2-A Pokemon Upgrade Revival: The Time Has Come

[ProfessorKukui4Life]

Well, that time of year has come again where we repeat this song and dance of a discussion. But yes, we are reviving and doing this once again. And this thread isn't using the same points the last 2-A thread used, for as now, we have a new basis to use for the upgrade that hasn't been brought to the table yet.

Here is the blog I've made with all the compiled evidence and points for this upgrade. Please read this blog before responding here.

To give a quick summed up run down of what's changed from last time, this revision's argument here now uses a direct statement from Masuda himself, from an interview about the Gen 4 games and it's storyline, instead of Mystery Dungeon as the main basis. And Masuda's statement outright specifies that Time and Space in Pokemon are both infinite, which results in 2-A as the blog I made explains in-depth on why it's 2-A. And with that, here we go.

 

[Everything12]

I'm not convinced what you posted is evidence of 2-A Pokémon.

 

[ProfessorKukui4Life]

I'm not convinced what you posted is evidence of 2-A Pokémon.

You...kinda have to give a lot more reasons than that to disagree here.

 

[Everything12]

I don't think infinite Space and Time is evidence of Infinite Multiverses even if we do take the statement fully at face value.

 

[ProfessorKukui4Life]

I don't think infinite Space and Time is evidence of Infinite Multiverses even if we do take the statement fully at face value.

Okay and again, you need to explain why you don't think so.

I made an entire blog explaining why it does. Did you read it before responding here?

 

[Arcker123]

question, isn't the 30 or so million infinite timeline/multiverse just baseline now? does pokemon treat destroying it as a better feat?

 

[ProfessorKukui4Life]

question, isn't the 30 or so million infinite timeline/multiverse just baseline now? does pokemon treat destroying it as a better feat?

This is moreso speaking about the cosmology size, not the AP granted from it. As in, multiverses can be bigger than baseline 2-A.

AP wise, I think it would just stay baseline probably.

 

[PlozAlcachaz]

I don't think infinite Space and Time is evidence of Infinite Multiverses even if we do take the statement fully at face value.

Not gonna bother on the infinite multiverses end since the amount of multiverses doesn't really influence the AP regardless. If there is infinite space, then there is room for an infinite amount of possibilities from that, especially since we know there are Pokemon on different planets and such too. Infinite possibilities + MWI = infinite amount of universes, it's that simple. I obviously agree with those (though I have a feeling this is going to go exactly like the last thread where people arbitrarily demand translations to stall for time).

 

[Everything12]

I've read your blog and based on my own knowledge of the requirements for proving a Multiverse is 2-A I don't think it meets them based on a simple statement of Space and Time being described as infinite.

 

[ProfessorKukui4Life]

Sorry Everything, but you again, need a lot more reasons to disagree with this than simply saying "I don't think".

 

[Arcker123]

So are these possibilities timelines?

 

[ProfessorKukui4Life]

So are these possibilities timelines?

Yes

 

[Sadistic_Sleuth]

Ah ***** here we go again. Looks good to me.

 

[theultimate5105]

Looks good

 

[deonment]

By the first part in the mwi exists in pokemon bit did you mean that since infinite time exists an infinite amount of possibilities exist as a consequence so infinite universes or do you mean something else

Edit Aside from Masuda's statement in section 1 of the blog, there are several reasons why the Countless statement of the previous part means actually Infinite this part was what i was asking about in case you got confused

 

[ProfessorKukui4Life]

By the first part in the mwi exists in pokemon bit did you mean that since infinite time exists an infinite amount of possibilities exist as a consequence so infinite universes or do you mean something else

Not strictly that. With the verse having infinite time and infinite space, it would mean the multiverse in general has infinite universes.

 

[StrymULTRA]

Gonna return after a while to support this.

I obviously agree with all of this since I've took part on, also:

I've read your blog and based on my own knowledge of the requirements for proving a Multiverse is 2-A I don't think it meets them based on a simple statement of Space and Time being described as infinite.

Did you even read it? There are multiple statements, and "Space" in context is all the timelines and parallel dimensions, not just a vague one, but is backed up from context.

 

[VileShadows]

Once again, I agree with 2-A Pokémon. Let's see how this goes.

 

[Half_Shiny]

Hard agree, just want to see how people react to this

 

[deonment]

Not strictly that. With the verse having infinite time and infinite space, it would mean the multiverse in general has infinite universes.

k, but what i said could be useful if people want to say the infinite time and space statement only apply to universes and not the whole cosmology so you can still argue for 2-A

 

[ProfessorKukui4Life]

k, but what i said could be useful if people want to say the infinite time and space statement only apply to universes and not the whole cosmology so you can still argue for 2-A

I mean okay? Lets leave side discussions out of this and stick to the topic at hand please.

Whats your takeaway from my blog? Do you agree with it?

 

[deonment]

Yeah i agree

 

[Psychomaster35]

As per usual, I agree with this

 

[TheQuirkyBoy]

This all makes sense to me, I agree

 

[Hasty12345]

it's pretty blatant IMO.

I agree.

 

[Eficiente]

I too see that infinite space and infinite time is just aimed as in their size in the universe.

 

[InfiniteDay]

Neutral, leaning towards agreeing.

 

[ProfessorKukui4Life]

I too see that infinite space and infinite time is just aimed as in their size in the universe.

And this was already debunked in the blog itself. It's referring to the number of universes in the Multiverse, which brings it to infinite.

 

[Planck69]

I will say that if infinite time and space somehow only refer to a universe then there's still an infinite number of possibilities for said universe, which would be 2-A.

By the way, the blog seems solid so I agree.

 

[Ned_the_outer_god]

Neutral. But thingy, baseline is the safest bet for 2-A IMO

 

[ProfessorKukui4Life]

Neutral. But thingy, baseline is the safest bet for 2-A IMO

The "higher than baseline" part in the blog is to refer to the verse's size, not the AP value granted from it.

The AP being baseline or more can be brought up another time (though im fine with baseline).

 

[ProfessorKukui4Life]

Here's the tally so far from the people who agree. Between the people giving kudos and responding here, its:

14: (Planck69, Psychomaster35, Crimson_Shadow101, StrymULTRA, ShadowGamerOmega, Bobsican, Half_Shiny, TheQuirkyBoy, Rikimarox2, PlozAlcachaz, Sadistic_Sleuth, theultimate5105, deonment, Hasty12345)

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

I personally think 2-A seems promising. Going off of what Aeyu said; combining "There are as many alternate worlds/realities/universes as their are possibilities" with an "Infinite possibilities" statements is grounds for 2-A. And while Infinite space is indeed vague and can refer to universes just being High 3-A sized bodies of spaces with being an infinite amount of time for existence, that only further amps infinite number of wormholes with each being portals to universes. It looks about as blatant as Chrono Cross's 2-A ratings.

 

[Valiant_Abyss]

I never gave a direct comment vote on my agreement, but I suppose I will now.

I agree.

 

[ProfessorKukui4Life]

And while Infinite space is indeed vague and can refer to universes just being High 3-A sized bodies of spaces with being an infinite amount of time for existence

Just to respond to this bit, the infinite space claims in Pokemon's case referring to High 3-A sized spaces isn't quite correct since Palkia's dominion of space in the verse includes it being the creator of parallel universes (which is currently treated as a 2-B feat). That, and space in Pokemon refers to parallel universes as well due to what the Cosmologies origin story details out and what Space is also considered.

Since its spatial dominion and rule is done on multiversal scales, and space equates to space-time continuums on multiversal scales, the infinite space statements would be referring to the number of universes the multiverse has. Along with infinite time and what Dialga does.

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

I believe all the knowledgeable staff members on Pokémon should be called. Other than that, I shall remain neutral here.

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

@The_real_cal_howard @Saikou_The_Lewd_King @Starter_Pack @GyroNutz
There we go.

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

@The_real_cal_howard @Saikou_The_Lewd_King @Starter_Pack @GyroNutz
There we go.

Thank you, good sir!

 

[ProfessorKukui4Life]

To give a small heads up, I did speak with Cal for a moment when showing him this. The only response he gave was about this being High 3-A (Which my blog and my response here explains why it can't be High 3-A in the context of the verse).

 

[Planck69]

I mean, even if it was, it'd be 2-A via the MWI anyway.