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Sonic the Hedgehog CRT

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Zamasu_Chan

Zamasu_Chan

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So I wanted to attempt to downgrade Sonic to low 2-C but since this is my third attempt doing this, I've thought about it more, looked deeper into research and thought of a much better conclusion. God tier super forms should be rated "low 2-C possibly 2-B". This may sound absurd but please hear me out and read everything carefully.

Time Eater

  • I don't have to explain much really. I understand that this boss was probably just a stomp fest, but why would there be The need of two super forms? They even had to combine their strength to not only stop the final attack, but to finish off the Time Eater as well.
"The Sol Emeralds presence in Sonic's world was causing Blaze's world to merge with Sonic's, creating space-time distortions that would eventually lead to the destruction of both worlds."

  • Heh?! Excuse me? Incorrect, it's not only the Sol Emeralds presence but the presence of both emeralds in one world. At the end of the game Sonic gets a hold of the Chaos Emeralds and is able to turn off the negative effects around the Sol Emeralds which stops the destruction of both worlds completely. If it was just the Sol Emeralds, then turning off the Chaos Emeralds would do nothing and the destruction would continue.
Tails: There's a tear in the space time continuum... and it's expanding! If it continues to expand... the fabric of reality will be altered. Sonic: Is this Eggman's work? Tails: I don't know... it might Have something to do with Eggman Nega.

  • There's only a tear in one space time continuum and it's slowly expanding, and there's no evidence that the other space time was altered at all because Tails doesn't know and it's never expanded upon.
Blaze: Led by the Sol Emeralds, my world has begun to enter yours. Cream: What will happen to our two worlds? Tails: I don't know... but I don't think our worlds can co-exist like this. Eventually everything will disappear.

  • These quotes never say that the worlds are merging, when Blaze says her world would enter Sonic's, she means they'll clash and be destroyed. Creating a word by merging two in one is 2-C, what Blaze said is not merging at all. I'm not even sure if Blaze, at this point of the game, is a reliable source when she didn't even know the true power of the chaos emeralds. Tails even contradicts any form of merging because he says everything will disappear, and destroying 2 space times overtime is actually low 2-C just higher into baseline (One of the reasons Beerus is low 2-C is because him and Champa can destroy 2 universes together). So that's regular universal destruction.
Eggman: In close proximity, these emeralds call out to each other. Eggman Nega: and the power this would generate... it could destroy the world. Eggman Nega: Then we can create our own dream world. It'll be an Eggman Land beyond this dimension!

  • While the Eggheads are explaining the power of the emeralds to Blaze, they say that the emeralds can destroy the world only when they're in close proximity, implying that both emerald set are needed to destroy (not merge) both parallel worlds.
Eggman: This creature will consume all existing timelines and time itself will collapse and disappear into nothingness. Eggman: That body of light is a sign of a super dimension life form. Standard attacks won't work on him! He eats dimensions for lunch! But... There should be something that's anchoring him in this dimension. That's probably the light shells that can be seen on his body. If all of those are destroyed he could be defeated!

  • Now I'm gonna go deep into this, IMHO 2-C God tiers is cherry picking. To start things off I'll talk about Solaris. Eggman is actually right about the light shells anchoring Solaris down, however it wasn't speed or omnipresence that was anchored because absolutely nothing supports that. Solaris could have anchored AP. As soon as Solaris has awoken he doesn't hesitate to plunge the entire space time continuum into darkness. It take rather long for Solaris to destroy the space time completely though so it could be possible that the light shells nullified Solaris' true power. After all Solaris does transform into his bird like from, which is his true form, it's more than likely he became more powerful and didn't destroy the multiverse right away because he was busy fighting 3 Hedgehogs.
  • Moving on to the Maginaryworld stuff, nothing states or even implies that the Maginaryworld wouldn't affected by Solaris. Just because Illumina owns the place does not mean it negates statements or scaling. Solaris wasn't only said to destroy timelines but alternate dimensions as well. Everything was going to collapse into nothingness, meaning one big swoop. There is absolutely no reason for the Maginaryworld to be off limits for the most asinine reasons, that's cherrypicking.
  • On a side note I wanna bring up speed as well. Here's the link to Shadow's blog: https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/User_blog:ShadowWarrior1999/Game_Sonic_immeasurable_speed
So in conclusion the Elite Few should be at least 5-A | low 2-C to possibly 2-B with the full power of the chaos emeralds. Egg Salamander should be low 2-C (at that time there were no higher feats). Solaris should be low 2-C possibly 2-B while at full power. Egg Wizard should be 2-C possibility 2-B. Time Eater remains low 2-C. No more 4-A ratings, it's redundant since the reason for having that rating is thrown out the window because the emeralds have much higher ratings. So other super forms and Dark Gaia are at least 5-A possibility far higher and the ones who are currently rated 4-A should be at least 5-A. If immeasurable speed gets excepted than 5-A Sonic is MFTL+, Low 2-C Sonic is MFTL+ (possibly at least) and 2-B Sonic is immeasurable.
 
Ok, I'll bite here.

-Regarding Time Eater, that final attack combining their strength is only gameplay mechanics. Time Eater also couldn't do any damage to the Super Sonics.

-Not this again with Sonic Rush. Also, this cannot be compared with the Beerus and Champa scenario as that was based on a hypothetical outcome between them and there was also no indication that space-time would be affected, hence why their range is universal and not universal+. Being able to destroy two space-time continuums is 2-C, and Sol Emeralds are alternate versions of Chaos Emeralds which have 2-C feats.

-True, the anchoring of Solaris somehow slowing his speed by degrees of infinity is based on faulty, unsupported assumptions. What you said about the light shells nullifying Solaris's true power makes sense, the official guide book says that the second form is even stronger.

-As I said in previous threads, neutral about 2-B.

-Thanks for promoting my blog.

-Still don't agree with 5-A low ends as it makes no sense for super forms, even at their weakest to be inferior to the Final Egg Blaster.
 
I've been trying to say this over and over. I know destroying 2 space times is 2-C, I know the gab between all of tier 2 is unquantifiable but the feat from Sonic Rush isn't directly 2-C. It takes the combined forces of both the emeralds to eventually destroy the two worlds. The main reasons why this was accepted to be a 2-C feat because there's a massive misconception that the worlds were merging and that only the sol emeralds were doing it. The combined power of the emeralds were only destroying Sonic's space time and then they would destroy Blaze's next because there was no indication that Blaze's world was affected yet. If both the emeralds were baseline 2-C separately then both worlds would have been gone long ago.

Any way low 2-C to possibly 2-B is more consistent, low 2-C comes from the Time Eater, Egg Salamander, anchored Solaris and what I explained above. 2-B comes from Solaris (of course) and the Egg Wizard, which actually wasn't attacked directly. The whole boss was just having his attacks reflected back at him (which is the same reason why Classic Sonic isn't scalable to the Egg Dragoon). Having Sonic low 2-C to 2-B is a better option.
 
1) Wrong. When Super Sonic and Burning Blaze fight Egg Salamander, they're inside a rift in between the two space-time continuums. After Egg Salamander was defeated, they separated and returned back to their normal positions. So yes, Sonic's Dimension and the Sol Dimension were being merged.

2) Super Sonic reflects Egg Wizard's attacks but Burning Blaze shoots fireballs that damage it. The whole thing about Classic Sonic is that he's Modern Sonic's younger self, thus weaker.
 
After reading this, here's what I think:

@Zamasu

1. So in summary, what are you trying to explain regarding the topic mentioned about Time Eater?

2. You're right about both emeralds to be used in the process which is required in order to perform this feat.

3. Yea, you're right. We can't assume that it applies to any other space-time + Domino Effect.

4. You're right about this one as well, clashing a timeline to another is Low 2-C, especially when it happened over time. Also, I'm gonna leave this here for reference just in case:

  • Destroying 2 space-time over time or by clashing one to the other, but not to each other simultaneously = Low 2-C
  • Destroying 2 space-time through clashing together simultaneously (which the Sol Emeralds didn't do but rather clashed one to the other & not both at the same time, correct me if I'm wrong with this) = 2-C
  • Merging 2 space-time with no negative effects = 2-C
5. Yea, I can agree with that since it further supports one of your previous claims.

6. Everything is fine except that you're wrong but also right relating to Maginaryworld being affected by this.

No, Solaris has shown no evidence of being able to affect people's dreams directly (due to not having any form of Dream Manipulaton and all) but that doesn't mean he can't affect the innumerable amount of alternate dimensions since there that many amount of dreamers who create the dreams (which are sent to Maginaryworld) who exist in alternate dimensions.

Another thing, I agree with your idea that their Super forms being Low 2-C to 2-B.
 
Thank you I've been trying to explain this to Shadow about the Sonic rush feats. The two worlds were either going to merge with negative effects or clash over time, which you explained it low 2-C which would further support the Egg Salamander being Low 2-C.
 
Also this thread DEFINITELY needs more people knowledgeable about Sonic The Hedgehog because I want and need to see everyone's opinions on the situation.
 
Pulling two space-time continuums towards each other is 2-C.

If one space-time continuum was being pushed into the other, then that's Low 2-C.

The former is the case in Sonic Rush.
 
Actually, only the process of merging them is 2-C. Causing them to pull together is unquantifiable hax.

I'm probably wrong here...
 
Still isn't enough evidence for merging, pulling definitely happened in the game but it was only Blaze' world, she did say her world was entering Sonic's.
 
Zamasu Chan said:
Still isn't enough evidence for merging, pulling definitely happened in the game but it was only Blaze' world, she did say her world was entering Sonic's.
Click to expand...
No because if you see the ending, they both separated.
 
ShadowWarrior1999 said:
Pulling two space-time continuums towards each other is 2-C.
If one space-time continuum was being pushed into the other, then that's Low 2-C.

The former is the case in Sonic Rush.
Click to expand...
The 1st thing you're describing is the process whereas the 2nd thing you're describing is the result. So its safe to say that a feat like this would be "Low 2-C, likely 2-C" or just "Low 2-C" (which I would mostly prefer) alone.
 
The real cal howard said:
Actually, only the process of merging them is 2-C. Causing them to pull together is unquantifiable hax.
I'm probably wrong here...
Click to expand...
I'm quite sure that pulling the two together is a 2-C feat 2-C Base Yuga when?
 
The first scenario is directly manipulating both space-time continuums to collide (2-C).

The second scenario, you're only affecting one to make it collide with the other (Low 2-C).
 
@ShadowWarrior When you're describing it like that, the Sol Emeralds were clearly doing the 2nd scenario. Sonic's Chaos Emeralds were cancelling out the Sol Emeralds should Blaze's world clash into his world.
 
It's shown here after Egg Salamander was defeated, both universes separate from each other. This would mean Sonic's Dimension and the Sol Dimension were being pulled towards each other, not one being pulled towards the other, making it 2-C.
 
It's quite possible that hax is involved in dimensional merging. Just look at DMC. I don't want another DMC case on our hands.
 
I agree with Matthew, also Solaris should not scale to Illumina [not even possibly].
 
There really isn't anything that contradicts Solaris destroying the Maginaryworld, that's why I suggested possibly 2-B instead of straight 2-B.
 
The power of the stars was confirmed to be stronger than the Chaos and Sol Emeralds, which would make Sonic superior to his own source of power for beating it. He also needed help to beat universal+ Time Eater, and his reversal of its damage was more of an indirect consequence instead of literally restoring timelines. With Solaris, if I can't gow with those feats, I can't go with that either.
 
Cropfist said:
The power of the stars was confirmed to be stronger than the Chaos and Sol Emeralds, which would make Sonic superior to his own source of power for beating it. He also needed help to beat universal+ Time Eater, and his reversal of its damage was more of an indirect consequence instead of literally restoring timelines. With Solaris, if I can't gow with those feats, I can't go with that either.
Click to expand...
1) If feats contradict the statements, then the feats hold more water. Plus Eggman was likely expressing hubris when he talked about the POTS being superior to the Chaos and Sol Emeralds.

2) I don't think Modern Sonic needed Classic Sonic's help when Time Eater got stomped so easily and even then, that doesn't negate scaling since you need Low 2-C AP to harm a Low 2-C. Also the whole plot of Generations revolves around Sonic restoring Time Eater's destruction across the timelines.
 
"Also the whole plot of Generations revolves around Sonic restoring Time Eater's destruction across the timelines."

I...still require proof of this.
 
Low 2-C is from feats,power scaling and statements. 2-C is just power scaling and statements. There are a number of both, so low 2-C possibly 2-C is the best option because Sonic can literally be either or. At this point you're just looking towards high end scaling and ignoring other feats. You do the same thing with 5-A to 4-A scaling (which for some reason keeps getting brought up and never concluded).
 
2-C is Solaris, Egg Wizard, and Egg Salamander.

Low 2-C is just Time Eater who the two Super Sonics stomped, so they don't backscale to it.
 
Even Time Eater is 2-C,all the places in White Space are different from their original counterparts,Crisis City included.The event also resulted in Classic Sonic's timeline being seperated from Modern Sonic's.
 
It's not just the Time Eater, the feat from Sonic Rush is low 2-C, as well as Eggman's statement about the sol emeralds and Egg Salamander, and anchored Solaris. Sonic only has two 2-C feats and it's because lul he scales to characters with 2-C statements. That's where possibly comes into play, get what I'm saying?
 
"It's not just the Time Eater, the feat from Sonic Rush is low 2-C, as well as Eggman's statement about the sol emeralds and Egg Salamander, and anchored Solaris."

Ok what? Forget that the former was debunked, what is this about Solaris?
 
Exception is definitely a 2-C feat,The Jeweled Scepter+Power Of The Stars is most likely on par with Solaris since it's responsible for the existence of alternate dimensions to begin with.
 
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