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Zenless Zone Zero Discussion Thread

Infinity_Dragon said:
Ok since it’s afaik finished, I’ll wait awhile for the DEB calcs to get approved and get Nicole, Nekomata and Billy done to post at around the same time after DEB

Yeah, Soldier 11 beating a mini boss mech by herself stood out to me as impressive feat since playing through that Agent story the first time.

Not completely sure were to scale mini boss Ethereal myself but maybe to Anby and Billy via that new born Dulluhan that they couldn’t beat in their first encounter, though I don’t think it should scale to non mini boss Dulluhan’s as Billy I believe noted it’s Ether activity was still increasing and it had a boss health bar next time we fight it, we could say it was becoming a Notorious Dulluhan.
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I think Naito might have posted the blog on the Calc Evaluation thead but in case they didn't, I put it for them since I doubt any would actually look at it with so many calcs made in a day if not weekly basic.

Yeah. And probably just scale to the normal Dullahan type then. Anby and Billy can take on normal Ethreals but not this newly born one, though I KINDA assume it could also be from them having to fight however long they were in there and even more with them having fallen into a Hollow after getting a rocket launched at them at the beginning of the game lol. Still, Dullahan's ARE big Ethereals. I would have probably scaled the Typhon mech more to the clearly big ones like the Goblin and Farbauti enemies. But there isn't any good intel on them besides the whole "their weapons/attacks are deadly" type. It could be in any of the main or side story gameplay but nothing's really clicking so I don't really have much else to consider what would scale a Typhon to on "large Ethreals".
 
Qliphoth_Bacikal said:
I think Naito might have posted the blog on the Calc Evaluation thead but in case they didn't, I put it for them since I doubt any would actually look at it with so many calcs made in a day if not weekly basic.

Yeah. And probably just scale to the normal Dullahan type then. Anby and Billy can take on normal Ethreals but not this newly born one, though I KINDA assume it could also be from them having to fight however long they were in there and even more with them having fallen into a Hollow after getting a rocket launched at them at the beginning of the game lol. Still, Dullahan's ARE big Ethereals. I would have probably scaled the Typhon mech more to the clearly big ones like the Goblin and Farbauti enemies. But there isn't any good intel on them besides the whole "their weapons/attacks are deadly" type. It could be in any of the main or side story gameplay but nothing's really clicking so I don't really have much else to consider what would scale a Typhon to on "large Ethreals".
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K, do inform me if it’s accepted and I’ll post DEB as soon as I can.

Yeah, Billy and Anby retreating can be more attributed to the fact their were unexpectedly dropped into a Hollow and then had to face a notably powerful Ethereal, wasting too much energy, and bullets in Billy’s case, would be dangerous given they had no way to escape the Hollow.
Still think it’s a good scaling as it did still fight and endure hits from them even prior to further growing in power, Notorious versions of Ethereals like Dulluhan (obviously), Hati and Thanatos as well as the Marionettes (Individually) and Thracian should imo scale above that specific newborn Dulluhan.

Yeah, by larger Ethereals I assumed it’s more safe to have it mean ones such regular Dulluhan, Farbauti and Goblins. Wouldn’t the idea it can face a Notorious Ethereal but until we have such scaling, probably best just to scale it above wherever we have Guardians at.
 
Will do.

Although now that I think about it, I kinda now realized we don't have another low end way of tiering the characters.

I meant more like where those like the normal Ethereals would scale to so that we have a lower end baseline for the Agents and whatnot to scale up from.

I wanna say they're like Street to maybe Wall level, but the higher up scale for normals is a bit beyond me. One thing I kinda remember is Yao's animation character teaser of when she was being rescued and one Ethereal was strong enough to stab through a metal door to shank someone and there was at least something in Chapter 3 where Ellen said she and Corin could knock down a metal door.

Other than that, that's all I could really get.
 
Sooshirohl said:
finished making a profile for grace. first time making a character profile so if there's anything i should touch up or improve feel free to lmk. if nobody else wants to claim them, i might make profiles for the rest of belobog just to knock them out
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If that's really your first time making one, that's pretty good.

I would probably just rid of the extra parenthesis surrounding the reference citation. You don't really need to do that as I don't see any other profiles or other wiki's do that.
 
Oh
Naito-desu said:
I actually didn't so thanks lol, I was putting it off until I finished the rest of the feats from characters
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Well it has to be done because again, like I said, we've had comments here questioning when a verse page or profiles or even calc's let alone that was gonna be made so lol.

I mean we don't have a whole lot lot but for a verse of its current standing, I think we got enough to really go about what we can go with and just putting them on the wikia now.

As said, I only have a week for the verse page to remain on the wiki. Granted we got drafts going now so we can get it back up even if no one here posts one but I'd rather have us post a profile or two just so I don't have to repost the verse page again.
 
Also, I kinda noticed your guys drafts are putting the gang at "At least 9-A" but I would have figured 9-A would have made sense?

Thing about ZZZ is most of the major fights are like done in group battles. Cunning Hares all were able to fight off that Dullahan in the prologue and DEB in Chapter 1, Belobog Industries all fight the Belobog Machines and then the Sacrifice that had merged with the latter. The SoC (Caesar, Lucy, Ligther) all fight Pompey together. And then you got Section 6 fighting Bringer as a group.

I don't think it matters much but it sorta made sense going about it this way as, again the fights were more of a group effort thing. The same going for the Marionettes in Chapter 3 for Victioria Housekeep.
 
Qliphoth_Bacikal said:
Also, I kinda noticed your guys drafts are putting the gang at "At least 9-A" but I would have figured 9-A would have made sense?
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9-A comes from those lesser groups of ethreals that can punch a hole into wall right? if thats the case "At least" can work for people who can easily defeat them with no issue, if the 9-A ethreal in question is more powerful or on the level of that chapter 1 boss than cunning hares fought then 9-A can work instead
Qliphoth_Bacikal said:
Thing about ZZZ is most of the major fights are like done in group battles. Cunning Hares all were able to fight off that Dullahan in the prologue and DEB in Chapter 1, Belobog Industries all fight the Belobog Machines and then the Sacrifice that had merged with the latter. The SoC (Caesar, Lucy, Ligther) all fight Pompey together. And then you got Section 6 fighting Bringer as a group.
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Thing is we cant just separate tiers since yk, you can still be massively stronger than group of people in the same tier without being tier above (I.E Someone goes 1v3 cuz hes stronger and both are tier 9, so the former wont just magically jump into tier 8 but will massively upscale from 3 tier 9 people he fought)
Tho this is very early stages of profiles and we dont even know when will the game slap some tier 8-7 feats for characters so yeah we can wait.
(just to know HSR waited 1 year to be posted on wiki so i think people can wait few more days for ZZZ profiles, but if its urgent i can post anby rn)
 
Woomica said:
9-A comes from those lesser groups of ethreals that can punch a hole into wall right? if thats the case "At least" can work for people who can easily defeat them with no issue, if the 9-A ethreal in question is more powerful or on the level of that chapter 1 boss than cunning hares fought then 9-A can work instead

Thing is we cant just separate tiers since yk, you can still be massively stronger than group of people in the same tier without being tier above (I.E Someone goes 1v3 cuz hes stronger and both are tier 9, so the former wont just magically jump into tier 8 but will massively upscale from 3 tier 9 people he fought)
Tho this is very early stages of profiles and we dont even know when will the game slap some tier 8-7 feats for characters so yeah we can wait.
(just to know HSR waited 1 year to be posted on wiki so i think people can wait few more days for ZZZ profiles, but if its urgent i can post anby rn)
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Punching a hole through a wall is 9-A? When was that xD

1 year for HSR is hella long owo.

And tbf, the whole "people asking when profiles will be made" already started to happen like a few months or so into the game's base launch. I was thinking we could have waited a few months or until the 2.X patches came around but figured that would have been too long? Then again, that could also come pretty soon depending if ZZZ ends 1.X cycle on 1.7 and that can be like as early May with how early of a tease we got of the new units for 1.6.

(Shrugs) IDK. And eh, if at least 9-A works for everyone I ain't complaining. And it is POSSIBLE for them to reach higher regardless with where the game is going at after 1.4.
 
Woomica said:
9-A comes from those lesser groups of ethreals that can punch a hole into wall right? if thats the case "At least" can work for people who can easily defeat them with no issue, if the 9-A ethreal in question is more powerful or on the level of that chapter 1 boss than cunning hares fought then 9-A can work instead
Click to expand...
Ain’t the only 9-A Ethereal calc we got rn is on the Dead End Butcher?
 
Woomica said:
The calc you sent, didnt meant it litteraly
Click to expand...
I thought you meant the one I linked of an Ethreal cutting through a door or something like in Astra's trailer.

That 9-A calc Naito did was for the Dead End Butcher, and that is by no means a normal Ethereal.
 
I hope people aren't really getting confused by I write. This is so annoying to do this (and not the first time I've had people constantly be confused by what I write. That, and everyone is inconsistently illiterate) but whatever.

As Infinity noted, the calc Naito did is for Dead End Butcher, an Ethereal that is (again) not a normal Ethereal in anyway. That's the one we know of that can bust down multiple walls (in a weaker, base state no less). And the Cunning Hares (pre-Nekomata recruit) was able to fight it off in both its base state and even in its empowered state. That's just for Chapter 1 of CH's. Before that in the prologue, the Cunning Hares fought Silver's who was turned into a Dullahan, an Ethereal that is said to be potent and even serves as a mini-boss of its own. In the prologue Anby and Billy together could only fight it off but unable to really damage it enough to defeat it. But with Nicole together, they were able to take it down and IIRC someone on here said, it was still growing stronger since it was just newly born but even so, it was a group fight and not something any of the Agents could have done just as well if they were alone.

But the main point I'm getting is while we have something for the DEB and maybe a clue of where mini-bosses like Dullahan's may scale to, we never really considered where normal enemies lie at. Like where does standard Ethreals lie on? 9-C? 9-B maybe?

That's what I meant earlier before for a lower baseline that Agents can scale up from.

Because I can BS something if we don't have any approved calc's but you know, having something of an idea to get off from would be good.
 
Qliphoth_Bacikal said:
Dullahan, an Ethereal that is said to be potent and even serves as a mini-boss of its own. In the prologue Anby and Billy together could only fight it off but unable to really damage it enough to defeat it. But with Nicole together, they were able to take it down and IIRC someone on here said, it was still growing stronger since it was just newly born but even so, it was a group fight and not something any of the Agents could have done just as well if they were alone.
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Just to be clear, Dulluhan’s are normally not mini bosses and instead are just regularly stronger than common Ethereals, being more like Goblins and Farbauti.

The Dulluhan the Cunning Hares fought was noted to be increasing in power by Billy in their first encounter and it has gained a boss health bar the next time we see it, something regular Dulluhan’s lack. We could say the only reason this Dulluhan wasn’t considered Notorious was because it was just recently born.
 
Infinity_Dragon said:
Just to be clear, Dulluhan’s are normally not mini bosses and instead are just regularly stronger than common Ethereals, being more like Goblins and Farbauti.

The Dulluhan the Cunning Hares fought was noted to be increasing in power by Billy in their first encounter and it has gained a boss health bar the next time we see it, something regular Dulluhan’s lack. We could say the only reason this Dulluhan wasn’t considered Notorious was because it was just recently born.
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Right. There is that, especially when they are normal enemies (if just ones with long health bars)

My point still stands somewhat that we didn't really consider what the normal Ethereals would be at, and the reason I bring that up is so we have a baseline to fall back on if the calc's don't get approved. Ofc that won't matter once the calcs do but I'm merely trying to play it a little safe.
 
vsbattles.fandom.com

Qliphoth Bacikal/Sandbox3

vsbattles.fandom.com vsbattles.fandom.com

In any case, this is what I got for S11. It's pretty much done, just doesn't have the 9-A calc to scale to.

Not sure who else is doing what after all of this lol.

Infinity's got the Cunning Hares (minus Anby apparently cuz Woomica's wants her). Grace is done by Sooshirohl. And of the ones who aren't saying anything, IDK what you guys are doing so that's that lol.

Not bad for a start of a set of profiles if you ask me.
 
Qliphoth_Bacikal said:
Also, I kinda noticed your guys drafts are putting the gang at "At least 9-A" but I would have figured 9-A would have made sense?
Click to expand...
i just figured "at least 9-A" was fine since i was being conservative, but if you think just flat 9-A works better i can change it later
 
Qliphoth_Bacikal said:
vsbattles.fandom.com

Qliphoth Bacikal/Sandbox3

vsbattles.fandom.com vsbattles.fandom.com

In any case, this is what I got for S11. It's pretty much done, just doesn't have the 9-A calc to scale to.

Not sure who else is doing what after all of this lol.

Infinity's got the Cunning Hares (minus Anby apparently cuz Woomica's wants her). Grace is done by Sooshirohl. And of the ones who aren't saying anything, IDK what you guys are doing so that's that lol.

Not bad for a start of a set of profiles if you ask me.
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koleda was already called but i wouldn't mind doing anton and ben to round out the rest of belobog. ellen was also already called but if nobody else wants to do them i could probably also get started on the rest of victoria housekeeping as well
 
Sooshirohl said:
i just figured "at least 9-A" was fine since i was being conservative, but if you think just flat 9-A works better i can change it later
Click to expand...
Though solid 9-A is probably safer atm, I wouldn’t have an issue Belobog being At least 9-A given they decently held their own against the Unknown Machine Complex which they I believe implied is in the same league as second phase Sacrifice-Bringer based on them I think saying “it’s just like back at the monument” when Bringer unleashed his power and caused that red lightning storm.
 
Infinity_Dragon said:
Though solid 9-A is probably safer atm, I wouldn’t have an issue Belobog being At least 9-A given they decently held their own against the Unknown Machine Complex which they I believe implied is in the same league as second phase Sacrifice-Bringer based on them I think saying “it’s just like back at the monument” when Bringer unleashed his power and caused that red lightning storm.
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At least 9-A for Belobog gang can work.

The sacrifice boss battle they had was a being that merged with their (I assume to be so) best machines in their company. Koleda blocked an attack and then got blown away right after from it iirc, then you had the rest (Grace/Anton/Ben) fight it off until she got her dad's prototype to take it down.

I just think some Agents should only be 9-A to be conservative while some can be At least 9-A if they fought the really formidable ones like Belobog vs UMC or Section 6 vs Sacrifice Bringer.

If that makes any sense. It might seem a little weird but that's the only compromise I can make. Otherwise, we'd then hit with the assumption all of them are 9-A of varying degrees and Miyabi with family sword's hidden power unlocked is higher. Same is if we think they're at least 9-A of varying degree's.
 
Qliphoth_Bacikal said:
At least 9-A for Belobog gang can work.

The sacrifice boss battle they had was a being that merged with their (I assume to be so) best machines in their company. Koleda blocked an attack and then got blown away right after from it iirc, then you had the rest (Grace/Anton/Ben) fight it off until she got her dad's prototype to take it down.

I just think some Agents should only be 9-A to be conservative while some can be At least 9-A if they fought the really formidable ones like Belobog vs UMC or Section 6 vs Sacrifice Bringer.

If that makes any sense. It might seem a little weird but that's the only compromise I can make. Otherwise, we'd then hit with the assumption all of them are 9-A of varying degrees and Miyabi with family sword's hidden power unlocked is higher. Same is if we think they're at least 9-A of varying degree's.
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ohhhhhh wait i'm dumb asf lmao, for some reason i thought "at least" was for a character's higher ends rather than their lower ends, whoopsie

i agree with your points about at least 9-A for belobog though, i think it works for the groups that at least fight against the super big bosses (cunning hares vs. DEB, belobog vs. UMC, victoria housekeeping vs. marionettes, SOC vs. pompey and S6 vs. bringer) seeing as how most of the big bosses should at the very least be relative to one another strength-wise
 
Sooshirohl said:
ohhhhhh wait i'm dumb asf lmao, for some reason i thought "at least" was for a character's higher ends rather than their lower ends, whoopsie

i agree with your points about at least 9-A for belobog though, i think it works for the groups that at least fight against the super big bosses (cunning hares vs. DEB, belobog vs. UMC, victoria housekeeping vs. marionettes, SOC vs. pompey and S6 vs. bringer) seeing as how most of the big bosses should at the very least be relative to one another strength-wise
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So the only ones that wouldn't go towards are PubSec, Obal Squad (though that'll likely change soon), and Stars of Lyra? Assuming I understand this correctly.
 
Jimmy.robinson.5099 said:
So the only ones that wouldn't go towards are PubSec, Obal Squad (though that'll likely change soon), and Stars of Lyra? Assuming I understand this correctly.
Click to expand...
yeah, which makes sense since they seem to be the weakest factions lore wise (with the exception of obol squad but like you said that'll change with 1.6)
 
Sooshirohl said:
yeah, which makes sense since they seem to be the weakest factions lore wise (with the exception of obol squad but like you said that'll change with 1.6)
Click to expand...
It’s both funny and sad that the least impressive Faction thus far I believe is still PubSec, Soldier 11 beat a Typhoon Challenger on her own while Astra and Eve beat a Terror Raptor.

Two factions with just one and two members, one of whom being a singer that’s primarily a support character, currently released have better feats than a faction of four highly skilled officers.
 
Infinity_Dragon said:
It’s both funny and sad that the least impressive Faction thus far I believe is still PubSec, Soldier 11 beat a Typhoon Challenger on her own while Astra and Eve beat a Terror Raptor.

Two factions with just one and two members, one of whom being a singer that’s primarily a support character, currently released have better feats than a faction of four highly skilled officers.
Click to expand...
no matter what the media the fact remains, police officers are always fodder
 
Infinity_Dragon said:
It’s both funny and sad that the least impressive Faction thus far I believe is still PubSec, Soldier 11 beat a Typhoon Challenger on her own while Astra and Eve beat a Terror Raptor.

Two factions with just one and two members, one of whom being a singer that’s primarily a support character, currently released have better feats than a faction of four highly skilled officers.
Click to expand...
Funny and sad indeed lol.

Tbf, it makes perfect sense to probably scale Obol Squad up in the future because they're part of N.E's (New Eridu) militant force. This and with Trigger being part of the next patch and Anby getting a new unit, we'll have Obol Squad finally get proper exposure and show us why they're of the Elite forces owo.

Eve is one thing as she's a spy whose very combat-abled so it's no surprise she's not a slouch for also posing (then later fr) being the bodyguard of a well-known star. But Astra certainly is surprising with the way she can also handle fighting Ethereals on her own.

Public Security is certainly the lowest of the low at this point lol. We know Zhu Yuan can take out the bigger normal Ethereals here, Seth and Jane fought a particularly powerful thug (Razor) in RnB ep, and Qingyi's likely just as capable to do either of these things. But that aside, they're not as impressive as everyone else is lol.
 
Billy, Nicole and Nekomata I believe are about done

Unless I’m missing something, I’ma move onto Ellen and Koleda until DEB and the CH can be posted. Probably also start doing a sandbox for notable Ethereals (Like Dulluhan, Hati and Thanatos), we’d need to discuss where the weaker versions should be place but I believe the Notorious ones should scale to that strong Newborn Dulluhan that troubled Anby and Billy.
 
Infinity_Dragon said:
Billy, Nicole and Nekomata I believe are about done

Unless I’m missing something, I’ma move onto Ellen and Koleda until DEB and the CH can be posted. Probably also start doing a sandbox for notable Ethereals (Like Dulluhan, Hati and Thanatos), we’d need to discuss where the weaker versions should be place but I believe the Notorious ones should scale to that strong Newborn Dulluhan that troubled Anby and Billy.
Click to expand...
nice, been busy with school this past week so i haven't gotten a chance to work on ben or anton's profiles yet but i'll try getting to them now that i have a bit of free time. profiles look good to me, i didn't even think of including stuff like the W-engines and damage increase/reduction
 
finished up pages for both anton and ben. i don't think i missed anything crucial about them but if i did feel free to let me know. might go back at some point and add stuff from their mindscapes and W-engines since i think infinity had the right idea about adding those into the pages
 
So just checking but Jane Doe's Passion accumulates with every dodge, assist, and attack. Is this Empowerment or Stat Amp?
 
Shark (Ellen) - Eats their sibling in the womb
Sukuna - Eats his sibling in the womb

Coincidence??
 
I just finished Ellen's Agent Story finally. It's pretty nice for the game to show a little of Ellen's life as a student that's also struggling to juggle her other life as a Hollow Agent/Raider/Maid of Victorian Housekeeping.

That said, there's not a whole lot of feats that seem to stick out to me. Just Ellen being one of our known Agents capable of taking down Ethereals even on her own. There was one instance of a black screen, white text part (HSR much owo) that said about an Ethereal that knocked down a door while chasing after Ellen's friends. IDK which Ethereal it was since you fight an armored Hati and then a Farbauti right after it.

Whichever the case is, knocking down or even destroying a door does yield around wall level so we have a lower end scale feat that the Agents can upscale on as Ellen alone was able to defeat the Hollow that did it (again, dk which one did it)

[/Spoiler
 
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