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Honkai Impact 3rd - Infinite Speed Arguments (v2)

CastoriceTheFifth said:
@Vietthai96 - Agrees with Possibly Infinite Speed from Welt Vs Zephyro. Disagrees with every other feat
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I can see possibly rating from the singularity feat, because i feel like it is outlier, but i'm not someone who handwaving away feat either so possibly is a compromise

Edit: Don't ask me about scaling or i will nuke the verse 🫥 🫥 🫥 🫥
 
Vietthai96 said:
I can see possibly rating from the singularity feat, because i feel like it is outlier, but i'm not someone who handwaving away feat either so possibly is a compromise
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Oh cool. Plunging was gonna write an apology letter to Welt if it was only his feat getting accepted. (His feat wasn't even originally in the crt 😭)

Vietthai96 said:
Edit: Don't ask me about scaling or i will nuke the verse 🫥 🫥 🫥 🫥
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👀
 
PedjaTarzan said:
irontomb nuking universe
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Doesn't have a direct scaling to HI3 rn yet
PedjaTarzan said:
cyrene freezing? cosmos in myriad celestia
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Isn't proposed yet and doesn't have a direct scaling to HI3 rn yet
PedjaTarzan said:
silver wolf violently shaking universe in her animated short
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Isn't proposed yet and doesn't have a direct scaling to HI3 rn yet
PedjaTarzan said:
dunno if theres any more but thats like alr 4-5 inf speed feats so..its kinda consistent no?
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Welt Vs Zephyro but yeah thats 2 Infinite Speed feats. The singularity and Welt.
 
CastoriceTheFifth said:
Doesn't have a direct scaling to HI3 rn yet

Isn't proposed yet and doesn't have a direct scaling to HI3 rn yet

Isn't proposed yet and doesn't have a direct scaling to HI3 rn yet
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All im saying is that honkaiverse characters performing inf speed feats isnt uncommon and its pretty much consistent when emanators-nigh aeons and aeons can perform them and its also emanators at their peak nigh aeons when locking in and aeons can js do it by themselves
CastoriceTheFifth said:
Welt Vs Zephyro
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When is this yaoi dropping?
 
Vietthai96 said:
Though you need to deal with anti-feats

1. Finality Kiana blast in Part 1.5 literally take time to reach to Griseo's planet and Sa, they are at the outer edge of the solar syste

2. HoV Sirin take time to fly to the moon and get the gems and then fly back iirc in the manga

3. The bombing scene in Arc city literally have Kiana rush to the Bomb before it detonate and of course the bomb have a countdown. And later when she uses her HoV power it took time for her to fly to the space before it explode

4. Time fracture and time stop ability narratively make no sense anymore if people having infinite speed
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Gow level anti feats especially when only 1st one is justifiable cuz shes actually inf speed and the rest is just what?
HoV sirin isnt infinite speed esp with her being nuke victim
Arc city kiana isnt infinite speed and time fracture shit i mean really? dudes use timestop while having immeasurable speed indexed and this is supposed to be explicit anti feat for honkai? nah man you are tripping 💀
Anyway 1st case is kiana precisely aiming to slime Sa because hitting anything that isnt Sa being vertically sent into sea of quanta would kill everyone on that planet and rest of solar system
 
Vietthai96 said:
I can see possibly rating from the singularity feat, because i feel like it is outlier, but i'm not someone who handwaving away feat either so possibly is a compromise

Edit: Don't ask me about scaling or i will nuke the verse 🫥 🫥 🫥 🫥
Click to expand...
Its not rlly an outlier if you consider the fact kevin senti and fu hua were in a black hole’s singularity having a conversation and they somehow get out of it after the project sigma explanation

 
Scales to anything Meteoric Salvation and before do get you anti-feat, so depend on where you guys want to scales infinite speed
 
And I thought I spammed GoW threads...

The first feat is crossed out so I assume it was summarily rejected/debunked and isn't relevant anymore.

Anyways, unless the singularity feat has some statement specifying infinite speed being necessary to escape it, just resembling a black hole isn't nearly enough to qualify for that.

The Theatre of Domination feat should be fine if it was via a shockwave/expanding energy wave and if scaling characters can react to said energy waves in some form. Unless this is some form of UES scaling.

Neutral to the last section, largely because I am unsure what's being advocated there.
 
Planck69 said:
And I thought I spammed GoW threads...

The first feat is crossed out so I assume it was summarily rejected/debunked and isn't relevant anymore.

Anyways, unless the singularity feat has some statement specifying infinite speed being necessary to escape it, just resembling a black hole isn't nearly enough to qualify for that.

The Theatre of Domination feat should be fine if it was via a shockwave/expanding energy wave and if scaling characters can react to said energy waves in some form. Unless this is some form of UES scaling.

Neutral to the last section, largely because I am unsure what's being advocated there.
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So
Reiner (1,2,3,4)
Viet (3,4) under a possibly
Planck (2) (4 is a question mark for now)

What do you do when all the mods have a different opinion?
 
Planck69 said:
Anyways, unless the singularity feat has some statement specifying infinite speed being necessary to escape it, just resembling a black hole isn't nearly enough to qualify for that.
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We have scans that Project Stigma's aggregate is like a black hole and distorts space, it's fine if you don't believe that, but saying a verse:
'has to have some statement specifying infinite speed being necessary to escape it'
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is a level of specificity most verses won't go into, because most verses won't bother to get into powerscaling concepts like infinite speed. The standards don't specify anything like this and it seems a little too strict, to be honest.

Hoyo is shown to use black holes with respect to their real world physics, for example Star of Eden black holes being accepted as actual black holes. I don't see why it'd be an outlier here.
 
We do not give most verses Infinite speed for escaping black holes to begin with. In fact, this is the first time I'm even seeing this logic being used.

You seem to be under the assumption this is just a standard we have for black holes.
 
Planck69 said:
We do not give most verses Infinite speed for escaping black holes to begin with. In fact, this is the first time I'm even seeing this logic being used.

You seem to be under the assumption this is just a standard we have for black holes.
Click to expand...
In the: 'About Inescapability and Destructiveness' section of the Wiki of 'Black Hole Feats in Fiction.'

The features that make a black hole outstanding for vs-battles are its destructiveness and its inescapability. Hence those features are the most important to know about to deal with most feats involving black holes.

Let us first take a look at inescapability. Now one thing interesting about gravity in the general theory of relativity is that gravity isn't a force, but just a geometrical feature of spacetime.

A good way to explain that is the light cone model. As the article has already shown, nothing can escape a black hole once past the event horizon, because it will just travel further into the black hole no matter in which direction it goes. That is, as long as it is confined in the light cone, which only is the case for things below the speed of light. So faster than light characters would still be capable of escaping a black hole past the event horizon even though even for them it gets more and more difficult, and at the center of the black hole, in the singularity, it would require infinite speed to do so.

...

With this knowledge, most feats should be able to be appraisable. In the following, we will go through a few examples, which typically show that a black hole may not have the usual properties necessary to use it as a feat.
Click to expand...

The issue is a singularity must be mentioned for infinite speed. Most verses don't dive into what a singularity is, so they can't get infinite speed from it. Honkai DOES go into singularities though.
 
Planck69 said:
We do not give most verses Infinite speed for escaping black holes to begin with. In fact, this is the first time I'm even seeing this logic being used.

You seem to be under the assumption this is just a standard we have for black holes.
Click to expand...
It is though???

 
CastoriceTheFifth said:
Planck, it is a standard though
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That part of how real-life black holes work I am aware of. Giving Infinite speed on just referencing a black hole I am not, unless standards on this have become ludicrously more lax than the last time I saw a feat like this.
PlungingThroughTime said:
In the: 'About Inescapability and Destructiveness' section of the Wiki of 'Black Hole Feats in Fiction.'



The issue is a singularity must be mentioned for infinite speed. Most verses don't dive into what a singularity is, so they can't get infinite speed from it. Honkai DOES go into singularities though.
Click to expand...
Multiple verses do mention singularities though, that we do not grant Infinite speed for escaping by default. And in this case, do they even behave similarly enough to do so? They're called "similar" but these dreamland seem to behave more like places/dimensions than anything.
 
Planck69 said:
That part of how real-life black holes work I am aware of. Giving Infinite speed on just referencing a black hole I am not, unless standards on this have become ludicrously more lax than the last time I saw a feat like this.
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tbf wouldn't we need proof of how it works exactly opposite irl black hole to not assume it has similar mechanics to irl black hole?

Obv i am not saying they should have infinite speed cuz of this. But i think we would assume it operates under normal physics unless proven otherwise ye?
 
Hecky2222 said:
tbf wouldn't we need proof of how it works exactly opposite irl black hole to not assume it has similar mechanics to irl black hole?

Obv i am not saying they should have infinite speed cuz of this. But i think we would assume it operates under normal physics unless proven otherwise ye?
Click to expand...
No? You need to prove it works like an actual black hole to start with cause fiction has a near-infinite number of "black holes" that don't work like they should.

And this isnt even a black hole, just something similar to it that's called a singularity. So you would need to prove its mechanically similar enough for this to be Infinite speed.
 
Planck69 said:
Multiple verses do mention singularities though, that we do not grant Infinite speed for escaping by default. And in this case, do they even behave similarly enough to do so? They're called "similar" but these dreamland seem to behave more like places/dimensions than anything.
Click to expand...
They're mental spaces - they're dreamlands and the Herrscher of Sentience can use them as power. The outside the dreamlands part is just represented with a black void, with characters moving inbetween them.

Hoyo does attribute singularities with dimensionless points and the characters (scientists who are incredibly reliable) who compare the Spiritual Adam Aggregate to a Singularity say that it's 'technologically like' meaning it shares the same properties. It's not just 'like' a black hole, they specifically say it is a singularity and from a technological standpoint similar to a black hole.

All singularities are 0d points with infinite spacetime curvature, that's what they're referencing here.
 
That same quote says the fact it's not a point is why it doesn't carry dimensional information. And if they're mental spaces then that's even less in their favour of being black holes.
 
Planck69 said:
That same quote says the fact it's not a point is why it doesn't carry dimensional information.
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I'm just making a point that they respect singularities.
Planck69 said:
And if they're mental spaces then that's even less in their favour of being black holes.
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How out of curiosity? They're not physical spaces? In spinning black holes singularities can be areas too. It doesn't get over the fact that it is called a singularity, with respect for what singularities actually are. In hi3 characters are even capable of flat out tanking black holes and standing in their centres.
 
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