Yu-Gi-Oh! Anime DIscussion

[Arigarmy]

1. He just said they just didn't go through with it, they were either finished or pretty close.

2. That does not look like a physical feat in the slighest, who approved that part? Also it's not like the Yami variants are still any different from their normal selfs physically, nothing has proved that they're different. The pages themselves don't do that outside of Marik's because of the aforementioned sloppy organization the pages are in.

3. Millennium Items do not scale outside of that one Eye/Ring laser clash as far as I'm aware. They have way too varying abilities and powers to consider being equal.

 

[Imaginym]

About 2: Assuming the comments don't provide the info you want, as far as I know, Dark649 put the feat on Marik's page, going by the page's history.

3. Yami Marik & Yami Bakura have also clashed with lasers, during in Battle City, just as Pegasus did with Yami Bakura.

My memory may be inaccurate, & this may simply be a matter of hax, but there have been some instances of other Millenium Items causing interference with the Millenium Rod's control. Such as Marik & Mai's duel

During Yugi vs Bandit Keith, Yami Bakura also severs Marik's control over Bandit Keith.

 

[Arigarmy]

For Marik it's fine, scaling to Bakura is okay(?) because it too had outdone Marik's telekinesis as long as that scene is the same in the anime. But for Yugi I don't think the Puzzle is going to do Wall level shenanigans any day now.

 

[Imaginym]

Just to be sure, @Arigarmy: "As Mai struggles from Marik's curses, Yami Yugi uses the powers of his Millennium Puzzle to encourage her to win." What is your stance on that as to how it relates to this?

But no, I can't recall much else that supports the Millenium Puzzle scaling to the Eye, Ring, or Rod.

And given that scaling Marik to Bakura should be fine, & Bakura clashed with Pegasus, does that mean Pegasus can get in on this scaling? My memory of Duelist Kingdom anime says Pegasus does have some minor hax/feats I think, but I'd have to check those. Perhaps more notably, for what it may suggest about the original's dialogue, during their clash, Bakura says that Pegasus is weak after his duel with Yugi, but his is fresh, which may imply Pegasus is more comparable at his peak.

 

[Crzer07]

just noticed seto kaibas page was also deleted, so was akiza izinski

 

[Arigarmy]

wasnt kaiba's page been dead

 

[Arigarmy]

@Imag

I've never heard of Yugi doing that, ever. The only thing that happens as far as I'm aware is Mai realizes she can't summon Ra, Yugi's third eye glows because "**** this is a shadow game" realization, and then Mai dies.

Pegasus was weak because he lost the Shadow Game (even if the stakes weren't as lethal), nothing more to it. Marik got sick as hell after he beat Joey, the anime does it twice just to prove the point I think. Pegasus could have his own page, but it'd only have to circle around Duelist Kingdom since after that the Eye is kind of not in his hands anymore.

 

[Imaginym]

Will probably be worth it to double check the original subs episode for how it relates to anime canon, I suppose.

That makes sense. I didn't doubt that was the reason. Although, since his clash was with Bakura in Duelist Kingdom, & it seems unlikely Bakura changed in power between DK & BC, right? So presumably, the AP Pegasus scales to wouldn't be very different.

Most of Pegasus's hax is shown in Duelist Kingdom anyway. I don't see much issue that'd come to a hypothetical page of his from Pegasus not having the Millenium Eye afterwards.

Incidentally, if we do end up scaling Marik's feats done with the Millenium Rod to Bakura &/or Pegasus, do you think a calc of his electricity manipulation could lead to an upgrade?

 

[Arigarmy]

and i might as well get this part out of the way because this happens in the anime as well and its right on mai's defeat


I think this is about as much as an outlier as Marik getting mega punched by Obelisk across the stage and only going on about his pain fetish out of it. If it's ever brought up, I don't think an argument could be made in its favor. Maybe for how fast Yugi was in getting there before Ra assblasted him? I just want to bring this up since we were on physical durability and it could be something to point out before someone else rediscovers it and gets curious because Yugi got incapacitated from it.

 

[Marco_Shark]

Id like to argue a bit about the "8th Millenium Item" thing just in case it gets brought up to attempt to make this movie non-canon to the anime.

"Using the power of the eighth Millenium Item made in secret, the Pyramid of Light."

1.-Seto´s ancestor´s father is the one announcing or at least, thinking this plan, so it is safe to assume that this Millenium Item was made by him or at least, hidden from the Pharaoh and the others, so this shouldnt contradict Zorc, since it had no chance to be even found by said Master of Darkness, since Zorc still mentions that he made 7 Millenium Items and ignores the Pyramid of Light somewhat confirms this, it doesnt even fit on the Phraraoh´s tomb stone, implying it was never made known to the pharaoh in all of the Zorc arc.

2.-Even if you might consider DSOD as part of the anime verse, the one that states that the Quantic Cube is the 8th Millenium item IS Diva, not Yugi nor anyone else, and since it was hidden from even the Pharaoh himself, Diva shouldnt have the information to call it the 9th MIllenium Item or something like that.

 

[Imaginym]

I'd call that an outlier, too. At best, it's 3 Wall Levels taking a... what is Manga Ra, again, if you'll forgive my miserable memory? Low 7-C? Either way, it's a massive outlier, considering the tiers. I'm pretty sure none of Joey, nor Mai, nor Yami Yugi ARE Wall Level in Durability; Again, saying "at best" & because some Yu-Gi-Oh! humans MIGHT be that durable.

The only argument I can think of it being that some folks show visible signs of being damaged by the Egyptian Gods during duels but still live somewhat frequently during Battle City.

But I'm not sure such things happening often makes them any more acceptable, nor if they happen often enough at all.

 

[Arigarmy]

Id like to argue a bit about the "8th Millenium Item" thing just in case it gets brought up to attempt to make this movie non-canon to the anime.

But it is non-canon to anime.

I'd call that an outlier, too. At best, it's 3 Wall Levels taking a... what is Manga Ra, again, if you'll forgive my miserable memory? Low 7-C? Either way, it's a massive outlier, considering the tiers. I'm pretty sure none of Joey, nor Mai, nor Yami Yugi ARE Wall Level in Durability; Again, saying "at best" & because some Yu-Gi-Oh! humans MIGHT be that durable.
The only argument I can think of it being that some folks show visible signs of being damaged by the Egyptian Gods during duels but still live somewhat frequently during Battle City.

But I'm not sure such things happening often makes them any more acceptable, nor if they happen often enough at all.

Well first of all we don't know if they're going to be Wall level at all, especially Yugi of all people. Well Egyptian Gods are a special case if they're ******* up the technology of the Duel Disks themselves and manifesting storms, have you ever seen how they react when they're summoned?

 

[Imaginym]

Oh I definitely doubt Yugi would be Wall level at all, let alone anyone else.

And trust me, I've seen the manga Egyptian God storm calc, what looks like the anime version of the scene, & I'm pretty sure I was the one who brought up several Egyptian God feats from the anime like, 2 threads ago.

Heck, IIRC, in anime canon, at least, they killed the people who were trying to make the card versions of them.

 

[Marco_Shark]

I think that they should be that durable, if you manage to tank that, and itsnt contradicted by anything else, its fine by me.


And before battle city all "If you lose this game will kill you" is made by bad guys that did not personally knew about Yugi or Atem.

Its like being afraid of being shot in the head because you think you are going to die when you have got bullet proof just a week before that, you are used to think that you will die when being shot by years and years of growing up not being bullet proof, just to be utterly surprised when you actually survive.

In the case, Atem would have been willing to sacrifice himself to save Joey, but survived by surprise when he had shown that he had the durability to do so.

 

[Marco_Shark]

I think that the novel has already proven that PoL is canon to the anime.

 

[Arigarmy]

Too bad it isn't fine by everyone else @Marco

also there weren't any "if you lose this game you die" duels in Duelist Kingdom

 

[Marco_Shark]

I said "Before".

And everyone is free to be fine with wathever they want.

If the others dont follow my logic, i cant force them, can i?

 

[Marco_Shark]

bump

 

[Marco_Shark]

Anyways, if PoL is considered canon to the anime, then Duel Monsters can be used irl, and thus, all of its effects.

From Yugi´s deck (Battle City, but it would scale to the rest of his decks) , there are tons of stuff that can be used as hax.

http://yugioh.wikia.com/wiki/Yugi_Muto%27s_Decks, and of course, only ANIME effects.

Attack Nullification/Reflection with Magic Cylinder and Mystical Refpael, Statistics Amplification with Magic Formula, Insta Kill with Magical Knives, Dark Hole, Mirror Force, Breath of Light and Horn of Heaven Mind Control with Change of Heart, Temporal Sealing with Lightforce Sword and Swords of Revealing Light, Summoning with Soul Rope, BFR with Soul Release, Power Null with Spellbinding Circle, Ressurectio with Monster Reborn, Fusion Reversal with De-Fusion (which would affect characters like Vegito or Zamasu) but i still need some time to figure out what Pot of Greed does.

Of course, this should be bound by Duel Monster rules just like Touhou is limited by spell card rules, and other hax that negates regular hax should also negate Yugi´s cards, unless Yugi had something that could negate effects.

Also, we would have to know if the opponent should be considered a monster or another duelist, not that it matters a lot, since Anubis used magic cards to attack Yugi and Kaiba directy and Yugi and Kaiba used Blue Eyes Shining Dragon to kill Anubis, even if he is considered a duelist.

 

[Crzer07]

the cards having real world effects is a thing without needing to bring in PoL. the issue was because using them was counted as "prep time" they were removed from their stats, not much like summoning digimons and pokemons. I think you have to specify they are prep or some shit. but there are probably instances where prep wasn't needed to use them, like summoning teams of digimons and pokemons. Like when Judai was in another dimension.

 

[The_2nd_Existential_Seed]

Capsule Monsters also did not require prep to summon. Same with Duel Monsters Season 4 & 5 , Bonds Beyond Time , Pyramid of Light , Most Shadow Duels . Even on a verse-equalized match You'd assume he would be able to summon monsters.

 

[Arigarmy]

I said "Before".

You said before Battle City, and the only things that can predate Battle City is filler game world and Duelist Kingdom. Not unless you want to somehow guess that Capsule Monsters was before even that.

Also, the rules are pretty much negging all of your propositions to make their spell and trap cards real powers my guy.

 

[The_2nd_Existential_Seed]

Capsule Monsters is after Season 4 & before Season 5.

 

[Imaginym]

I had thought about it after posting last night, & there is ONE thing that might put Yami Yugi's durability higher than it is. But it's ambiguous.

See, during the DOMA/Orichalcos Arc, throughought the final, post-duel battle with Leviathan, with it being assaulted by monsters & regenerating, & being a creature that comes from & feeds on such darkness. By around the end of episode 183, everyone but Yugi & Atem flee the Atlantean Ruins.

A lot of the battle involved everyone finding the light in their heart with their comforting memories & such; To weaken Leviathan, since darkness of the heart & all that.

In fact, by this point, thanks to the aforementioned weakening, & such things strengthening the Egyptian Gods for their 2nd attack, Leviathan has been beaten by this point.

Leviathan seemingly defeated, Dartz reappears before Yugi, & so does Leviathan, its form now seemingly degraded, since well, it presumably got its body destroyed, & has little darkness to feed on.

Atem, however still has some, from in this arc. He challenges the beast, ready to shoulder its rage and hatred which form the Earth's darkness of the heart. It dives onto his spirit, the real Yugi still standing nearby, & becomes a sort of small twister.

Episode 183 goes "to be continued" there, & it continues in episode 184, & a lot of flashbacks ensue, because Yugi has to overcome his own darkness. Ultimately, he manages to make a "light" in his heart, & seal Leviathan away.


The point is a severely weakened Leviathan -spiritually drained of the darkness in the hearts & souls it feeds on & beaten physically by monsters & the gods- as a mere spirit turned into a twister that Atem's Spirit endured for a bit before sealing it away. Possible durability feat?

I'm not sure if it's applicable to physical durability, since, Atem is a spirit at this time, nor am I sure if Yugi's close enough for the feat to apply to him, either.

Here's links to a foreign version of the episodes on Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7_aPFXDH0I8 (Tornado thingy starts at 19:19) Continues here, with flashbacking: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kGgp3Jb3hyM Foreign dub because it's a version of the episodes actually on Youtube, & has reasonable resolution & isn't slowed down or something.

 

[Marco_Shark]

You said before Battle City, and the only things that can predate Battle City is filler game world and Duelist Kingdom. Not unless you want to somehow guess that Capsule Monsters was before even that.

Also, the rules are pretty much negging all of your propositions to make their spell and trap cards real powers my guy.


Pfff.

Did you even read what i wrote?

Are you saying that? Anubis, Pegasus, Yugi and Kaiba alrrady showed that they can use DM irl.

You are done.

Debunked.

Sit down.

 

[Arigarmy]

Instead of being rude, you could've just given a scan and be done with it. Sass isn't debunking anything, you know. It's the same reason you got blocked last time.

 

[Imaginym]

@Arigarmy: If I may ask, any opinion on what I most recently mentioned?

 

[Arigarmy]

Computer crashed halfway through typing it.

I don't see how it could be a physical durability feat if I'm being honest. Yami's spirit isn't really physical or metaphysical or whatever Shadi is, it's just a way he can observe the world outside of the puzzle AFAIK. I do think it makes sense that the Serpent could've attacked Yami specifically though, since they're still two different souls in one body. My only problem is that I still don't see why you guys are specifically naming Yami variants for durability. Yami and Regular Yugi for durability are still in the same physical body, the only difference being a hair and eye swap (dont wanna get into height though, that's a controversial topic even for the anime version).

 

[Marco_Shark]

Its supposed to be a representation of how people see Yugi after the Phraoh takes over him.

He is more confident and more serious, making Yugi look taller because of his maturity.


BUT, The Pharaoh was indeed super-human and some skills and physical atributes are indeed passed thru their vessels. Not to mention Yugi is Atem´s descendant/reincarnation.


Anyways, back on the topic.

Is 2-C GX Yugi looking good or not.

 

[Imaginym]

I see. I don't know if Yugi could've felt the tornado. Probably not. Atem certainly could, but given that Leviathan was only its spirit at the time, it might be plausible that it could only affect other spirits? Maybe? One could interpret it as having the AP to make that twister, but only able to affect spirits with it... or something else like it?

Going to a slightly different topic, you have a point about the Yami/Dark versions. I can think of one thing that might support it, though. Although, my memory is of the dub dialogue, not the original's.

At the end of Battle City's Yugi vs Bakura, as their only option left to win the duel against Yugi, Marik & Bakura decided to leave Ryo Bakura in control of his body, so that Yugi wouldn't attack with Slifer, pass the turn, & Bakura would win.

However, Yami Bakura decided he couldn't risk his host getting hurt. That he still needs him. And took back over. Then they took the attack, & Marik & Bakura later had their duel. This would suggest Yami Bakura/Thief King Bakura/Dark Bakura is more durable than Ryo Bakura, or at least, has more Stamina, since it's apparently less risky for him to take the attack than Ryo.

Especially lending credibility to this -or at least, his pain tolerance- is that Bakura has a broken, bandaged, bleeding arm throughout most of Battle City, something the Spirit of the Ring duels just fine with, but Ryo feels clear pain from moments after he's put back in control.

 

[SomebodyData]

Can we get a tl:dr for the 2-C GX Yugi?

 

[Marco_Shark]

Read the start of the thread.

 

[Megaboy_Prime]

I do agree with 2-C GX Yugi because of Existential Seed, his posts seem accurate and justified.


And i do agree with Marco about Pyramid of Light, the novel pretty much says the author was okay with it being canon to the anime, if he wasnt he wouldnt have involved himself with the novel or the japanese dub.

 

[Arigarmy]

[snip]

ok but but you ignored my scan request that you told me to sit down on, and them being related through blood doesn't mean they're physically the same

 

[Marco_Shark]

Not at all, its just a minor thing that makes the idea of Yugi´s body also being at least above regular human plausible.


And what the heck do you want scans off? Of the original intention of the lunar brothers and Arkana duels? a scan of all of pyraid of light? a scan of what? Everything ive talked about has been already been discussed above, i wont spoonfeed you everything you doubt something that has already been posted before, go look it up for yourself.


inb4

"If you dont have scans i guess i win lolz" No, you are just ignoring the facts that have been already been proven true before, so dont even try that.

 

[Arigarmy]

Ctrl + F only shows me more statements that discredit your own claims with SD going on about how the Pyramid of Light movie in itself contradicting one of the (most important) seasons, and nobody has ever (as far as scrolling through this thread) agreed with the claims you're making either. Once again, you're on your own.

Also yeah, you need scans if you're gonna support your evidence. There is no previous discussion that links to another Pyramid of Light discussion. If you don't spoonfeed, you're only making blank statements. That's kind of how you prove your point, man.

 

[SomebodyData]

I feel like it should be pointed out, that PoL's novel can be canon to the anime (given the authors of it aren't 4kids and it removes most of the contradictions.) but I'm not sure if it had cards irl.

 

[Marco_Shark]

What about Prime? Are you going to ignore him?

Anyways, saying "More people agree with me, therefore i am right" is absolutely wrong.

Having tons of people support you out of nowhere just means that they are not even reading the thread or are socks.

But hey, if someone legit agrees with you, thats fine too.


And with the novel being canon to the anime its enough proof for me to claim wathever i want.

Not to mention that, what you replied was about Yugi´s durability, not PoL, saying that the pharaoh in Yugi´s body had to face dangerous situations before tanking that blast from Ra.

You have not: 1.-Disproven that the novel was made to be canon to the anime in japan.

2.-That Anubis used real life card effects in real life, scaling Yugi, Kaiba, Joey, Pegasus and more to that skill.

3.-The effects of the cards ive listed as potential hax.

 

[Arigarmy]

You never mentioned Prime before to me. I never said your quote, nor am I saying people agree with me, you're pulling things out your ass again. You said yourself people don't have to believe in your own statements, yet when someone does you still act like it's correct anyway. That's not how you debate, you either explain yourself or don't do anything. You haven't given the scans of them doing it in the first place, so all your claims are still claims until you provide the scans. There are no scans in the thread, so unless you get those scans in the thread, nobody can take your damn statements in the first place.

And why the **** did you just say that the novel was canon to the anime, and then have one of your points being "you didn't prove the novel was canon to the anime"? Jesus, the anger is getting so far in my head I can't read right.

You're starting to piss me off a little with that type of attitude. I'm going to sleep.

 

[Marco_Shark]

My attitude? You are the one saying "No one agrees with you, shut up". I´m going to sleep as well, people like you are really a trouble in getting stuff aproved. The evidence is there, it has been explained, but some people just say they dont wanna a certain character get hax, and just say that you are dumb because a lot of people are not "voting".


Please dude, if you could please read the entire thread before replying i would be very grateful, but you wont do that, wont you?