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Yu-Gi-Oh! DM (Canonicity Issues + Changes) II
- Thread starter Arigarmy
- Start date
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And yet everything about it was kinda countered. Stuff I already countered way before multiple times and is somehow being repeatedly brought up again.
Won't say my word is absolute, but with not even one counter to my rebuttals, you kinda can't claim nothing was debunked when not even trying to counter back counter-arguments.
Won't say my word is absolute, but with not even one counter to my rebuttals, you kinda can't claim nothing was debunked when not even trying to counter back counter-arguments.
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To be honest, im just amused people are actually trying to debunk scans and direct quotes from the movie.
Ive spend last night watching the movie, and now they dare to say to me and the creators of the film that your opinion is more valid than theirs.
I mean, if you post a single quote from the movie that says "If the pharaoh comes back, we will not only lose our powers, but will reverse all of prana" ill admit defeat.
Game on
Ive spend last night watching the movie, and now they dare to say to me and the creators of the film that your opinion is more valid than theirs.
I mean, if you post a single quote from the movie that says "If the pharaoh comes back, we will not only lose our powers, but will reverse all of prana" ill admit defeat.
Game on
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Pulling the desperate "creators word" card won't make you any less wrong.
Don't assume just by posting scans your argument is untouchable. It isnt and thats not how this works.
Don't assume just by posting scans your argument is untouchable. It isnt and thats not how this works.
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I guess you can interpret anythimg the writer does as you want to. Or make up stuff up like the pharaoh not reverseing the damage when the scans show that the effects were reversed forst and then the kids lost their power.
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Except that isn't true and I already noted this in my debunk reply.
Which again, no one countered. So until someone does, you have no room to say your arguments are untouchable.
Which again, no one countered. So until someone does, you have no room to say your arguments are untouchable.
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It does matter if they weren't debunked at all. 99 times? Try 0Cloud9022 said:
Not one reply here or on the blog counters my counter-argument. The most the yugioh side seem to be doing is ignoring any counter-argument set against them and pretend they were never even brought up at all.
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Your debunk thingy on my blog has already been debunked.
And im waitifg for you to post the scan i requested.
And im waitifg for you to post the scan i requested.
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@Megaboy "Now that i realize, no one but you two agree with each other."
See the thread again. It's me, Ari, Prof, Dark649, Kristis (who also debunked the blog), and somewhat 2nd (I don't know overall where he is, but he seemed to be agreeing with me in this particular discussion)
@Cloud he says that because he wasn't debunked tho, check the thread. Every rebuttal was refuted.
See the thread again. It's me, Ari, Prof, Dark649, Kristis (who also debunked the blog), and somewhat 2nd (I don't know overall where he is, but he seemed to be agreeing with me in this particular discussion)
@Cloud he says that because he wasn't debunked tho, check the thread. Every rebuttal was refuted.
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Its exactly as SD has once again explained, simple as that.
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Bump
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I mean, Marco(rip), megaboy and Cloud agree with me, and most of what you have written in my blog has already been debunked, its just a matter of time until you realize that.
You cannot say that the scans say something they dont.
Like i said, gimme a scan or at leat a quote that somehow says that the return of the pharaoh reverses Prana and how that does not scale to his AP.
If you cannot do that, youve lost...again.
You cannot say that the scans say something they dont.
Like i said, gimme a scan or at leat a quote that somehow says that the return of the pharaoh reverses Prana and how that does not scale to his AP.
If you cannot do that, youve lost...again.
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You need to check back on your blog, everyone has already debunked your posts, we're literally waiting for you guys to respond there (Though like Ant said, it should have been here on the first place).
I'm not sure you even checked your blog actually. I posted scans there a day ago...
I'm not sure you even checked your blog actually. I posted scans there a day ago...
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Ant told me we should bring everything on the threads, but fine. Ill debunk your thing in a minute.
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No offense, but that's what you said like 5 times already and not one counter argument has been posted by you, cloud OR Mega.
At least toward my stuff and not just smaller minority comments.
At least toward my stuff and not just smaller minority comments.
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jz6kWcm3lmE 10:00
You messed up bad.
If anything, posting this shows that destroying prana or the dimensions made by prana =/= Reversing Prana, since the Henchmen sent to the alternate dimension by Diva did NOT return.
And you have forgotten the very important fact that this was base Diva, not Corrupted Diva with the power of two millenium items, that the range of the dimension he made against Kaiba is at the very least City Level (Based on his duel with Yugi, which was shown to be of this scale) and that it would scale to obelisk´s Ap directly.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U8MSR59xjT0
1:36:50
This is eve worse for you.
You claimed before that it was Joey´s memory of the pahraoh and not Atem actually being there what got him out of the dimension Diva sent him to. If anything, this would put the power of friendship on another tier. like Saint Seiya miracles.
And since Atem wasnt there, Joey has the ability to remember stuff once the dimension stops destroying them.
This is also based on actual science, you do know your brain makes up new memories on seconds just to justify your existence in a certain point and at a certain time? It might not be the most accurate explanation, but this would just be an upgrade for power of friendship miracles or Joey directly.
How does this "debunk" anything again?
You messed up bad.
If anything, posting this shows that destroying prana or the dimensions made by prana =/= Reversing Prana, since the Henchmen sent to the alternate dimension by Diva did NOT return.
And you have forgotten the very important fact that this was base Diva, not Corrupted Diva with the power of two millenium items, that the range of the dimension he made against Kaiba is at the very least City Level (Based on his duel with Yugi, which was shown to be of this scale) and that it would scale to obelisk´s Ap directly.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U8MSR59xjT0
1:36:50
This is eve worse for you.
You claimed before that it was Joey´s memory of the pahraoh and not Atem actually being there what got him out of the dimension Diva sent him to. If anything, this would put the power of friendship on another tier. like Saint Seiya miracles.
And since Atem wasnt there, Joey has the ability to remember stuff once the dimension stops destroying them.
This is also based on actual science, you do know your brain makes up new memories on seconds just to justify your existence in a certain point and at a certain time? It might not be the most accurate explanation, but this would just be an upgrade for power of friendship miracles or Joey directly.
How does this "debunk" anything again?
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Posted it here just in case youd miss it, Data.
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1.-They are not shown returning. Can you post a since frame of animation when they come back? Becuase, if you cannot prove they returned, it means that destroying prana or its dimension does not reverse its effects.
2.-You are confusing both Obelisks.
He is only 5-B in the anime. This goes for Manga Yugioh.
2.-You are confusing both Obelisks.
He is only 5-B in the anime. This goes for Manga Yugioh.
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1. No it means we don't know. You are literally inserting your headcanon for an unanswered question.
2. Oh nvm then. Wait how does that scale to Obelisk? I don't remember it being stated both dimensions were of the same size.
2. Oh nvm then. Wait how does that scale to Obelisk? I don't remember it being stated both dimensions were of the same size.
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1.-Its not headcannon. In fact, the burden of poroof in on you. I have scans of them dissapearing and you are the one saying they come back.
So, its your turn to prove that they come back.
2.-I proved earlier on the thread that dimensions are not limited by the size of the room, or else the dimenison he creates against Yugi would be just stadium level.
Anime Obelisk is 5-A, and Manga obelisk is like city level or something for now.
So, its your turn to prove that they come back.
2.-I proved earlier on the thread that dimensions are not limited by the size of the room, or else the dimenison he creates against Yugi would be just stadium level.
Anime Obelisk is 5-A, and Manga obelisk is like city level or something for now.
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Proof that they dissapeared.
Now post a timestamp on the moment they come back.
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Will end this quickly.
1.) Kaiba's henchmen not returning has nothing to do with the Plana being/ not being reversable. This point has way too much assumption put into it. All Diva did to them was literally BFR them to a random dimension, thats it. What is this point even trying to convey? Be more clear please.
2.) Range I could care less about. First of all, as I already confirmed, The Plana gives users the ability to BFR victims across entire dimensions. Thats easily Multi-Universal range, so bringing up City Level range on this point is incredibly uncessary when you already have a range infinitely better from the start. Secondly, Obelisk destroying this pocket dimension wouldnt make him any higher than he actually is even if taking it at face value.
3.) Do you even hear yourself? First, It's nothing like Saint Seiya Miracles, which is an actual ability. Power of Friendship nonsense is a common PIS trope in fiction which means absolutely nothing. Joey gets nothing from surviving, except a nice helping of PIS for breakfast. Secondly, your blatently ignoring that Joey remembered Atem before Diva destroyed the dimension he was in, so having a memory left, especially one "as strong" as his toward Atem, is entirely logical. Third, putting science into this isn't going to help you here when we're talking about fiction, and I shouldnt have to explain any further than this. Finally, there's no excuse or refrute you can make for this. The instant Atem returns, the Plana vanishes. Simple through and through. Atem appearing here, if actually him, would have destroyed the Plana right there but it didnt. Why? Because its only a memory and Joey even brags about this moments later because, again, power of friendship. There's literally no looking the other way at this point here.
1.) Kaiba's henchmen not returning has nothing to do with the Plana being/ not being reversable. This point has way too much assumption put into it. All Diva did to them was literally BFR them to a random dimension, thats it. What is this point even trying to convey? Be more clear please.
2.) Range I could care less about. First of all, as I already confirmed, The Plana gives users the ability to BFR victims across entire dimensions. Thats easily Multi-Universal range, so bringing up City Level range on this point is incredibly uncessary when you already have a range infinitely better from the start. Secondly, Obelisk destroying this pocket dimension wouldnt make him any higher than he actually is even if taking it at face value.
3.) Do you even hear yourself? First, It's nothing like Saint Seiya Miracles, which is an actual ability. Power of Friendship nonsense is a common PIS trope in fiction which means absolutely nothing. Joey gets nothing from surviving, except a nice helping of PIS for breakfast. Secondly, your blatently ignoring that Joey remembered Atem before Diva destroyed the dimension he was in, so having a memory left, especially one "as strong" as his toward Atem, is entirely logical. Third, putting science into this isn't going to help you here when we're talking about fiction, and I shouldnt have to explain any further than this. Finally, there's no excuse or refrute you can make for this. The instant Atem returns, the Plana vanishes. Simple through and through. Atem appearing here, if actually him, would have destroyed the Plana right there but it didnt. Why? Because its only a memory and Joey even brags about this moments later because, again, power of friendship. There's literally no looking the other way at this point here.
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"Will end this quickly" And people say IM cocky and arrogant.
1.-It means that destoying prana or its dimension does not reverse the damage done. As long we are okay with that, it leads to the pharaoh not reversing the damage at the finale due to the prophecy or destroying Prana. If destroying prama reversed effects, the henchmen would have come back.
2.-I just stated that fact because any size would be directly scaled to Obelisk´s AP. If you want Multi-Universal Obelisk, be my guest.
3.-Yes i can and yes, i will refute that WITH EVIDENCE.
When Atem returns, the damage done by Prana is reversed AND THEN the kids lose thir powers, as stated on my blog, which clearly contradicts your " The instant Atem returns, the Plana vanishes." statement. Youve been debunked.
Check the time stamps.
1.-It means that destoying prana or its dimension does not reverse the damage done. As long we are okay with that, it leads to the pharaoh not reversing the damage at the finale due to the prophecy or destroying Prana. If destroying prama reversed effects, the henchmen would have come back.
2.-I just stated that fact because any size would be directly scaled to Obelisk´s AP. If you want Multi-Universal Obelisk, be my guest.
3.-Yes i can and yes, i will refute that WITH EVIDENCE.
When Atem returns, the damage done by Prana is reversed AND THEN the kids lose thir powers, as stated on my blog, which clearly contradicts your " The instant Atem returns, the Plana vanishes." statement. Youve been debunked.
Check the time stamps.
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Geez, i know its hard to admit you are wrong. But just let the upgrades happen already.
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1.) Yeah that means literally nothing here on this point. The henchmen were never destroyed. They were BFRed to another dimension. Long before the Plana disappeared in the end and you can't reverse an already done BFR.
2.) NLF. My point here was that the Plana has Multi-Universal range, not Obelisk. You need to prove Obelisk can destroy dimensions of this size or its blatent NLF.
3.) Not addressing this point again as its a literal repeat of the blog and already debunked it with multiple points.
A single person agreeing is no where remotely close to getting these upgrades through. And at the rate its going, no offense, its never going to be. And once again, drop the attitude. Its been noted out multiple times alreadt by staff and it wont help your case in the slightest.
2.) NLF. My point here was that the Plana has Multi-Universal range, not Obelisk. You need to prove Obelisk can destroy dimensions of this size or its blatent NLF.
3.) Not addressing this point again as its a literal repeat of the blog and already debunked it with multiple points.
A single person agreeing is no where remotely close to getting these upgrades through. And at the rate its going, no offense, its never going to be. And once again, drop the attitude. Its been noted out multiple times alreadt by staff and it wont help your case in the slightest.
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1.-Being BFRed to anything dimension is one of Prana´s powers. And Diva can return people back at will as shown by returning Bakura after he realized that he had nothing but hatred in his heart after dueling Yugi.
Data argues that they did return, so...where are they?
2.-Well, i think its obvious he can destroy Diva´s dimensions. by just being summoned by Kaiba.
Again, as shown earlier on this thread, we see Obelisk punching the dimension away and tearing it apart by being summoned.
3.-You have not debunked anything, in fact, i just debunked you in this very conversation last reply with the order of events.
And, again, you are wrong.
Marco agreed, Megaboy prime and Cloud agree.
And you should just drop your attitude as well, buddy.
"Will end this quickly" is not only arrogant, but also cocky and i have proof you said that two posts above.
Data argues that they did return, so...where are they?
2.-Well, i think its obvious he can destroy Diva´s dimensions. by just being summoned by Kaiba.
Again, as shown earlier on this thread, we see Obelisk punching the dimension away and tearing it apart by being summoned.
3.-You have not debunked anything, in fact, i just debunked you in this very conversation last reply with the order of events.
And, again, you are wrong.
Marco agreed, Megaboy prime and Cloud agree.
And you should just drop your attitude as well, buddy.
"Will end this quickly" is not only arrogant, but also cocky and i have proof you said that two posts above.
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1.) Then its a good thing Diva never once brought Bakura back actively on his own and there's 0 proof that he did. Bakura came back from his dimension because Yugi defeated Diva, who was unwilling, to do so. Diva didn't see the error of his ways and given he absolutely HATED Bakura, the chances of him suddenly doing a 180┬░ and helping Yugi are very slim to none. And what Data argues for himself doesnt mean I argue the same as it doesnt matter to me either way.
2.) First, Obelisk wasnt literally punching the reality itself, if nothing else he destroyed it when destroying one of Divas monsters. Evej then, for arguments sake we can say he did. Its still NLF to say Obelisk could destroy any size of a dimension just by destroying Divas. You need evidence that he can do further stuff.
3.) Using a circular argument that I ALREADY debunked from your blog days ago doesnt mean anything at all. You debunked nothing and just repeated what you said before, ignoring it.
Okay and that still wont be enough. 3 people vs a majority who disagree (including Staff by the way) will not do much.
And i dont need to drop anything because I dont have an attitude here. You do, as noted out multiple times by multiple people, including Staff. The "will end this quickly" is not remotely about being cocky and arogant. Its to quickly end an argument, mostly circular, that has been countered multiple times already and has failed to come back with a real rebuttal.
2.) First, Obelisk wasnt literally punching the reality itself, if nothing else he destroyed it when destroying one of Divas monsters. Evej then, for arguments sake we can say he did. Its still NLF to say Obelisk could destroy any size of a dimension just by destroying Divas. You need evidence that he can do further stuff.
3.) Using a circular argument that I ALREADY debunked from your blog days ago doesnt mean anything at all. You debunked nothing and just repeated what you said before, ignoring it.
Okay and that still wont be enough. 3 people vs a majority who disagree (including Staff by the way) will not do much.
And i dont need to drop anything because I dont have an attitude here. You do, as noted out multiple times by multiple people, including Staff. The "will end this quickly" is not remotely about being cocky and arogant. Its to quickly end an argument, mostly circular, that has been countered multiple times already and has failed to come back with a real rebuttal.
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Never argued the bullies returned at all. I said there are never mentioned to return or stay dead after everything went back to normal. Again, this is another strawman.
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@My bad SD, didn't know.
In that case, yeah I think we're on the same page. Heck, why is it even being assumed they died at all? They never died. They were literally just BFR'd to another random dimension, that's it.
BFR'd =/= died.
In that case, yeah I think we're on the same page. Heck, why is it even being assumed they died at all? They never died. They were literally just BFR'd to another random dimension, that's it.
BFR'd =/= died.
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What are you ttwo alking about.
When they forget everything, they are erased.
Aka dead.
When they forget everything, they are erased.
Aka dead.
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@Mega the specifics, don't worry about it.
Yeah, although that doesn't really pertain to the discussion. Did you find any info about the bullies after the Prana left? Its what we're waiting for given its basically the last string of evidence that hasn't been confirmed to be debunked or true.
Yeah, although that doesn't really pertain to the discussion. Did you find any info about the bullies after the Prana left? Its what we're waiting for given its basically the last string of evidence that hasn't been confirmed to be debunked or true.
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@Data What are you talking about? Ice debunked every single one of your aeguments. 3-A prana is backed by far more evidence than your headcanon ramblings.
And the burden od proof is on YOU pal,you said destroying Prana reverses its effects and thus the henchmen or the bullies would have come back. YOU are the one who has to prove this claim or just stop with this and accept that the evidence i posted is conclusive.
@Kukui. 1.-Yes he did, thats why he was apologizing to Shadii as he was bro7ght into Prana dimension and thats why the millenium ring possesed him. Ive already proven this in my blog, so i shall not waste more time. Not to mention this is backed up by the fact the henchmen and the bullies did not return after a dimension duel was over or after the pharaph comes back.
2.-ive already posted evidence of obelisk tearing apart Diva's dimension in this very thread and in my blog. That is enough evidence to say Obelisk did affect a Multi universe dimension.
How about you try to disprove Obelisl punched Diva's monster and the dimension went away? Im joking of course, because thats impossible. Youve lost.
3.- Again, you have not debunked anything, ve already debunked your rebuttal in my blog and in this very thread.
And this is not a voting scenario. You are wrong, no matter how many socks you use.
You are the one who said "Will finish this quickly". Apologize and ill do the same.
And the burden od proof is on YOU pal,you said destroying Prana reverses its effects and thus the henchmen or the bullies would have come back. YOU are the one who has to prove this claim or just stop with this and accept that the evidence i posted is conclusive.
@Kukui. 1.-Yes he did, thats why he was apologizing to Shadii as he was bro7ght into Prana dimension and thats why the millenium ring possesed him. Ive already proven this in my blog, so i shall not waste more time. Not to mention this is backed up by the fact the henchmen and the bullies did not return after a dimension duel was over or after the pharaph comes back.
2.-ive already posted evidence of obelisk tearing apart Diva's dimension in this very thread and in my blog. That is enough evidence to say Obelisk did affect a Multi universe dimension.
How about you try to disprove Obelisl punched Diva's monster and the dimension went away? Im joking of course, because thats impossible. Youve lost.
3.- Again, you have not debunked anything, ve already debunked your rebuttal in my blog and in this very thread.
And this is not a voting scenario. You are wrong, no matter how many socks you use.
You are the one who said "Will finish this quickly". Apologize and ill do the same.
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"1.-Its not headcannon. In fact, the burden of poroof in on you. I have scans of them dissapearing and you are the one saying they come back.
So, its your turn to prove that they come back.
2.-I proved earlier on the thread that dimensions are not limited by the size of the room, or else the dimenison he creates against Yugi would be just stadium level.
Anime Obelisk is 5-A, and Manga obelisk is like city level or something for now"
^Assuming you're talking about this, I pointed out:
1. There is no proof for either side, hence why I'm saying its not a good point.
2. We still don't know how big the incomplete dimension is.
So, its your turn to prove that they come back.
2.-I proved earlier on the thread that dimensions are not limited by the size of the room, or else the dimenison he creates against Yugi would be just stadium level.
Anime Obelisk is 5-A, and Manga obelisk is like city level or something for now"
^Assuming you're talking about this, I pointed out:
1. There is no proof for either side, hence why I'm saying its not a good point.
2. We still don't know how big the incomplete dimension is.
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1.-Im saying they DID NOT COME BACK. And since they dont appear again in the entire movie, think VE ALREDY DONE THAT.
You are the ine who has to prove your argument.
2.1-BASE Diva' dimension range is already multi universal. Universal is the estimate that makes the most sense based on the cscript.
And they are already at least City Level as shown in my blog.
2.2 - Read point 2.1 Oh my god, please read the blog before trying to "DEBUNK" it.
You are the ine who has to prove your argument.
2.1-BASE Diva' dimension range is already multi universal. Universal is the estimate that makes the most sense based on the cscript.
And they are already at least City Level as shown in my blog.
2.2 - Read point 2.1 Oh my god, please read the blog before trying to "DEBUNK" it.
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1. We do not know what happens to them after the movie. We don't know if they remained dead or returned. I'm not arguing they returned, I am arguing a lack of info.
2.1 Hold on there. Range =/= size of dimension created. If that was the case, Homura would have a Multiversal sized barrier as Akuma Homura, or Hit's pocket dimension would be universal.
2.2 Already read your blog...
Quite frankly this is going nowhere. How about we ask an outside staff member on their opinion to conclude this then?
2.1 Hold on there. Range =/= size of dimension created. If that was the case, Homura would have a Multiversal sized barrier as Akuma Homura, or Hit's pocket dimension would be universal.
2.2 Already read your blog...
Quite frankly this is going nowhere. How about we ask an outside staff member on their opinion to conclude this then?
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Yeah, Rapid already proved this on the very thread.RapidMotorcycle19 said:Yeah yes.
And before you continue, i shall post multiple scans to prove my point.
But, lets go slowly and examine every thing i have an issue with.
First off.
Base Diva´s dimensions are far above room level, as it was wrongly tought in the Kaiba vs Diva duel.
We might not know the "accurate" scale of this dimension, but it scales to Imagination!Obelisk directly by destroying it.
At this point, i think its fair to assume at least City Level.
Room Level Dimension? Dont kid me.
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What even is your argument at this point,Data and kukui.
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@RapidMotorcycle19
Please show at least some respect towards the people you're arguing with. Don't call others sockpuppets.
Please show at least some respect towards the people you're arguing with. Don't call others sockpuppets.
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