AlipheeseXIV
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I already said it was passive. Chaos contamination is not an activated ability, it is literally what she's made of. Chaos Contamination is Agent Zero, Agent Zero is Cradle. There is no "activating" the ability
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Tyrants of Time and Code - Dark King Fu (DBH) VS Crandle (PGR) [5-0-9]
- Thread starter Shiroiyo
- Start date
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DarK King Fu also has summoning abilities which allows him to summon TPU Mechikabura and Dogi Dogi, who both has Time Power which just erases her instantly.
She will get layered madness haxxed and Fu will summon Dogi Dogi to deal with her with 6 layers of time power, or other demon gods as well etc.. It's pretty much wraps for her.
Dogi Dogi will just erase her with History and Info type 2 EE with 6 layers on top of it.
She will get layered madness haxxed and Fu will summon Dogi Dogi to deal with her with 6 layers of time power, or other demon gods as well etc.. It's pretty much wraps for her.
Dogi Dogi will just erase her with History and Info type 2 EE with 6 layers on top of it.
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Richtofen115rdg5
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So... Cradle has AE2, which is linked to the Hetero Tower, Fu doesn't have any solution against this. However, Fu has superior haxes and abilities as well as higher layer, they are also passive. Fu can kill Cradle over and over again with those passive haxes but cannot permanently kill her. As a result, my vote is in conclusive. My vote can be changed if I find anyone's opinions or points is reasonable
Richtofen115rdg5
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Yea let's say she has Passive CM sure let's give her that, Fu has Overwhelming Aura as the Dark King and is passive, since the dark king's mere presence alone warped the entire multiverse. He has layered Madness hax, he also Corrosion inducement, deconstruction, layered corruption (which is superior than Dark Ki) etc.. He can absorb her or fused with her making a new form/entity (as per fusionism page), He both have Greater Fusionism (superior than the demon mutant one) and Absorption as well.
- Greater Fusionism & Absorption (The Dark King can fuse and absorb others to take their power and abilities,[167][167][168][169] can also merge and absorb other "objects".[170][26] This power is far superior compared to Demon-Mutant/Bio-Android Demon's one)
Dark King Fu can use infinite surprise braid space-time slashes, that summons multiple space-time attacks that attacks from all directions (which has infinite 5D potency).
- He has Causality/Fate hax
- control over past, present, future, space and time via The Dark Factor.
- Passive Power Null as well
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Fu Fra
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Fu FRA
AlipheeseXIV
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EE doesn't negate AE
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It does, you need to prove that she can come back from historical and information type 2 level with 6 layers. Otherwise that's just NLF..
Having AE doesn't mean you resist History and Info type 2 EE, unless you have resistance to it.. When is that a thing?
AlipheeseXIV
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It does not. Immortality type 9, AE, Acausality type 3, etc. These abilities have nothing to do with regeneration and are completely independent of the entity being erased from existence as their immortality is always related to an outside factor. The NLF is you saying EE would by default bypass these.
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Sure I agree, it doesn't bypass AE etc... by default (unless it does have the interaction but AE type 2 is still interactive, since this in this notion a character have a physical form but just embodies an abstraction) and in this instance, Dogi Dogi's time power can interact with her and it has this;
Existence Erasure (Passive & Active; History & Information [Type 2]; Time Power can create, sustain, and also erase Time,[67][64][68][69][70][71] with history, past, present, future, flow of time, flow of eventscausality & fate[30][16][31][32][33][34][35][36][37][38][12][39][40] all being a part of Time. Time Power can even passively erase others from existence,[51] completely remove them from history, make them vanish without a trace like they never existed, forever forgotten;[52] Stated to be capable of erasing everything,[69][124] removing all of existence[33] & even[125] entire histories[126] completely[127]. Can erase abstract beings such as Infinite Zamasu (Game) who became the very will/thoughts of justice and merged with the fabric of the universe,[93][99][100][39][93][99][100] and reduce existence itself to a state of zero.[20] Time Energy, which is the basis of Time Power, is an all-encompassing energy that creates, composes and sustains time, thus the energy itself[128] is also capable of destroying everything across time, erasing all of existence, the entire multiverse from history.[87][28][85][87][129][130][88] Time Power's erasure is one of the strongest erasure powers in the verse, as it is capable of erasing[131][132] the entire cosmology, all histories and everything they contain, including special space-times such as the Ziku World which is comprised purely from WiFi Network Data and Information; beings like Dr. Mashirito, Arale, Gatchan whom resisted narrative erasure[133] that includes data & information erasure and beings who resist Power of Destruction such as Gods of Destruction,[134] Frieza, etc. As the power that created the Time Scrolls, it can erase Time Scrolls completely along with the recorded data and information of histories contained within those scrolls. It can also erase the recorded data and information directly while leaving behind an unharmed blank scroll[9])
Time power can interact with these;
Ghosts, Spirits, Soul, Illusions, Energy, Invisibility, Intangibility (Elemental, Immaterial & Phasing), Incorporeality & Abstractions (Will, Thoughts, Ideas & Emotions; Upscales to Dragon Ball Heroes Multiverse's Ki which is also an energy-type power like Time Power, which can interact with ghosts, spirits, souls, illusions, pure energy beings, invisible and intangible ki blasts, abstract wills, thoughts, ideas, emotions,[91][92][93][94][95][96][97][98][21][93][99][100][39] As a power that creates and controls time, the entire multiverse and all histories/space-time/timelines, Time Power can affect everything including Infinite Zamasu (Game) who became the very will, thoughts of justice and merged with the fabric of the universe.[93][99][100][39] Can interact with its own attacks which can take the form of flame, lighting or simply being pure energy blast)
Data & Information (Type 2; Scales to Dragon Ball Heroes Multiverse's Ki which is also an energy-type power like Time Power, which can interact[102] with the Ziku World which is a digital space-time comprised purely from WiFi Network Data and Information. Time Power is stated to be able to control and erase all space-times, the entire multiverse which includes the Ziku World itself which is also a space-time within the multiverse. Can affect recorded data and information of history in the Time Scrolls, these Time Scrolls themselves are also just a manifestation of Time Power.)
So yeah, in this instance Fu summoning Dogi Dogi is just a win for him + 6 layers on top of that, Even without Dogi Dogi.. There's so many ways that Fu still incaps her on end. Since this is interactive;
Abstract Existence (Type 1: Energy, Emotions, Thoughts, Information [Type 2])
Fu himself has Enhanced Causality (superior than Dark Demon god power, which is also superior to Dark ki)/Fate hax
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AlipheeseXIV
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Type 1 CM can kill Fu, otherwise it's mostly incon
Richtofen115rdg5
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She does but not overwhelming like Fu
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If both have a passive Aura that'll immediatly kill the other beyond the level they can regenerate, shouldn't this be incon? I can't see how you can agree with that and still say Fu wins
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Layer is no longer the end-all be-all for Haxes.
They specifically removed dimensionality and separated range and hax potency just so people would instead argue whether hax potency would trump over the layers when it comes to versus matchup.
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It is not always
Hax potency can still win against it on certain occasions or depending on how the layers are shown in terms of its level of effect.
Killerdrone123
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Can you tell me where it was mentioned? Also what do you mean by hax potency here? preety sure agnaa comment made it very clear things like mind haxs can't have dimensional potency and one should look at layers when comes to it
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Dark King Fu has Overwhelming and Catastrophe inducing aura that literally warps the whole multiverse itself + he has dimensional domain which will disables all of her actions and movement by reducing her stamina to 1, she will not able to regenerate her stamina back yet since it's a stun lock as well, making someone unable to use their abilities/powers during the stun, which would allow Fu to passively crush her over and over with his Aura, or Summon Dogi Dogi, inevitably erasing her on a layered history and information type 2 (6 layers) level (which she doesn't resist) Via Time power, as He can interact with her AE just fine.. Or Fu himself just layered madness hax, corrosion inducement, deconstruction etc. Her instantly (He possess the Dark factor, Demon god power, Dark Ki, Negative energy which can passively corrode the world, lay waste in the multiverse, histories etc..) Themselves, . And his corruption can even corrupt the time scrolls, which are data and information type 2 and even corrupt histories and events, space-times etc..
As an Supergenius amalgamation of many characters in heroes having the data & cells of CC Goku, CC Vegeta, Xeno Goku etc.. He has killing intent + if he senses she will kill her, he's going to crush her immediately.
I'm pretty sure many people says the esoteric and metaphysical aspects of abilities as just range afaik. Tho When did they said this?
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I'd prefer it since it actually encourages debate and the current level of hax and not just saying random numbers like 5D or 3 layers.
Either way, I have no idea for both, but Fu having Aura and EE that seems to work on an infinite number of timelines makes it quite potent.
Hetero Tower also has something similar. But there wasn't a proper comparison when it comes to actual people fighting, so the Layers fu had may work
, then comes Hetero tower actually working on a higher dimensional degree. We have seen it work against certain characters like Selene and Luna, and even granting a similar level of strength. Selene is someone who is low 1-C for being able to create the Gate.
In that sense, the effect does work against 5D beings. Unfortunately, I believe it is not on the level of Observers where in they are completely insignificant regarding what they can do, so F,u having shown also being above Goku and Vegeta in potency might actually take this.
Now the final argument is the chaos contamination which are passives that unfortunately Fu does not resist cause he doesn't have resistance to CM type 1
which could inadvertently push this into incon. unless they have argument against this CM type 1 chaos contamination. specially in Hetero Tower and its core that passively applies it effect all the time which was one of the main plotpoint upon its release
Either way, I have no idea for both, but Fu having Aura and EE that seems to work on an infinite number of timelines makes it quite potent.
Hetero Tower also has something similar. But there wasn't a proper comparison when it comes to actual people fighting, so the Layers fu had may work
, then comes Hetero tower actually working on a higher dimensional degree. We have seen it work against certain characters like Selene and Luna, and even granting a similar level of strength. Selene is someone who is low 1-C for being able to create the Gate.
In that sense, the effect does work against 5D beings. Unfortunately, I believe it is not on the level of Observers where in they are completely insignificant regarding what they can do, so F,u having shown also being above Goku and Vegeta in potency might actually take this.
Now the final argument is the chaos contamination which are passives that unfortunately Fu does not resist cause he doesn't have resistance to CM type 1
which could inadvertently push this into incon. unless they have argument against this CM type 1 chaos contamination. specially in Hetero Tower and its core that passively applies it effect all the time which was one of the main plotpoint upon its release
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Cool, but if both auras are passive, then both auras will affect the others at the same time, killing the other. So, the only relevant part is what the Aura can do to instantly kill the other.
Her stamina is turn to 1 so she cannot attack? Doesn't matter, she'd be dead due to the effects of Fu's aura… but so will Fu due to her passives.
As I said, this doesn't matter at all, because the instant the fight begins, both will kill the other with their passive abilities, so whatever they can do is completely meaningless.
You're making this sound as if his Aura isn't passive and he does indeed need to activate it… but as I know more or less how DBH works, I'll not play with that.
Anyway, as I said, you can't agree that both have passive auras that can kill the other beyond the level they can regenerate and say Fu wins. It is inherently contradictory and shows clear bias.
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It's mostly discussed in Discord. But the point of the removal of hierarchy for potency and layer and leaving them vague was to give distinction and let people argue about it based on the mechanism of resistance or the fundamentals regarding its number (like 3 layers or 6D)
Like if the difference in dimension in said verse doesn't have a notable strong gap of strength in terms of hax. then it wouldn't really mean much
but if its stated that abilities are rendered ineffective or irrelevant unless it is on such level then it would assume that anything that cannot reach such level wouldn't affect it
I can DM you the discussion since it is long.
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Anyway, this comes down to see if Cradle's AE type 2 lets her come back after she is killed by Fu's passive aura.
If it doesn't, then they both immediatly die at the beginning of the match and the fight ends as an incon. Fu's Time Power, NPI, Summoning, etc. doesn't matter if he is dead at the beginning of the match, so you can't say he wins because of those.
If it does, then both kill the other at the beginning of the match but she revives, making her the winner.
Anyway, this is either incon or a stomp.
If it doesn't, then they both immediatly die at the beginning of the match and the fight ends as an incon. Fu's Time Power, NPI, Summoning, etc. doesn't matter if he is dead at the beginning of the match, so you can't say he wins because of those.
If it does, then both kill the other at the beginning of the match but she revives, making her the winner.
Anyway, this is either incon or a stomp.
Killerdrone123
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There is a lot of things discussed on discord matter of fact is it currently accepted to be treated as such if it is then were was it accepted? Cause the only way to determined hax potency was dimensionality and layers the former was nuked so the only way which remains is layers anyway it is better to get clarification on site regarding this matters but as it stands now such haxs have no higher dimensional potency and only way to determine hax potency is layers
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Not contradictory at all, he can still Passively Crush him with his Overwhelming Aura over and over, and goes for to kill immediately by summoning Dogi Dogi, which has info type 2 and History EE with 6 layers. And completely crush or erase her with this she doesn't resist History EE judging by her profile, and his info type 2 is potent. Like i don't see how this is contradictory at all?
Anyways, his Dimensional domain is passive and just instantly disables all of her actions and movement, by reducing them to 1 passively. Unable to use any abilities/haxes.
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Its a complicated topic because in hax you can argue it logarithmic or multiplicative
but then the number wouldn't make sense in terms of higher dimensions because it is talking about infinities.
So the only recourse is the quality in regard to its mechanism or its effect and to what effect the higher layer works or how it is achieved and reasoning to why it is possible or achieved
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He can't, because at the beginning of the match he'd be dead due to her passives.
Cool, so are her abilities. Therefore, both will take effect at the same time.
To sum it up:
Battle begins
Fu's passives and Cradle's passives take effect. Both die to the others' passives
Can Cradle's AE make her come back? Then she wins
Can't it? Then it's an incon
I'm not considering Fu coming back because he can't come back from Conceptual Destruction, btw
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That's assuming Fu survives the other party's passive which is something you left out when making this argument.
and you can't argue the passive will blitz the otherpassive making it work before the other passive work for your reducing to 1 passively argument
it would have worked before it is reduced in this case
AlipheeseXIV
He/Him- 3,296
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Tell me you're a db fan without telling you're a db fan 
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No, Dark King Fu, will just inevitably crush her via infinite 5D potency.. He can summon Dogi Dogi who HAS time power (he doesn't have one) afterwards, Which can EE her, not Fu himself has that.. In this instance, she doesn't resist History EE and Info type 2, you need to prove otherwise she can come back from it. The only version of Fu who has Time power Aura is her UT youth self. Which heavily favors Fu.
You're mixing it up.. theres no notion of resistance In her profile that she can indeed resist History EE and info type 2, she will not come back from this if Dogi Dogi will EE her + Plus she is unable to use any abilities/haxes in the start of the match because of dimensional domain. Which is a passive stamina reduction to 1 and stun lock. + with he can just Layered Madness hax with Dark Factor which also has Deconstruction, etc.. (Negative energy has passive corrosion, corruption, and Dark Ki itself also has Passive Madness hax type 2) + Overwhelming Aura as well.
if she indeed has Aura that is considered Passive well.. Then it can be an incon.
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They just nuke each other.
Incon shall be my vote.
Incon shall be my vote.
Richtofen115rdg5
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I just realized... Is Chaos contamination even passive? I couldn't find any fate resistance or conceptual destruction resistance in Fu's profile (I couldn't find any in the very very many physiologies too). If Chaos contamination is passive, it can be a good wincon for Cradle
Richtofen115rdg5
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I still believe its incon.
Cause if we assume Fu passive works first it would win due to reduction instead of just him also being nuked afterwards
but if we assume it works at the same time Cradle wins.
there's literally only 2 outcomes and both could basically happen
Cause if we assume Fu passive works first it would win due to reduction instead of just him also being nuked afterwards
but if we assume it works at the same time Cradle wins.
there's literally only 2 outcomes and both could basically happen
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They claim it's passive apparently I'm not so sure about it, and he has Fate resistance on the Dark Factor via the Special Ki hax.
AlipheeseXIV
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…and I haven't said she'd survive. I did in fact say she'd die from this. But so will Fu due to her passives
Idk the standards about AE type 2 and if it can make people come back from EE that they do not have regeneration to, that's why I said that, if AE type 2 allows her to come back, then she wins. Otherwise, it is an incon
I never implied she'd resist it, bruh.
Dogi Dogi isn't there at the beginning of the match
So are her abilities. So, at the same time she's reduced to 1 stamina, Fu's gonna be dead. And she too, I already said that. Idk why you bring stamina reduction when she'll literally die from the passive aura
But so will Fu. That's the whole point
As I said, this doesn't matter. Both kill each other from their passives. I know that Fu can't come back from Conceptual Descruction, but I didn't know if she could come back due to her AE. Therefore, it is either she can (and it's a stolp for her), or she can't (and it's an incon).
As I said, you can't agree that her abilities are passives and that Fu wins, because her passives will kill Fu at the same time Fu's passives kill her.
No one is claiming she resists Fu's abilities nor anything, please, reread the conversation
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I doubt we asume someone's passives act first than others', specially at equal speed.
So, if Cradle's abilities are passives as her supporters are claiming, it'd be an incon
AlipheeseXIV
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Yes, I already stated this before to this guy but he seems to just blow past any arguments that might lead to Fu's defeat. AE =/= Regen, EE does not inherently triumph AE, same reason it doesn't triumph Acaus type 3, or immortality type 9.
Richtofen115rdg5
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Can you provide a scan, the explanation didn't mention anything relate to passive
