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Bleach: Memories of Nobody Canon

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Yes, we're doing this again. Why? Well because we have more info about the potential canon of the movie from the recent series of Bleach novels, "Can't Fear Your Own World". I'm here to prove that the Bleach movie "Memories of Nobody" is canon to the Bleach manga.


Let us go through the standards needed to be accepted as canon and the pieces of evidence for the standard.

Does it Fit in the Timeline?
Yes, it does.

In the movie Ichigo already has Bankai so it's after the Soul Society arc and Ichigo wasn't surprised to see Rukia have her Shinigami powers back. This means that the movie has to take place after chapter 201 in the manga as that is when Ichigo first sees Rukia's powers. So where could it fit between this and the invasion on Hueco Mundo?

Well, between chapter 228 and 229 of the manga there is a 1 month timeskip as everyone undergoes training to prepare for the inevitable fight against Aizen and his Arrancar army. We never see what happens in this timeskip and nothing of what occurs is told to us, so anything could have happened in it since it can't be contradicted.

So it does fit in the timeline.

Is it Referenced in the Main Canon? The New Evidence!

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Valley of Screams in Memories of Nobody

Valley of Souls Manga
Red Box: Ichigo revealing he's been in Kyogku. Green Box: Visual of Kyogoku.

Yes, twice even.
A new area is introduced in the movie called the Kyogoku (Valley of Screams) which Ichigo travels to in the movie. The new area is filled with valleys and in the walls of the valleys are shoji (those japanese window looking walls for the uncultured).


The first time the Kyogoku is mentioned in the manga would be in Chapter 627 when Ichigo directly states he has been in the Kyogoku before, something never shown at all throughout the Bleach manga, and we know what happened to Ichigo everyday when he had his original Bankai throughout Bleach except for 1 instance: the 1 month gap during the training for the Arrancar invasion.

The same 1 month gap mentioned above.


Now for the next time it is mentioned, it actually happens to be the new evidence from "Can't Fear Your Own World".

"How do you think this dimension was created?"

"There are various speculations. It is possible that when the world was reborn into its current form, the departed souls spilled into this space. The circumstances behind the creation of this space is not important now. What is important is that this is now a fortified stronghold protected by the black cavities."

Tokinada stared at the faraway cliffs, adding,

"The House of Ryuudouji were an ancient aristocratic family who were the first ones to have ventured into the Kyogoku, after their banishment by the ancestors of the Great Noble Houses. They were stripped of their status after they were exiled into the Kyogoku. It must have been unpleasant, having to face their sentence in a completely unknown place. Regrettable."

"The Ryuudouji clan aside, what if it was you who was exiled, would you seek vengeance against the Soul Society?"


For those unfamiliar, the Ryuudouji family are the main villains of Bleach: Memories of Nobody. They are a family that were banished from Soul Society and resided in Kyogoku. Exactly as described in the novel.

There are two solid pieces of direct connection to the movie from actual canon material.

Has the Author (Kubo) Weighed in?

Kyogoku Manga
End of Chapter 627

Valley of Screams Raw
Japanese Original

He has indeed, in the official Volumes and at the end of chapters mangaka add a little image or tidbit about the chapter. Like for Naruto Kishimoto would put a panel or character that stood out from that chapter.
Kubo actually includes visuals that represent the whole chapter, stories (for several chapters straight he'll have tidbits telling one story which have become filler in the anime even) or even information.

In this image we are given a visual of the shoji along the valley walls, the same visual we see when Ichigo talks about the Kyogoku in the manga and the same visual shown in the movie.

Along this we have words directly from Kubo: "See the first movie for more info on Kyogoku."

I will also provide the Japanese original in case some are wondering if the Japanese holds up.

I would say the Japanese is about the same with the English version.


So we have direct confirmation from the creator that the movie is connected as he tells the audience that if they wish to know more about Kyogoku, they must watch the movie, meaning it is canon with canon information.


Doesn't Ichigo Lose His Memory at the End of the Movie?

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Ichigo catches a hairband resembling Senna's.

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Ichigo's eyes widening, realizing he remembers.

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Ichigo remembers Senna.

Yes and no.
Right before the end after Senna has died, Rukia explicitly states that they only lose their memories of Senna, nothing about the Kyogoku or the Ryuudouji Family. Also, after the credits, Nick Fury asks Ichigo to join the Avengers Ichigo happens to catch a red hairband, exactly like the one Senna wore and as soon as he does his eyes widened with shock, showing that he's remembering.

Immediately after, a girl happens to run up the bridge with her friends laughing which is towards Ichigo. Ichigo's face tracks the girl and a close up shows she looks exactly like Senna and her laughs sounded just like Senna's.

After she runs past Ichigo stands still and smiles in place and turns to continue walking which is the real end of the movie.

Ichigo did lose his memories but then regained them, remembering everything thus explaining why he would say he had been in Kyogoku in the manga.

Conclusion
Bleach: Memories of Nobody is canon.

1) It fits in the timeline perfectly. The 1 month gap after Ichigo saw Rukia with her powers is a perfect place and nothing is known in the gap, thus it doesn't contradict anything in the manga timeline or events.

2) In Chapter 627 of the manga Ichigo says he has been in Kyogoku, something that only happens in the movie and is first introduced in the movie.

3) The main villains of the movie are the Ryuudouji family, a family that was banished from Soul Society and resided in the Valley of Screams. This is the exact same family name and situation that is described in Bleach: "Can't Fear Your Own World".

4) Kubo himself states at the end of Chapter 627 for the readers to watch the 1st movie to learn more about Kyogoku, meaning that the movie must be canon if holds canon information to the manga.


I'd also like to point out that we currently accept the Fairy Tail movie "Dragon Cry" as canon to the manga for reasons less than "Memories of Nobody".

"Dragon Cry" fits in the Fairy Tail timeline and is referenced in one panel of the manga which was enough for us to accept it as canon. Bleach's "Memories of Nobody" carries a lot more evidence and should be accepted just as well.
 
i already did this they just gonna shut it down again plus even if it was canon only person who would get anything good would be senna so its a waste of time
 
As always unfortunately, they will probably disregard the FT film as Canon as well.
 
Going to message Matt about this since he was the one who explicitly disproved this movie being canon before.

So I want to see what he thinks as well.
 
Matthew Schroeder said:
Not even mad this is a good argument.
That was fast ovo

So what do you think Matt? Your the one who originally said MoN wasnt canon, so do you still stand by that or do you agree with IMade's new argument?
 
So does this movie being canon add something to the verse when it comes to vs discussions?
 
Jumping into this thread, this was possibly the highlight of it all for me. Matthew should get an upgrade to his precognition feats, I'll make the CRT on that later.

Hilarity aside: this is pretty indisputable evidence. The manga has explicit reference to the movie by the author. The canon novel has explicit reference to the antagonists of the movie as well as the setting itself and the foundations for the plot. The memory erasure being resisted solely by Ichigo explains why it would not be mentioned any other time since everyone else was affected but he overcame it (Memory Manipulation resistance, btw).

My only negative commentary would be the reliance on dragging another 'verse in to prove the point; I understand that hypocrisy is a good sticking point, but I've personally never enjoyed the pseudo-tu quoque of 'Yeah but [X] gets this for similar reasons why don't I?'

A super slight point and one that doesn't even detract from your point, just that I find it unecessary supporting evidence.

100% agreed, it's factual and pretty impregnable if anyone were to assail the evidence itself. No way to disagree in a rational manner.
 
Xulrev said:
My only negative commentary would be the reliance on dragging another 'verse in to prove the point; I understand that hypocrisy is a good sticking point, but I've personally never enjoyed the pseudo-tu quoque of 'Yeah but [X] gets this for similar reasons why don't I?'

A super slight point and one that doesn't even detract from your point, just that I find it unecessary supporting evidence.

100% agreed, it's factual and pretty impregnable if anyone were to assail the evidence itself. No way to disagree in a rational manner.
The thing is that we are supposed to have standards for things and people don't like it if it keeps changing or gets handwaved for a lot of verses, which is why this type of argument keeps coming up.
 
@Regis

That's fair.

My main sticking point, though is this: argue the evidence by itself. It shouldn't need the context of 'but other verses' to be valid. If your argument hinges upon that, I'll personally eviscerate it.

As I said, however, IMade's argument is absurdly sound and pretty open-and-close. Anyone reading the evidence can't really come to a disagreeing conclusion one shouldn't think, considering you have explicit reference via character, explicit reference via author, and explicit reference via canon novel.

Three sources of primary canon all point to the film being canon as IMade lays out. I'd genuinely be curious to see anyone bring their own counterargument since I'm incapable of fathoming one.
 
I thought it was already considered since leaving the chapter where it showed the scenario. But it's alright.

Kubo only further officialized his existence by bringing the Ganryu family to CFOYW, as well as the novel's events to the site itself.
 
There was a Narutoforums calc for pushing the planets based on the movie's visuals, it was only 5-B. Less than 50 yottatons iirc.

No star level here.
 
Well at least that seems to be consistent in 5-B Bleach for God-tiers, then, and super consistent curiously enough.

Weird how things turn out. Anyone have a link to that Narutoforums calc?
 
IMadeThisOn8-1-2017 said:
There was a Narutoforums calc for pushing the planets based on the movie's visuals, it was only 5-B. Less than 50 yottatons iirc.
No star level here.
found it ,it's actually large planet level but none of the scans works
 
I think that this seems pretty clear-cut. It should probably be fine to apply.
 
Sekkonds. said:
IMadeThisOn8-1-2017 said:
There was a Narutoforums calc for pushing the planets based on the movie's visuals, it was only 5-B. Less than 50 yottatons iirc.
No star level here.
found it ,it's actually large planet level but none of the scans works
The scans are probably from the Urahara's explanation. Where the Planets were sampled, beyond the size of the Valley. I've seen this one before.
 
Why not ?

Any talent can be used if it is correct. It would not be so out of the ordinary for Bleach in specific, since the God Tier's are in 5-B
 
If you bother to look into that very thread the person who made the calc to begins with is against the second feat scaling because of its specific nature involving preparation, the combined effort of all the Blanks, and Senna having to sacrifice herself and die to do it.

Meanwhile the first feat is just a result of the collective power of the Blank souls and can reasonably scale to beings such as the Soul King who regulate and influence a much larger amount of souls at all times.
 
If I remember correctly, Ganryu wanted Senna because she would have the power to make the Planets collide. (Or am I mistaken? I have not seen the movie for some time). That alone, would not it be something to consider? Even because I do not remember her needing Blanks for that.
 
Matthew Schroeder said:
If you bother to look into that very thread the person who made the calc to begins with is against the second feat scaling because of its specific nature involving preparation, the combined effort of all the Blanks, and Senna having to sacrifice herself and die to do it.
Meanwhile the first feat is just a result of the collective power of the Blank souls and can reasonably scale to beings such as the Soul King who regulate and influence a much larger amount of souls at all times.
This.
 
Sigurd Snake in The Eye said:
This should prob be remade since the images appear to be missing.
No point in discussing the calc here. It should be remade with updated scans and have it's own CRT for discussion elsewhere.
 
Well it seems every mod that has commented agrees with the movie b3ing canon. So like Ant said it should be fine to use in calcs/scaling.
 
I read the OP and it is really straightforward with it points. So, I agree with OP.
 
Movie should be accepted as canon, btw did hellverse is canom or completely non-canon?
 
@KD

Hell Verse is not canonical, after all Kubo himself said he hated the movie and the things he had elaborated were not put into the movies but the existence of hell is canonical.
 
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