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6-A Stat Revisions

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Remember, I'm pretty sure DB doesn't use its multipliers because they are regularly inconsistent in regard to the characters actual power, and thown around a fuckton. NNT has absolutely nothing in common with DB in terms of multiplier scaling.
 
What? I was saying that if DB's multipliers which don't have anything wrong with them and aren't non canon aren't allowed then they shouldn't make one verse's correct multiplier's not allowed and allow multipliers to other verses. All multipliers aren't allowed.
 
Multipliers should be treated fairly among franchises. Also the 1000x multiplier is legit. When we have a literal source being a scientific analyzer that does not make anything seem stronger than it is as well as scans supporting said gap in power. It is not Hyperbole.

The simple fact is we should be consistent with how we treat multipliers. Otherwise we are going to have issue after issue of people asking "Why isn't this multiplier accepted when this verse did the same thing?" "Why are you so biased towards this verse and let them have a multiplier when this verse could have one accepted" ad nauseum. Hence why I plan to make a thread on multipliers tomorrow.

I am sorry, but we have to have standards for this, which is what I want. We need consistency, which is what I want. You came in here basically saying "you are all bullshitting this because of Dragon Ball stuff" Dragon Ball is not word of god. But when we see a a possible double standard, I am sorry, but I will not accept it too lightly. I do that to every verse, especially ones I like.
 
Again, Appeal to Tradition. Dragon Ball is known for being heavily inconsistent. And it throws around multipliers far more than NNT ever has. I don't know what you're trying to argue here. Other than that Dragon Ball's own standards are the word of god.
 
No, you are misinterpreting. Everyone's multipliers aren't ignored because of Dragon Ball's Multipliers, Dragon Ball's multiplier's are ignored because everyone's multipliers are ignored. When a verse is inconsistent you don't ignore every feat, you just use what's consistent like with DC and Marvel.
 
Dragonmasterxyz said:
Multipliers should be treated fairly among franchises. Also the 1000x multiplier is legit. When we have a literal source being a scientific analyzer that does not make anything seem stronger than it is as well as scans supporting said gap in power. It is not Hyperbole.
The simple fact is we should be consistent with how we treat multipliers. Otherwise we are going to have issue after issue of people asking "Why isn't this multiplier accepted when this verse did the same thing?" "Why are you so biased towards this verse and let them have a multiplier when this verse could have one accepted" ad nauseum. Hence why I plan to make a thread on multipliers tomorrow.

I am sorry, but we have to have standards for this, which is what I want. We need consistency, which is what I want. You came in here basically saying "you are all bullshitting this because of Dragon Ball stuff" Dragon Ball is not word of god. But when we see a a possible double standard, I am sorry, but I will not accept it too lightly. I do that to every verse, especially ones I like.
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Then I'm afraid your "Standards" need some serious re-adjustment.

We have people bitch about DB stats all the time. I doubt this would be anything we haven't seen before. Again, still a massive Appeal to Tradition fallacy.

You sure seem to be treating DB as word of god when you guys always love to throw DB examples around so much. You can't deny how much people use it to standardize things on here.

Again, what Gargoyle said. It's something that only applies to two God-Tiers, and does not massively inflate statistics like DB multipliers would. Consistency is not the issue, despite how much you love to talk about it. Stat inflation beyond what we would consider reasonable however is.

I'm sorry, but I will not change my stance on this.
 
DragonEmperor23 said:
No, you are misinterpreting. Everyone's multipliers aren't ignored because of Dragon Ball's Multipliers, Dragon Ball's multiplier's are ignored because everyone's multipliers are ignored. When a verse is inconsistent you don't ignore every feat, you just use what's consistent like with DC and Marvel.
Click to expand...
Multipliers should be a Case by Case analysis for each verse, and not put all of fiction in one box because of "Muh consistency" And we should be more worried about a multiplier inflating stats to outlier proportions, unreasonable proportions, or that just don't make sense context wise.
 
I am going by experience due to said controversy regarding multipliers in general. Not just Dragon Ball as you assume. GoHS, YYH, Dragon Ball, NNT, Digimon, are all the topics here. Matter of fact, let's go over this.

Dragon Ball was brought up with other verses. We had a conversation to get confirmation on the whole Frieza stuff with percents and powers.

Sorry, but I vehemently disagree. Consistency is important. Inconsistency leads to bias. Bias also leads to inflated results. Case-by-case is a thing yes. However, we still have to be consistent with how we treat case by case. Hence is my entire argument. I truly believe you are misinterpreting my stance here.

Regardless of whether you like them, guidelines are needed for this. Simple and very flexible guidelines that support case-by-case needs to be made. Hence is my goal. If something is a legit multiple regardless of whether it is x4 or x1000, if there is evidence that supports it. Then I am all for it. However, I refuse to just let us be called out for double standards.
 
See, the problem with that is there aren't outliers with multipliers. In this thread Demon King is being proposed to have a multiplier of 8X The One when he has no feats for this multiplier to be an outlier to. Goku's SSJ Form which has a multiplier of 50X can't be an outlier because it is a transformation that makes him stronger so his base form's feat's don't apply to him other than him being 50X better than them. Mori Jin's acupunture can't be an outlier because it makes him 250,000 times stronger and like above, would make his previous strength limit higher.
 
Dragonmasterxyz said:
I am going by experience due to said controversy regarding multipliers in general. Not just Dragon Ball as you assume. GoHS, YYH, Dragon Ball, NNT, Digimon, are all the topics here. Matter of fact, let's go over this.
Dragon Ball was brought up with other verses. We had a conversation to get confirmation on the whole Frieza stuff with percents and powers.

Sorry, but I vehemently disagree. Consistency is important. Inconsistency leads to bias. Bias also leads to inflated results. Case-by-case is a thing yes. However, we still have to be consistent with how we treat case by case. Hence is my entire argument. I truly believe you are misinterpreting my stance here.
Click to expand...
Your own Arbitary view of "Consistent" you mean? How is it consistent to ignore a blatant multiplier that in context is perfectly fine based off a comparison to verses with completely different context, and other stuff regarding their own?
 
DragonEmperor23 said:
See, the problem with that is there aren't outliers with multipliers. In this thread Demon King is being proposed to have a multiplier of 8X The One when he has no feats for this multiplier to be an outlier to.
Click to expand...
<The One has no feats

Boi......

It's actually a 4x multiplier refering to the SD weakened state
 
Let me just make it clear that I couldn't give a damn if this gets accepted or not. I just wanted to make a point about this site's arbitrary standards and putting all of fiction in a single box based off of something that happened in a few series.

So I'm retreating back to my hibernation for now.
 
Now listen carefully Versus, because right now I am simply trying to get my point across and you are not understanding. And I am trying not to blow my lid. Because, to be blunt, this is annoying me and I am trying to stay calm and hopefully to get you to understand my point to settle this peacefully.

My view of consistency is that verses with the same logic behind their multipliers along with the same context should NOT have one verse where this is accepted and another where it is not. That is literally the crux of what I am saying. I have said multiple times, as long as NNT is NOT getting away with something that a verse with similar situations is getting rejected, it is FINE.

My first comment was, We don't do multipliers like that. So no. Because, from my understanding, With the likes of said character using said % of their power where it has had the exact same logic was not accepted. Both Dragon Ball and Hitman Reborn had this issue. I posted Digimon as a note of a legit multiplier that I denied due to the controversy regarding multipliers in the past. YYH is another example. My assumption was later proven wrong before you came. As such I considered that a thread needed to be made where more people are aware and should be able to voice there opinions.

I don't want NNT to be denied because say Cell said "I have gotten 1000x stronger than before". I would rather it got denied because a verses with the same reasoning was denied this same type of multiplier. That's what I want. Nothing more, nothing less...
 
So If I am now understanding this right it is another case of a Association Fallacy. Because the series you mentioned are somehow associated with NNT it must be the same? I think I can understand if this is for the sake of avoiding controversy. But I personally still don't buy it. Especially when NNT is not uber controversial.

I am also trying to get my point across to you, and you are not understanding my view. So are you about to blow your lid because I,don't share your view?

I have my view, you have yours. Just leave it at that. All right? I wasn't trying to agitate you, really.
 
If two verses have identical statements of multipliers but one has a 4x multiplier and the other has a 1000x multiplier, what reason do we have to accept one and not the other?

It doesn't matter if the 4x seems more "reasonable" if they both have the same amount of backing in their respective verses. Both are still unreasonably above calc'd feats.
 
No, no, no! Listen because you are understanding me wrong once again. It doesn't matter if NNT is not controversial. However, if two verses have two just as reasonable reasons for a multiplier to be accepted, but one is and one isn't, that's a double standard. NNT is not so special that it can get special treatment. If two situations are exactly the same, and one side is allowed, but the other is not despite the situations being identical. Then that is a double standard. What, we just scream "Association Fallacy" until we're blue in the face? Not, that's not how this works. We have to be fair with every verse. We have NO reason to accept one multiplier and deny the other. That is the simply fact.

No, that is not the reason I am about to blow my lid. I am about to blow my lid because you keep twisting what I am saying over and over again. Y'know what, **** it. Closing this and I will reopen it once I make my thread tomorrow. I am too tired for this shit. I could careless if you had a different view than me, different views make the world go round. What annoys me is me having to constantly repeat myself over and over again.

You wasn't trying to? You are doing a horrible job at not doing so. I can only detail my stance in only so many way in order to get it through to you that I am not trying to fit everything in fiction into one little happy gift wrapped box. But, that is not what you are understanding and it is annoying the ever loving life out of me.

It doesn't help that you came in accusing us of manipulating results and such without any evidence for your claim and as such throwing around accusations.
 
Seeing as the Multipliers thread is basically finished and NNT was basically accepted as fits as one of the accepted examples, this can indeed be applied.
 
Yes, i analyzed them and its harmless to apply. Like i said i expect them to be this strong.
 
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