Yet another Goku vs Naruto matchup….

[SlendVeny]

Shockwaves trought, which is not exactly energy.

Pretty sure Naruto negates Wind Style

 

[XSOULOFCINDERX]

Pretty sure Naruto negates Wind Style

He negates all forms of energy that aren't Senjutsu and I'm swearing up and down that a Kiai is a shockwave made of Ki which is straight up energy made of physical and spiritual aspects, something Naruto is explicitly immune to.

 

[Fezzih_007]

Pretty sure Naruto negates Wind Style

Is not exactly the same thing.

 

[Fezzih_007]

I'm swearing up and down that a Kiai is a shockwave made of Ki which is straight up energy made of physical and spiritual aspects, something Naruto is explicitly immune to.

Is not.

 

[XSOULOFCINDERX]

Is not.

Prove it, show me scans about the Kiai that prove it isn't just made of Ki.

 

[Nierre]

On the wiki, "It is a technique where the user affects the air currents around him with ki to produce powerful shockwaves in order to strike the opponent."

So it's just using ur ki to push the air. So IMO yeah it's just air manipulation through Ki.

 

[XSOULOFCINDERX]

On the wiki, "It is a technique where the user affects the air currents around him with ki to produce powerful shockwaves in order to strike the opponent."

So it's just using ur ki to push the air. So IMO yeah it's just air manipulation through Ki.

So it doesn't work on Naruto, got it.

 

[SlendVeny]

On the wiki, "It is a technique where the user affects the air currents around him with ki to produce powerful shockwaves in order to strike the opponent."

So it's just using ur ki to push the air. So IMO yeah it's just air manipulation through Ki.

It's air with ki in it, that's what wind style is

 

[Nierre]

I never said otherwise

 

[Fezzih_007]

It's air with ki in it

Is not trought, they just push the air with Ki, they don't infuse the air with energy.
Pretty sure.

 

[XSOULOFCINDERX]

Is not trought, they just push the air with Ki, they don't infuse the air with energy.
Pretty sure.

On the wiki, "It is a technique where the user affects the air currents around him with ki to produce powerful shockwaves in order to strike the opponent."

So it's just using ur ki to push the air. So IMO yeah it's just air manipulation through Ki.

^

 

[Fezzih_007]

^

Yeah, Nierre and I said the same thing. Is Air Manipulation more or less.

 

[XSOULOFCINDERX]

Yeah, Nierre and I said the same thing. Is Air Manipulation more or less.

Which means it wouldn't work on Naruto since he's immune to all elements that aren't powered by Senjutsu.

 

[Fezzih_007]

Which means it wouldn't work on Naruto since he's immune to all elements that aren't powered by Senjutsu.

Wow, now i see on Hagomo profile. (lmao)

Anyway, all elements is kinda vague, does really include Air manipulation?

 

[XSOULOFCINDERX]

Wow, now i see on Hagomo profile. (lmao)

Anyway, all elements is kinda vague, does really include Air manipulation?

Yes. Obito was unharmed by Naruto's Rasenshuriken which is a Wind Elemental attack that completely annihilates and Dura Negs its target via Cellular Destruction because he has Six Paths Sage Mode like Naruto.

 

[Fezzih_007]

Yes. Obito was unharmed by Naruto's Rasenshuriken which is a Wind Elemental attack that completely annihilates and Dura Negs its target via Cellular Destruction because he has Six Paths Sage Mode like Naruto.

I don't think Rasenshuriken is the same as Kiai trought.
Like, one is infusing the attack with his chakra element, the other is using his Ki to push the air to the enemy, i don't remember if Six Path resist something as a Kiai.


Anyway, ignore everthing i said, because i don't think verse equalization can be applied here, because the energie between the two verse are differents.

 

[ZoroNotZolo]

I'm leaning towards Dattebayo Man for now.

 

[XSOULOFCINDERX]

This is just wrong. You think Naruto can just shrug off a 4-C Kamehameha when no one in his entire verse has that much output? I call NLF. By this logic, what’s stopping him from resisting a Kamehameha from MUI Goku? You‘re blatantly abusing standards and the worst part is no one seems to notice,

Unfortunately you're just wrong because Invulnerability is a Hax and Saiyan Saga Goku isn't 4-D so he isn't getting past it without hitting Naruto physically. Read the ******* profiles. Hell, it's questionable if MUI Goku could hurt him with Ki Blasts since AFAIK he isn't 4-D either.

He does not. A 4-C Kiai wave can vaporize Naruto.

Read again, you're wrong and I've explained why numerous times now.

He is not. 2.16c vs 2.11c, both of them at their best

Naruto is 2.11c without Amps and can blitz that level with his other amps. Goku has a very tiny edge on Naruto's speed with his maximum Kaioken output, not that it even matters since again Naruto has multiple forms of Precog which stack with each other, each of which individually have let him react to and tag people noticeably faster than him like the Third Raikage.

None of which change the fact that Goku can end the fight by doing almost anything, which he will because he sees no gain in trying to box wit Naruto.

Again, he needs to physically hit Naruto as his Invulnerability Hax overrides Goku's Ki attacks.

I am convinced you aren’t reading what has been argued before, especially what I said.

Same honestly, I'm convinced you have no idea what you're talking about.

 

[XSOULOFCINDERX]

I don't think Rasenshuriken is the same as Kiai trought.
Like, one is infusing the attack with his chakra element, the other is using his Ki to push the air to the enemy, i don't remember if Six Path resist something as a Kiai.


Anyway, ignore everthing i said, because i don't think verse equalization can be applied here, because the energie between the two verse are differents.

Ki and Chakra are literally the posterchild example of Verse Equalization as they are the most similar of energies between different verses that aren't just generic magic.

 

[ZoroNotZolo]

Unfortunately you're just wrong because Invulnerability is a Hax and Saiyan Saga Goku isn't 4-D so he isn't getting past it without hitting Naruto physically. Read the ***** profiles. Hell, it's questionable if MUI Goku could hurt him with Ki Blasts since AFAIK he isn't 4-D either.

MUI Goku is 3-D with 4-D AP, which would go for his ki blasts.

Your point about verse equalization and ki blasts being useless against Naruto with this version of Goku still stands.

 

[Fezzih_007]

Saiyan Saga Goku isn't 4-D

He never said he was;

Ki and Chakra are literally the posterchild example of Verse Equalization as they are the most similar of energies between different verses that aren't just generic magic.

Are they really that similar? Like, besides being the life energy of someone, i think Chakra is way more complex than Ki to be fully equalized with Ki. Like, they don't even the same origin, like one comes from aliens, and the other is a thing everyone have normally.

 

[XSOULOFCINDERX]

He never said he was;

Are they really that similar? Like, besides being the life energy of someone, i think Chakra is way more complex than Ki to be fully equlized with Ki.

They're both just Physical and Mental/Spiritual Energy formed into a combination to create Ki/Chakra.

 

[Fezzih_007]

They're both just Physical and Mental/Spiritual Energy formed into a combination to create Ki/Chakra.

Ki is not that trought. You do need them both to fully manipulate, but not really to create.
Ki is more emotion based than anything actually.

 

[Fezzih_007]

Btw, can we tone down the hostility?

 

[XSOULOFCINDERX]

Ki is not that trought. You do need them both to fully manipulate, but not really to create.
Ki is more emotion based than anything actually.

The same can be said of Chakra since it gets wildly changed by the user's emotional state, just like Ki.

Which is a textbook definition of NLF. Can you show me feats for that “invulnerability hax” resisting and shrugging off an attack far, far more powerful than anything Naruto can even imagine at this point?

It's not NLF, it's just how Invulnerability works. He's immune to energy/elemental attacks period.

In Texas, we say “bless your heart“ when someone says something so brilliant and intelligent. Bless your heart.

You know you can be reported for insulting people's intelligence in this manner, treating them like they're idiots?

Unfortunately, his amps don’t get him a higher speed rating in the wiki, it’s just “higher” than 2.11c, how much so is not known here AFAIK

Which is still higher than 2.11c which is what Naruto caps are on the wiki in this state. If you think his amps are enough to surpass 2.16c, make a CRT about it. Yeah you read it right, you need a CRT for this. Read the Goku vs SGGL thread if you don’t believe me.

See, the problem here is that the difference between 2.16c and 2.11c is extremely small to point of being almost non-existent. It's really nothing to brag about.

Goku can also fight people faster than him and MASSIVELY outskills Naruto in close range combat so I don’t see how this makes much of a difference.

Naruto doesn't need to outskill Goku, he just needs to block with any of his nine TSO which he can do extremely quickly, especially with Precog and Speed Amps.

He does not until you show me Naruto shrugging off an attack on such a magnitude with his “invulnerability“

That's just how it is dude, I don't make the rules. It explicitly states that he's immune to energy or elemental attacks that aren't Senjutsu based.

View must be great from that glass house

Same honestly.

 

[FriendOfTheTeaParty]

Yea I'm convinced. Naruto FRA

 

[Passersby]

ya'll need to take a chill pill


this is supposed to be fun you know?

altough can't say i don't understand the frustration of vs debates

 

[SlendVeny]

This is just wrong. You think Naruto can just shrug off a 4-C Kamehameha when no one in his entire verse has that much output? I call NLF. By this logic, what’s stopping him from resisting a Kamehameha from MUI Goku? You‘re blatantly abusing standards and the worst part is no one seems to notice,

It's literally a power that negates energy blasts, that isn't nlf.

 

[Passersby]

but yeah, naruto FRA

 

[ZoroNotZolo]

Which is a textbook definition of NLF. Can you show me feats for that “invulnerability hax” resisting and shrugging off an attack far, far more powerful than anything Naruto can even imagine at this point?

I already addressed that and he saw it. No need to beat a dead horse.

Goku can also fight people faster than him and MASSIVELY outskills Naruto in close range combat so I don’t see how this makes much of a difference.

Ki and power level suppression is a thing in Dragon Ball. Do you have examples of that where the opponent is genuinely not holding back? Everything I can think of, like Goku fighting Cell, was an instance where his opponent was holding back.

It's literally a power that negates energy blasts, that isn't nlf.

Dimensionality still plays a factor. I think Naruto's ability would work on this Goku, but not Goku in DBS just because the energy of his ki blasts by then is 4-D, making it infinitely superior to anything Naruto has been shown to negate.

 

[FriendOfTheTeaParty]

Invulnerability can't typically be damaged by simply having higher AP even if its orders of magnitudes larger. Only AP with a higher-D potency can bypass it with just raw power.

 

[PhantomØ4]

I thought invulnerability was revised to need another hax like concept hax, law hax, reality warping, ect... to work as true invulnerability without NLFing?

 

[Duedate8898]

@MeiouHades Hello there! Just here to give you a warning, while you might get frustrated with members of the community it is against our policy to insult one another in the manner you have done in the forum. Will ask that you tone it down a bit.

@XSOULOFCINDERX While you're not getting a formal warming, I will also advise you hold it back a bit cause you were cutting it close.

And the final thing for everyone in this thread to know is that we do not currently accept Naruto as invulnerable to ninjutsu in any capacity. Until the profile says so from a CRT, it is not true

 

[FriendOfTheTeaParty]

I thought invulnerability was revised to need another hax like concept hax, law hax, reality warping, ect... to work as true invulnerability without NLFing?

It just needs a sort of mechanic which Naruto has but it's limited.

 

[XSOULOFCINDERX]

@MeiouHades Hello there! Just here to give you a warning, while you might get frustrated with members of the community it is against our policy to insult one another in the manner you have done in the forum. Will ask that you tone it down a bit.

@XSOULOFCINDERX While you're not getting a formal warming, I will also advise you hold it back a bit cause you were cutting it close.

And the final thing for everyone in this thread to know is that we do not currently accept Naruto as invulnerable to ninjutsu in any capacity. Until the profile says so from a CRT, it is not true

It literally says he has Hagoromo's invulnerability on his Profile, which in his own profile states he's immune to all Non-Senjutsu Ninjutsu.

 

[Fezzih_007]

The same can be said of Chakra since it gets wildly changed by the user's emotional state, just like Ki.

I mean like, Ki is made of emotions, Chakra is not.
My argument is they not similar enough to be fully equalized.

 

[Fezzih_007]

It literally says he has Hagoromo's invulnerability on his Profile, which in his own profile states he's immune to all Non-Senjutsu Ninjutsu.

While i agree with you, it looks like it need to said outloud in his profile.

 

[FriendOfTheTeaParty]

I mean like, Ki is made of emotions, Chakra is not.
My argument is they not similar enough to be fully equalized.

Ki isn't literally made of emotions. Emotions just bring out more power in Ki.

 

[Maverick_Zero_X]

Naruto FRA

 

[Duedate8898]

It literally says he has Hagoromo's invulnerability on his Profile, which in his own profile states he's immune to all Non-Senjutsu Ninjutsu.

That is my apology in that case, I missed that on the profile.