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Cool it people, this ain't worth getting worked up over, which is probably rich coming from me.
use this and calm down
use this and calm down
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2-C Dragon Ball Super upgrade
- Thread starter FluffyCreatureZ
- Start date
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I meant in terms of strength, I don’t see how any of it is even good enough for AP
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So him being a candidate for a god of destruction which would put him at the same tier as belmod, him being stated to be a god of destruction which he means he Is at the level of gods, him being stated to be no different from a God of destruction, him being stated that he is using energy that only gods can use, him being stated to be a god of destruction again be the narrator, him performing a low 2-C feat casually....
He is at the level of gods and may surpass some of them
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Association Fallacy. Since Toppo is a GoD Candidate, it doesn’t mean he has every quality a GoD has. Sure, it’s possible it could be true, there’s still no solid proof that his strength is comparable to other GoDs
His energy although belonging to a GoD and characters compare his energy to a GoD, is not good enough confirmation, as this could mean they are talking about the destructive sensation of the energy. As Toppo has destroyer energy, it does not automatically mean this energy is as powerful as other GoDs.
Toppo’s GoD qualities in general also are not good enough to say, he is everything a GoD is. He may have the mentality, and characters say that he is a candidate and he has the special abilities, but these are not good solid proof of his physical strength.
I rest my case, I just don’t think the arguments presented are good enough for these reasons
His energy although belonging to a GoD and characters compare his energy to a GoD, is not good enough confirmation, as this could mean they are talking about the destructive sensation of the energy. As Toppo has destroyer energy, it does not automatically mean this energy is as powerful as other GoDs.
Toppo’s GoD qualities in general also are not good enough to say, he is everything a GoD is. He may have the mentality, and characters say that he is a candidate and he has the special abilities, but these are not good solid proof of his physical strength.
I rest my case, I just don’t think the arguments presented are good enough for these reasons
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Toppo in hakashin mode is not a candidate, he is a literal GoD, he was a candidate even before getting GoD mode, and all GoDs are automatically half 2-C, because of whis' statement, and all the other GoDs are scaled to half 2-C via this statement just because they're called GoDs, so you have to prove that toppo is somehow an exception.
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Why should I? it’s not the point of this conversation. The point was to give reasoning as to why the reasoning given for Toppo’s At least Low 2-C rating is solid enough for the rating, or why not. The exception thing, it is irrelevant, because there’s currently nothing we know of that says the standard for GoDs is to have a certain level of strength or speed or any other stats. The only standard we know of is the destructive energy
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Well, a staff member agreed with my argument about why the reasoning for At least Low 2-C Toppo isn’t solid enough
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Can we get staff here?
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You should ping a knowledgeable staff member, of the verse, here. I would, but I’ll be busy for a little while
Vietthai96
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Normal User can't ping staff, write a messeger on their wall and give them the link of CRT, and wait until they come
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It's relevant, because the GoDs are scaled to at least low 2-C precisely because of whis' statement, which toppo would scale to since he's a GoD as stated and proven, so if you claim that toppo doesn't scale to the GoDs then the other GoDs who don't have feats or statements shouldn't either even though they are scaled to that.
I am not have staff here yet because we are in the middle of discussion of whether GoD toppo should scale to the GoDs since it impacts the scaling heavily.
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Normal users can ping staff, but normal users can’t be pinged at all. I think this is how it goes
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Send Whis’ statement
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What did she say? You didn’t send it with the timeframe she said it at
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2:04, I don't how to link time stamps.
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Any solid proof that using the Destroyer Mode makes him as powerful as an actual destroyer? Because even though the form is called “Destroyer Mode”, it doesn’t mean he is as powerful as one, just what was shown is that he gains the abilities that one has, alongside him still being considered a candidate
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He was a candidate before getting GoD form, he became a full GoD after unlocking that mode (this is confirmed on dragon ball wiki and in the show orange gave scans), all destroyers are scaled to half 2-C via vados' statement and wiki scaling supports this. This is right from moscow's page who has no feats BTW (A fight between two Gods of Destruction can result in the destruction of two universes). I hope I can convince you and others.
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So your point is that toppo shouldn't scale to gods of destruction even tho he is a literal God of destruction?
And Being candidate means he is very much in the realm of gods, is strong, smart, skilled enough to be the next God of destruction for a universe with a god of destruction that's arguably stronger than beerus.
Him having every single quality of a god such is: being blatantly stated in the show to be a god, his etransformation stating that he is a god, narrator stating that he is a God, belmod stating that he thinks, acts, has the same energy and being a candidate for being a God.
You know we only need one statement that blatantly states that he is a God right? Yet the show didn't just give us one statement, it goes farther beyond to solidify that he is a god by literally mention he has everything to be a god, and he is actually a god
And Being candidate means he is very much in the realm of gods, is strong, smart, skilled enough to be the next God of destruction for a universe with a god of destruction that's arguably stronger than beerus.
Him having every single quality of a god such is: being blatantly stated in the show to be a god, his etransformation stating that he is a god, narrator stating that he is a God, belmod stating that he thinks, acts, has the same energy and being a candidate for being a God.
You know we only need one statement that blatantly states that he is a God right? Yet the show didn't just give us one statement, it goes farther beyond to solidify that he is a god by literally mention he has everything to be a god, and he is actually a god
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Also also
I'm goku's profile, his ssb was giving trouble to jiren more than he rid when he achieved ui, beerus himself stated that ui might be stronger than him. Keyword might, this could definitely mean that ui goku is at the same league as beerus, but with a hint of being stronger.
Goku ssb after UI preformed better than UI himself , so ssbkk20 qould a d could probably give him 2-C
But this could probably be wrong so I need to check it
I'm goku's profile, his ssb was giving trouble to jiren more than he rid when he achieved ui, beerus himself stated that ui might be stronger than him. Keyword might, this could definitely mean that ui goku is at the same league as beerus, but with a hint of being stronger.
Goku ssb after UI preformed better than UI himself , so ssbkk20 qould a d could probably give him 2-C
But this could probably be wrong so I need to check it
Vietthai96
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Kaioken multiplier is not accepted, and i don't remember Beerus ever stated UI Goku stronger than him, it is magazine statement which is unreliable
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Uhhhh it is accepted tho
Vietthai96
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It is only accepted when use in base form, multiplier when stack with SSB is not accepted
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It is accepted tho. It's even in SSJRyu's blog.
SSJB Goku (Post UIO2) - At least 1.96 sextillion c, likely far higher
SSJB Goku KKx20 (Post UIO2) - At least 39.2 sextillion c, likely far higher
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And why would magazine be unreliable if there is no contradiction?
And No, kaioken is accepted and so is super saiyan 1
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So what's the consensus so far?
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The staff stopped inputting a while ago, sense then, fluffy found a statment from a Daizenshuu (a guide book) that would imply stomping in Dragonball requires a 2 fold power difference, so far Vie is the only one adamantly against it, and it's seemingly just for the reasons it's a guide book- an um the wiki has used and accepted guidebook statements for Dragonball before /: so um- I don't really know where that's coming from.
With/if the guide book statement is used it's agreed Gogeta would be 2-C, Master ultra instinct and full power jiren are both also on the table in discussions for that tier, but it seems people are more iffy on that and it's less 'consensed'
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I kinda disagree with the barrier requiring ki twice as strong as your opponent. Goku and Vegeta used the barrier against the danger trio to avoid being hit by poison in base form, but they're blue level opponents. 17 used it against Piccolo but they were evenly matched, with Piccolo only losing stamina over time.
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Well, the image mentions Ki specificly, the poison is just- Poison as far as we can tell? The 17 and Piccolo issue could probably use some looking in to
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Wow, this is still going.
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Yes!Wow, this is still going.
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It could be those instances "outliers "
DivineAura44
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Doubt.
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That's poison not ki, I gave examples of this statement in the show to show it's reliable.
I think we kind of hit a dead end so first I wanna make sure what people think of scaling Toppo to the GoDs for him becoming an actual GoD and thus scaling to vados' statement like the other GoDs, if people agree then I will revise the scaling and edit it into the original post then we can call staff or something.
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