬𝔣 𝔪𝔞𝔤𝔦𝔠 𝔞𝔫𝔡 𝔪𝔦𝔤𝔥𝔱,
𝔗𝔥𝔢 𝔏𝔢𝔖𝔥𝔞𝔶 𝔞𝔫𝔡 𝔄𝔯𝔡𝔶𝔫 𝔱𝔬𝔬𝔨 𝔣𝔩𝔦𝔤𝔥𝔱,
𝔗𝔥𝔢𝔦𝔯 𝔬𝔭𝔭𝔬𝔫𝔢𝔫𝔱𝔰 𝔣𝔢𝔩𝔩 𝔴𝔦𝔱𝔥 𝔞 𝔰𝔦𝔫𝔤𝔩𝔢 𝔟𝔩𝔬𝔴,
𝔄𝔰 𝔱𝔥𝔢𝔦𝔯 𝔭𝔬𝔴𝔢𝔯 𝔞𝔫𝔡 𝔪𝔦𝔤𝔥𝔱 𝔡𝔦𝔡 𝔰𝔥𝔬𝔴.

Caer Callidyrr​

LeShay vs Ardyn Izunia​

​

LeShay scales above 7 Teratons and Ardyn scales above 11.734 teratons​

• Speed Equalized
• Starting distance 10km apart and away from each other's line of sight
• Standard Equipment Permitted; Optional Equipment will be reviewed on a case-by-case basis.
• Fighters only have knowledge of their opponent's appearance and at least a vague sense of awareness of any dangerous (mid to high mid hax) abilities they possess.
• There will be civilians and vehicles in the area depending on the location of the battlefield. In other words business is as usual in those locations and battles spontaneously happens and disrupts it, however, the location's defenses will not go against the fighters so that their fight isn't impeded.
• Fighters are in character
• Stat Amps and Debuffs can not limit opponents above or below their tier respectively.
• Victory will be decided via Death or Incap or any other ways your opponents are unable to continue battle.
• The match will last up to 7 days to conclude. Otherwise, the participants with the most votes advance. In the event of no votes, the most active participants advance. In the event both participants were actively debating, then matches will be decided based on a coin flip.

 

[Arkenis]

How does Ardyn get past Shay's gaze charming him

 

[Mr. Bambu]

Gaze isn't an instant thing, presumably, so there's a chance to act. LeShay will almost certainly close gap in moments via teleport, though, and at that point it's probably over. What can Ardyn do to deal with that, in addition to spell deflection and magic dispelling?

 

[Kazuma_kuwabara]

Gaze isn't an instant thing, presumably, so there's a chance to act. LeShay will almost certainly close gap in moments via teleport, though, and at that point it's probably over. What can Ardyn do to deal with that, in addition to spell deflection and magic dispelling?

Ardyn does not attack with Magic as a first option, he starts with Ifrit Summon to cause destruction and using his weaponry to also teleport, he create clones if he wants and would use mind Manipulation if he sees this guy can cause Noctis trouble in the future plus corruption to create a Daemon

 

[Kazuma_kuwabara]

And if Ardyn has knowledge of Leshay hax and viceversa, then Ardyn knowing the gaze would snipe with weapons and constantly teleport out of the situation

 

[Mr. Bambu]

Is the summoning magic though, coz that was also the strategy of the last person.

 

[Kazuma_kuwabara]

Is the summoning magic though, coz that was also the strategy of the last person.

To be honest, it should be magic but he does not use his own magic, Ifrit literally just appears alone to help him, that is how it works and does happens with all the other summons, is a pact between a guy and the summon

When he used Ifrit, he just said "Bye guys" and Ifrit appeared, he did nothing, no effort, no magic spent, etc

Edit: And it seems that even if Ifrit is the only exception and Ardyn is in fact summoning him, the act is instant, I don´t know if Ifrit appeared alone or if Ardyn is summoning him, the rest of summons appears to help Noctis randomly though, so choose whatever you want, or instant or Ifrit appears alone by his own

 

[Kazuma_kuwabara]

Also, if you then thinks "Ok, so Ardyn never fights with Ifrit then" is because the whole story revolves about Ardyn planning everything to lose

Ardyn wants to kill Noctis and die alongside him, Noctis is the only one able to kill him but at the same time he wants revenge, so he is doing everything he can to know that Noctis will be able to kill him

So he is not gonna participate in a testing battle to see if Noctis can defeat Ifrit

 

[AnAverageUsername]

Also, if you then thinks "Ok, so Ardyn never fights with Ifrit then" is because the whole story revolves about Ardyn planning everything to lose

Ardyn wants to kill Noctis and die alongside him, Noctis is the only one able to kill him but at the same time he wants revenge, so he is doing everything he can to know that Noctis will be able to kill him

So he is not gonna participate in a testing battle to see if Noctis can defeat Ifrit

But why does he want to die

 

[Kazuma_kuwabara]

But why does he want to die

Because he is an immortal, her love interested died, his brother betrayed him(and killed his love interest) and he healed people that was ill and now that illness transformed him into a pseudo-monster

Would you like to live that way? He spent 2000 years that way and the only one that can kill him is Noctis, but his revenge was his main goal in the past, in the end, the best way is doing the revenge and dying at the same time, 200 IQ move

 

[AnAverageUsername]

Because he is an immortal, her love interested died, his brother betrayed him(and killed his love interest) and he healed people that was ill and now that illness transformed him into a pseudo-monster

Would you like to live that way? He spent 2000 years that way and the only one that can kill him is Noctis, but his revenge was his main goal in the past, in the end, the best way is doing the revenge and dying at the same time, 200 IQ move

I've only played FF1 and FF13 but that does sound reasonable

 

[Kazuma_kuwabara]

FF13

Be proud that you played a good videogame that people hates because "is not a open world"

 

[Arnoldstone18]

Looks like Arydn just summons supernaturally, not necessarily magically. And it is very combat efficient.

 

[Mr. Bambu]

To be honest, it should be magic but he does not use his own magic, Ifrit literally just appears alone to help him, that is how it works and does happens with all the other summons, is a pact between a guy and the summon

When he used Ifrit, he just said "Bye guys" and Ifrit appeared, he did nothing, no effort, no magic spent, etc

Edit: And it seems that even if Ifrit is the only exception and Ardyn is in fact summoning him, the act is instant, I don´t know if Ifrit appeared alone or if Ardyn is summoning him, the rest of summons appears to help Noctis randomly though, so choose whatever you want, or instant or Ifrit appears alone by his own

You seem on the fence about whether it is or isn't magic, given you started that by saying that you felt it was, and ended it by addressing it as though it was, despite game mechanical signs that it isn't. As such I'm going to point out the previously stated thing- summons can be dispelled.

If Ifrit is just showing up, that would be outside help and thus generally outside the scope of such battles except in specific scenarios- I'm curious if this is one of those, and if so, I would like to know what Ifrit does- if it is supernatural and so on, since in theory LeShay can also just... deflect, dispel, etc that, too. Iirc Ifrit would be immune to the charm gaze, though, since it's specifically humanoids.

I suppose I ought to clarify, as well: magic in D&D takes many forms aside from the typical arcane variety. Spontaneous magic (that of a sorcerer), magic fueled by belief or conviction (that of a cleric), magic drawn from nature (druid) or a patron (warlock) or from one's inner self (monk). The words that shape reality itself are a sort of magic, etc etc. I clarify this because while you have somewhat proposed that this summoning is not magic, I would like to know what it is, to see if it has a parallel in D&D.

 

[Kazuma_kuwabara]

Ifrit showing up would not be outside help because normally, outside help is a character calling someone mid fight (using a device or I don´t know, telepathy for example)/going somewhere to search help etc

Ifrit has a pact with Ardyn and he randomly can appear to help Ardyn with his goals, so I would count it as a indirect summon because Ardyn can´t control it and in battle is a factor that can´t be restrict

We have a rule (supposly) about limiting things that a characters can't control like transforming into a higher tier if the transformation is product of force/circumstances that said character can´t control, Ryu from street fighter for example, while fighting someone, he can sucumb to the satsui no hado and become high 7-A in a 9-A battle and because outcome is possible, trying to restrict it would be changing how the character works, I will search said rule after writting this or the thread where I read about this so you know the reason why I am writting this

And Ifrit is an Astral, by story "They are beings of a higher plane" no more explanation was given, other theory is that they are a manifestation of the planet itself

And while searching, in canon is confirmed that Summons appears of their own, so no more gameplay shenanigans or anything, the only new thing is that the summoner (Ardyn in this case) must accept the help (something that Ardyn and Noctis do mentally) and it physically taxing, albeit, Ardyn in his DLC can spam a lot the act of receiving Ifrit's help while Noctis can only do it once a day with his summons

 

[Kazuma_kuwabara]

https://vsbattles.com/threads/yor-briar-vs-ken-masters.137831/post-4834642

Here and the rule in question:

It is not fine to restrict abilities in a versus matchup, implicitly or expressly. Matches that are arranged this way should not be added to the character profiles, as they don't involve their full potential, and are only intended for casual entertainment. An exception would be if the restricted ability/technique has a separate tier from the main one, and is one the character can consciously restrict themselves from using

 

[Mr. Bambu]

Ifrit showing up would not be outside help because normally, outside help is a character calling someone mid fight (using a device or I don´t know, telepathy for example)/going somewhere to search help etc

Ifrit has a pact with Ardyn and he randomly can appear to help Ardyn with his goals, so I would count it as a indirect summon because Ardyn can´t control it and in battle is a factor that can´t be restrict

We have a rule (supposly) about limiting things that a characters can't control like transforming into a higher tier if the transformation is product of force/circumstances that said character can´t control, Ryu from street fighter for example, while fighting someone, he can sucumb to the satsui no hado and become high 7-A in a 9-A battle and because outcome is possible, trying to restrict it would be changing how the character works, I will search said rule after writting this or the thread where I read about this so you know the reason why I am writting this

And Ifrit is an Astral, by story "They are beings of a higher plane" no more explanation was given, other theory is that they are a manifestation of the planet itself

And while searching, in canon is confirmed that Summons appears of their own, so no more gameplay shenanigans or anything, the only new thing is that the summoner (Ardyn in this case) must accept the help (something that Ardyn and Noctis do mentally) and it physically taxing, albeit, Ardyn in his DLC can spam a lot the act of receiving Ifrit's help while Noctis can only do it once a day with his summons

That's... actually the opposite of outside help. What you're describing is summoning. Outside help is another entity showing up to assist another, for example, if they're allies. Superman can't show up to help Batman in a VS Match just because they're besties. In an example more closely aligned to this one, I think, Mystra cannot show up to assist Elminster in a VS Match even though she canonically does that- she is outside help. Whether this is acceptable for the purposes of the tournament I leave to the discretion of the people running it, but it would invalidate the match from being added.

If summons show up just 'cause they feel like it, that's textbook outside help.

 

[Kazuma_kuwabara]

If summons show up just 'cause they feel like it, that's textbook outside help.

Even if Ardyn has to accept his call and spent stamina in the process?

 

[Mr. Bambu]

is he actively summoning him or not, man

I will note that an exception exists, and that is if the characters are innately intertwined/together. For example, the core basis of The Lich from the Gungeon is that Kaliber will revive him should he die- that is permitted. If Ardyn is somehow directly intertwined, such that he may as well never be without Ifrit, then that would probably be valid (though I dunno FF shit outside of XII, so).

 

[Kazuma_kuwabara]

I said in my post that I finally was able to find the info about what is happening with the summons and in the end is that they first call the summoner, if the summoner accept their help, they then appear instantly, the process is absurdly fast because you see in my video Ardyn walking and then Ifrit appears without any warning, in gameplay, Noctis is fighting and you just press a button and the summon appears, so it has to be a mental call or something like that or it does not make sense (and I was confused because this is one the few things where the game is vague and is not easy to understand FFXV plot, because you has to ******* watch a film, read novels, play DLC in certain chapters of the main story and see alternative endings, so when everything is tied with duck tape, the details are blurry)

And they are not extremely interwined like Licht and kaliber but Ardyn as a possible king of Lucius is one of the few people that can get summoning help, if anything, Ifrit is corrupted by Ardyn so Ifrit is the one who is intertwined and works as a mindless puppet, even then, Ardyn still has to accept the summon's help

 

[Mr. Bambu]

Okay, so Ifrit checks in to see if he needs help, and if he does, Ifrit comes along.

So by your own admission, Ifrit is not sufficiently tied to Ardyn to qualify. I don't mind continuing the match with Ifrit involved, but it would not be able to be added to pages. Up to OP.

 

[AnAverageUsername]

Okay, so Ifrit checks in to see if he needs help, and if he does, Ifrit comes along.

So by your own admission, Ifrit is not sufficiently tied to Ardyn to qualify. I don't mind continuing the match with Ifrit involved, but it would not be able to be added to pages. Up to OP.

Matches weren't going to be added anyways it seems

 

[Mr. Bambu]

Matches weren't going to be added anyways it seems

A shame, seems a waste then. Still, with the situation sorted, up to OP, though there is less reason to disbar Ifrit if these were never intended to be legitimate matches to begin with.

 

[Arnoldstone18]

Matches weren't going to be added anyways it seems

No, matches will be added if sufficient votes are reached.

 

[Arnoldstone18]

Okay, so Ifrit checks in to see if he needs help, and if he does, Ifrit comes along.

So by your own admission, Ifrit is not sufficiently tied to Ardyn to qualify. I don't mind continuing the match with Ifrit involved, but it would not be able to be added to pages. Up to OP.

Ardyn’s pact seems similar to something like Asta’s Liebe or Yuno’s Belle. Liebe and Belle can come in to help and can be summoned into the battlefield.

This supernatural links to characters who aren’t the main fighter should not count as outside help.

 

[Arnoldstone18]

Another example is Nacht with his devils which he has a contract with.

 

[Arkenis]

Outside help always seemed pretty odd to me as a rule. If someone can summon someone to aid in combat, then "outside help" isn't exactly what's happening. Ardyn's pact though since it's not voluntary might be outside help.

 

[AnAverageUsername]

No, matches will be added if sufficient votes are reached.

Huh

Must have confused this with another tournament

 

[Kazuma_kuwabara]

since it's not voluntary might be outside help.

Thing is that Ifrit is technically a slave as he was corrupted by Ardyn

Ifrit still has to ask to appear but Ardyn always is gonna accept as is his master

So if this changes everything or not, I don´t care, we are arguing semantics at this point and Ifrit could be banned of appearing if you want, he is only a extra guy attacking, his Hax is pretty wortless, only thing is that killing Ifrit is difficult but Leshay has mid-godly regen negation, he is the only one in this tournament that can kill him literally

 

[Mr. Bambu]

Ardyn’s pact seems similar to something like Asta’s Liebe or Yuno’s Belle. Liebe and Belle can come in to help and can be summoned into the battlefield.

This supernatural links to characters who aren’t the main fighter should not count as outside help.

He's not being summoned, though. He's just choosing to show up. The match is fine to continue, frankly LeShay might well win anyways- I'm just ensuring it is clear that this match would be against the rules to be added, were it to complete.

Leshay has mid-godly regen negation, he is the only one in this tournament that can kill him literally

Optional equipment, currently not being used.

 

[Arnoldstone18]

He's not being summoned, though. He's just choosing to show up. The match is fine to continue, frankly LeShay might well win anyways- I'm just ensuring it is clear that this match would be against the rules to be added, were it to complete.


Optional equipment, currently not being used.

I know but I would prefer the match to be added

So even he can come into battle due to his contract connection to Ardyn. It will still be considered outside help?

Exceptions are things like blessings, calling upon some higher entities power for a spell, summoning familiars to battle for them, having another character as equipment or more generally spoken the things which are listed on the profile as part of a characters own powers and abilities.

 

[Arkenis]

Exceptions are things like blessings, calling upon some higher entities power for a spell, summoning familiars to battle for them, having another character as equipment or more generally spoken the things which are listed on the profile as part of a characters own powers and abilities.

He's not being summoned, though. He's just choosing to show up. The match is fine to continue, frankly LeShay might well win anyways- I'm just ensuring it is clear that this match would be against the rules to be added, were it to complete.

Ifrit still has to ask to appear but Ardyn always is gonna accept as is his master

Should be fine if he has to ask, at that point its voluntary no?

 

[Kazuma_kuwabara]

Optional equipment, currently not being used.

Is optional? His page does not say anything about any type of optional equipment, his standart equipment says that everything comes from their soul

 

[Kazuma_kuwabara]

Should be fine if he has to ask

Ifrit always has to ask first, the confussion at the beginning was me not knowing that and Ifrit randomly appearing for no reason, after searching and rewatching the lore, they do pacts, then Noctis and Ardyn has to accept their help in battle so they can appear

 

[Mr. Bambu]

Is optional? His page does not say anything about any type of optional equipment, his standart equipment says that everything comes from their soul

LeShay is older than our rules regarding optional equipment and wasn't updated (read: we didn't care to put together a CRT since we didn't think it would get used). I mentioned this in the core thread for this tourney, the cloak with EE and Mid-Godly neg is a special piece of gear held by one LeShay, the leader of the Garrote. Their swords and shit are conjured from their soul though, aye.

 

[Mr. Bambu]

I know but I would prefer the match to be added

So even he can come into battle due to his contract connection to Ardyn. It will still be considered outside help?

Based on what Kazuma, who represents Ardyn for this tournament, said: yeah. The exceptions are given sparingly to characters who more or less don't exist without the aid of their given summon.

 

[Arnoldstone18]

Based on what Kazuma, who represents Ardyn for this tournament, said: yeah.

I think he said he was confused.


Last question,
Do cases like below count as outside help or summoning?

Ifrit always has to ask first, the confussion at the beginning was me not knowing that and Ifrit randomly appearing for no reason, after searching and rewatching the lore, they do pacts, then Noctis and Ardyn has to accept their help in battle so they can appear

Because I think Ardyn can summon ifrit and Ifrit can also ask Ardyn if he needs help so that Ardyn can bring him to battle. The latter shouldn't be outside help right?

 

[Kazuma_kuwabara]

Because I think Ardyn can summon ifrit

Ardyn can´t summon Ifrit by his own

Ifrit ask him, Ardyn accepts, Ifrit appears

In gameplay, you don´t have an option to summon anything, the option appears randomly, you use it

If you have played ff7 remake, in certain battles you can build a gauge and the summon, is an action the wielder do, in FF15 the Summon has to ask permission, then Ardyn/Noctis accepts, this happens after Ardyn corrupts Ifrit or Noctis do a pact with Titan, Leviathan, Ramuh or Shiva

After this battle, we should change the pages of both characters, because Lore states this: "Though the king can summon the gods to his aid, he cannot simply do so at will, and the Astrals decide to help him on their own. Glimmering "soul crystals" appear in the air when an Astral is offering the chance for the king to summon, but according to Noctis, summoning "takes a lot out of him", implying it is physically exhausting to do. When Prompto asks why don't they simply summon Astrals for every battle, Noctis retorts "easy for you to say". "

And I already said that Ifrit was corrupted by Ardyn, but there is NOTHING, that states "Well, now Ardyn can summon him instead of waiting to recieved his help", I searched, I can´t find anything, the only thing would be that now Ifrit is actively calling for being corrupted and always wants to help, that technically would change that now Ifrit is always waiting for Ardyn permission, but nothing else, the process is still the same

 

[Arkenis]

Ifrit ask him, Ardyn accepts, Ifrit appears

So what Im hearing is that Ifrit could possibly want to help Arnold but he usually doesn't? Should just move on from this summoning bs and move on to other points.

 

[Arnoldstone18]

Alright then i guess this match won't be added.

Lets continue