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TLoZ, Speed, and Light Arrows

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The_real_cal_howard

The_real_cal_howard

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This is something Kep and I were talking about last night, and we agreed that Light Arrows should be treated as real light (or at least in some games). Because words aren't my best forte, I'm just gonna list the reasons why they should be considered real light.

  • They serve the same function as natural sunlight for puzzles.
  • They reflect off of the mirror shield.
  • Puppet Ganon's weakness is stated to be rays of light, and the weapon used to beat his weakness is the Light Arrows.
  • They're made out of minor gods who themselves are made of light. Said light is actual light, being done in by shadows and whatnot, and the whole game (Twilight Princess) revolves around light and shadow/twilight. Furthermore, in BotW the Twilight Bow/Zelda's Bow does the same thing as the Bow of Light. Speaking of which...
  • The Bow of Light is stated by WoG to fire arrows of pure light. To partner with that, the arrows fly in a perfectly straight line and have unlimited range until it hits something, just like real light. None of the other arrows do this in the game, and act like normal arrows.
I'm bringing this up because it results a speed upgrade. Yuga, Malladus, Ganondorf, and Link have all reacted to Light Arrows (fired from the Bow of Light), with Yuga-Ganon outright slapping them out of the air point blank. It would scale to all of the High 5-A characters + Zelda herself. And the arrows in OoT and likely MM aren't true light, as they're just arrows tipped with light magic.

...god I hope this doesn't backfire...
 
idk if this is relevent, but the arrows in BotW travel infinitely straight until hitting something so...
 
I agree about considering Light Arrows made of light, but I disagree on the scaling. Yuga never deflected them, he just gets hit and shrugs it off. I'm not sure about Malladus and I'm going to check. If you're talking about WW Ganon, I'm okay. When did Link dodge a Light Arrow? Unless you're talking about WW Link deflecting it with his shield, he never did.
 
Princess Zelda gave you this bow and arrow for the battle with Dark Beast Ganon. When wielded by the hero, it fires arrows of pure light strong enough to oppose the Calamity.
~ Hyrule Compendium​
Zelda's Bow / The weapon used by Zelda during the final battle with Ganondorf. Her arrows were created from the transformed Light Spirits.
~ Hyrule Historia​
I...probably should've led with quotes.
 
The arrows serve as a replacement for sunlight and reflect off of a mirror. They can be counted as real light going by our standards.
 
Highlight this you coward

I think this is reasonable, all the points brought up seem fine to me and even the low tiers are around 24% the speed of light.
 
The real cal howard said:
We have characters who can punch nonexistence in the face. Why is this hard to believe? ovo
Click to expand...
False equivalency. If light doesn't behave like light, it isn't light.
 
The arrow behaves like real light, actually.

  • Can replace sunlight; something that no other arrow in the game can do, including Fire Arrows (debunking the notion they replace it because of heat as opposed to their light properties)
  • Reflects off of a mirror (This mirror can only reflect Light Arrows, it is unable to do so to physical attacks or other arrowS)
  • Travels on a straight line (as stated on BoTW)
 
Pretty sure this was brought up before, and I'm all for Zelda upgrades, but I need to make some clarifications. One, "Pure Light" is sometimes a fancy word for Holy Magic; Fire Emblem characters aren't FTL or even Relativistic for that matter just for dodging light magic. Switches that activate with Sunlight don't specifically have to be sunlight; it could just be heat that activates it as opposed to light. Reflecting of Mirrors doesn't make it light speed; The mirror Shield reflects projectiles even if the attack isn't light. Additionally, we don't except lightspeed Spirit Gun from YYH for travelling strait of bouncing off mirrors, so I don't think this qualifies as lightspeed.

If we treat Arrows as Lightspeed for other reasons, I'm fine with it, but no one actually moves faster than the Light Arrows iirc. And dodging it could still be a Relativistic Combat speed feat, which is what they are already.
 
But it never reflects arrows, magical or not, unless they're [Zelda's] light arrows. It doesn't even reflect physical projectiles like a throwing weapon or a bomb. And if the sunlight switches were heat related, Fire Arrows would activate them. Spirit Gun isn't lightspeed because something has to fall under multiple ways to be light rather than just one. Fire Emblem is light magic as opposed to being outright called pure light and having multiple points towards it. And even then, Aureola is actual light, but it's an outlier.

It was denied before because I lacked information and BotW wasn't out. And even then, I had Matt's support

On the means of the speed itself, that's why I didn't highlight it (also because it wasn't important enough). It's gonna be much higher than .23 c though, as Ganondorf and Yuga-Ganon both avoid them at close range.
 
I don't know if the OP is really out of context or not, but:

> Additionally, we don't except lightspeed Spirit Gun from YYH for travelling strait of bouncing off mirrors, so I don't think this qualifies as lightspeed.

Incorrect. We don't consider it lightspeed because it is an outlier for the verse.
 
I'm a bit skeptical about this. Unless the arrows have shown to fire and travel at the same speed as light, I doubt it's real light.
 
then it's very dubious to say that it moves at the speed of light just because it has the word "light" in it.
 
You're saying that unless something is shown to move at 1c on screen, it can't be considered light. In that case, no attack can be lightspeed in fiction. When I said it's impossible, I didn't mean for Zelda characters. I meant for any character.
 
I'd say it's more like a Relativistic+ speed perhaps?
 
Don't be dishonest Cal. Have the attack be stated to move at the speed of light, or cross the planet multiple times instantaneously, or or be calves to move at 300,000 km/s

Perfectly possible to show Lightspeed on screen.
 
@Glass

That's not even close to the reason. I'd have disagreed vehemently otherwise. It meets our rules for dodging light (reflects off of a mirror, can replace real sunlight, travels on a perfectly straight line)

@DDM

For what reason?
 
Because no one actually moves faster or in equal speed to any lightspeed projectiles. Lightspeed Attack Speed is fine, but Combat speed seems like it should be slightly lower than that.
 
I thought you were talking about the arrow.

In any case, I can do a calc to see where it comes at.
 
Matthew Schroeder said:
Don't be dishonest Cal. Have the attack be stated to move at the speed of light, or cross the planet multiple times instantaneously, or or be calves to move at 300,000 km/s

Perfectly possible to show Lightspeed on screen.
Click to expand...
He said show that it moves at lightspeed. The first and third don't show it, while the second requires a calc.
 
@Kepe can you show me proof that the arrows fire at a straight line? Cause I don't remember seeing any light arrows shooting at a straight line.
 
Arrows always fire at a strait line iirc; that's pretty much how the game mechanics of Zelda work.
 
Also, if I remember correctly, one of the Smash Bros games outright notes it travels perfectly straight. Half canon-ish, but notable regardless.
 
@kepe you mean the game where a lot off the stages aren't that big to begin with. Which can mean the arrows lob off screen.
 
@Glass

"Princess Zelda's Final Smash. She wields a mighty bow of light with which she can attack from afar. Her arrow travels in a straight line and flies through all characters unlucky enough to be in the way." - Trophy
 
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