Yan Sen Plot Manipulation Removal

[Wanz1111]

Plot Manipulation with Creation (Henry's character design makes him infinitely stronger than any opponent, even if that opponent comes from another story. He will continue to be invincible. His character design will always keep him alive and Yan Sen can create other Henrys with the same powers as Henry [3])

Resistance to:
Plot Manipulation (He continued to dominate Henry in his base form[61][56][62] and at the end of the fight Henry said YanSen was above the setting[63])

Passive Plot Manipulation (Henry's character design makes him infinitely stronger than any opponent, even if that opponent comes from another story. He will continue to be invincible. His character design will always keep him alive[1])

I believe his Plot Manipulation should be removed. Based on the scans he does not clearly demonstrate the ability as defined. I feel like him creating the “settings” is more of a specific power rather than control over the narrative itself. He doesn’t show the ability to alter the fundamental plot or view reality as fictional.

Yan Sen Plot Manipulation with Creation should be left with Creation. His resistance to Plot Manipulation should be removed too.

Henry Passive Plot Manipulation should be Passive Reactive Evolution or Accelerated Development Battle type.

Henry Passive Plot Manipulation should be Limited to the White Space.

 

[KingNanaya]

I disagree with the thread

 

[Wanz1111]

I disagree with the thread

How is this relevant?

 

[SweetDao]

How is this relevant?

Yan Sen's power is copying the character design of Henry, which is something clearly more fundamental than simply making a clone of him since Yan Sen seems unable to learn or get the ability of Henry.

Until he fought Henry, he had no idea about what a "character design" was, despite showing the ability of creating clones of himself or making clones of his deceased sect members.

Henry states that "no matter the story, book, comic from where Yan Sen comes, he'll still remain invincible in this place". "This place" being this story, obviously.

This seems metafictional enough personally.

 

[Wanz1111]

That still doesn’t align with Plot Manipulation.

 

[SweetDao]

I mean, if you want to remove "plot manipulation with creation" and put instead "Creation (On a narrative level)", be my guest, the end result is more or less the same.

 

[KremcikGorv]

As far as I remember, Henry continues to get stronger through the setting, that is, the plot, and this is a strengthening that is strong enough to keep up with Yan Sen's transition from normal human size to a large size type 10 form, and Yan Sen also create a stronger setting, that is, the plot, so it is normal to get plot creation hax.

 

[Floxiaaa]

First of all, I will explain why Yan Sen got plot manipulation by creating Henrys. When Henrys fight each other, they tell each other that they are getting stronger. This is completely related to the setting and Henry's plot manipulation. Because no matter what the story is, no matter who the opponent is, he will be infinitely powerful. Since Yan Sen's created Henrys have this ability, there is no harm in Yan Sen getting plot from here. So I don't agree with this CRT.

 

[Floxiaaa]

I mean, if you want to remove "plot manipulation with creation" and put instead "Creation (On a narrative level)", be my guest, the end result is more or less the same.

I don't think it is possible to remove plot manipulation through creation, because there are obvious feats.

 

[SweetDao]

I don't think it is possible to remove plot manipulation through creation, because there are obvious feats.

Those are just a change in phrasing anyway, he wouldn't lose "plot manipulation" technically.

 

[Floxiaaa]

Those are just a change in phrasing anyway, he wouldn't lose "plot manipulation" technically.

Sure

 

[Floxiaaa]

I feel like him creating the “settings” is more of a specific power rather than control over the narrative itself.

Yan Sen says that he can't kill him, so he uses his ability to create settings. So this is the same as creating Henrys, because Henry says that he is the setting. Therefore, whatever rights the setting has, Yan Sen must have them too.

 

[Wanz1111]

the setting, that is, the plot

Scan?

This is completely related to the setting and Henry's plot manipulation. Because no matter what the story is, no matter who the opponent is, he will be infinitely powerful.

Sounds more like Reactive Evolution or Accelerated Development.

 

[Sebas-S.P-san]

the argument of @SweetDao Looks interesting, I'll stay neutral for now.

 

[Floxiaaa]

Scan?

Sounds more like Reactive Evolution or Accelerated Development.

No? It has nothing to do with improved evolution. The setting said that no matter who the person is against him, he will become infinitely stronger. The plot thing is this. He can replace the strongest person in the story. I should explain this situation as follows. In order to change this, the story itself needs to be changed. That's why Henry gets the plot. This has nothing to do with development. No scan says this, on the contrary, it says that the setting will write him infinitely stronger. In other words, no matter who the story is, he will manipulate it again and come to the top. Yan Sen adds these features to Henrys when he creates them. He needs to have this power to add this to them. And the story itself changes. Henry is not the strongest. Someone equal to him comes. And the fact that he cannot come to the top of the story means that the story itself is manipulated.

 

[Floxiaaa]

And even if this is accelerated development, there is no reason to remove plot manipulation via creation.

 

[Floxiaaa]

the argument of @SweetDao Looks interesting, I'll stay neutral for now.

I know that you cannot tag anyone if you are not a staff member.

 

[BestMGQScalerEver]

I know that you cannot tag anyone if you are not a staff member.

You're right @Floxiaaa

 

[Floxiaaa]

You're right @Floxiaaa

 

[Wanz1111]

No? It has nothing to do with improved evolution. The setting said that no matter who the person is against him, he will become infinitely stronger. The plot thing is this. He can replace the strongest person in the story. I should explain this situation as follows. In order to change this, the story itself needs to be changed. That's why Henry gets the plot. This has nothing to do with development. No scan says this, on the contrary, it says that the setting will write him infinitely stronger. In other words, no matter who the story is, he will manipulate it again and come to the top. Yan Sen adds these features to Henrys when he creates them. He needs to have this power to add this to them. And the story itself changes. Henry is not the strongest. Someone equal to him comes. And the fact that he cannot come to the top of the story means that the story itself is manipulated.

Yan Sen said it himself the setting means an infinite power to overtake Henry opponent which is straight up Accelerated Development or Reactive Evolution. Nothing in your explanation aligns with Plot Manipulation.

 

[Livinmeme]

Yan Sen said it himself the setting means an infinite power to overtake Henry opponent which is straight up Accelerated Development or Reactive Evolution. Nothing in your explanation aligns with Plot Manipulation.

1. Henry literally states ad verbum that HE IS THE SETTING
2. He states that he will always win, no matter what kind of comic, or medium he is (I.E. Implying existence of meta narrative)
3. This is a clear analogy of plot armor
4. You don't need to have a meta narrative, to get plot manip

 

[TWILIGHT-OP]

@SweetDao seems logical , currently neutral but inclined towards agree.

 

[Floxiaaa]

Yan Sen said it himself the setting means an infinite power to overtake Henry opponent which is straight up Accelerated Development or Reactive Evolution. Nothing in your explanation aligns with Plot Manipulation.

I will tell you again. First of all, this has nothing to do with evolution. What you say can only create certain complications, but when you look at the essence of the subject, Henry says: "It doesn't matter if it comes from a raw story or a webtoon, my setting is the strongest here. I am the setting." This means that whoever the other person is, he will be much stronger than him. Look, this has nothing to do with evolution. This was already determined at the very beginning of the war. This is just the way plot manipulation works. When we look at the essence, it is completely related to the story. For example, let's say Henry is already a strong person. Before the war starts, the setting will already write Henry to be stronger than the man in front of him, this is just the way plot manipulation works. Yan Sen, on the other hand, disrupts this situation and changes the story itself, not allowing Henry to be the strongest. It wouldn't be hard to say that he has this power by creating multiple Henrys.

 

[SweetDao]

1. Henry literally states ad verbum that HE IS THE SETTING
2. He states that he will always win, no matter what kind of comic, or medium he is (I.E. Implying existence of meta narrative)
3. This is a clear analogy of plot armor
4. You don't need to have a meta narrative, to get plot manip

Probably the best summary one could make, good job!

 

[Robo432343]

Where is the scan that shows Yan sen manipulating the plot
It just shows him being stronger than someone
Hell nah this is no where close to plot manip

 

[Wanz1111]

Henry literally states ad verbum that HE IS THE SETTING

Yeah where is the scan that says “setting” = entire plot? Yan Sen already said what the setting means.

He states that he will always win, no matter what kind of comic, or medium he is (I.E. Implying existence of meta narrative)

Thats just No Limits Fallacy or Reactive Evolution or Accelerated Development.

You don't need to have a meta narrative, to get plot manip

That’s different from what anything Henry is doing.

It doesn't matter if it comes from a raw story or a webtoon, my setting is the strongest here. I am the setting.

Yeah he is describing his Reactive Evolution or Accelerated Development. Again where does “setting” = whole plot?

This is just the way plot manipulation works.

Yan Sen, on the other hand, disrupts this situation and changes the story itself, not allowing Henry to be the strongest.

Plot Manipulation is the ability to create, destroy, or control the plot that governs reality.
Yan Sen didn’t change the story, he just created another Henry to fight the original but since he cannot kill Henry, it comes to a stalemate.

 

[Robo432343]

Yeah show us where Yan sen is actually changing the plot of the story, not just being stronger than someone

 

[Floxiaaa]

Yeah where is the scan that says “setting” = entire plot? Yan Sen already said what the setting means.

Thats just No Limits Fallacy or Reactive Evolution or Accelerated Development.

That’s different from what anything Henry is doing.

Yeah he is describing his Reactive Evolution or Accelerated Development. Again where does “setting” = whole plot?


Plot Manipulation is the ability to create, destroy, or control the plot that governs reality.
Yan Sen didn’t change the story, he just created another Henry to fight the original but since he cannot kill Henry, it comes to a stalemate.

No. This changes the outcome of the story. The story says Henry is the strongest, but Yan Sen manipulates the plot through creation.

 

[Wanz1111]

No. This changes the outcome of the story. The story says Henry is the strongest, but Yan Sen manipulates the plot through creation.

Scan? Cause all I saw was him creating another Henry.

 

[SweetDao]

Yeah show us where Yan sen is actually changing the plot of the story, not just being stronger than someone

He created a new character design (i.e created another Henry), he didn't merely create a "clone" of Henry, it copied the very "setting" he embodied.

 

[Floxiaaa]

Where is the scan that shows Yan sen manipulating the plot
It just shows him being stronger than someone
Hell nah this is no where close to plot manip

He says he can't kill Henry.

 

[Livinmeme]

Yeah where is the scan that says “setting” = entire plot? Yan Sen already said what the setting means.

when he said that he was the setting he acshually meant uh.....

Give me a different interpretation of "I am the setting", that isn't utterly insane

Thats just No Limits Fallacy or Reactive Evolution or Accelerated Development.

It is supporting evidence

That’s different from what anything Henry is doing.

How? Both are the creators of their series

Plot Manipulation is the ability to create, destroy, or control the plot that governs reality.
Yan Sen didn’t change the story, he just created another Henry to fight the original but since he cannot kill Henry, it comes to a stalemate.

He is literally the creator of the goddamn series

 

[Wanz1111]

He created a new character design (i.e created another Henry), he didn't merely create a "clone" of Henry, it copied the very "setting" he embodied.

Wdym character design they are identical. Setting can mean various things.

 

[BestMGQScalerEver]

All the arguments for removing plot manip just seem to be ignoring or trying to jump around the pretty clear evidence provided so disagree FRA.

 

[Robo432343]

Yan sen literally said the setting is just the power to infinitely overtake the opponent
That has nothing to do with plot

 

[Robo432343]

All the arguments for removing plot manip just seem to be ignoring or trying to jump around the pretty clear evidence provided so disagree FRA.

you’re just saying this to get likes FRA

 

[Livinmeme]

Also, it is clear that he uses plot manip to become stronger than the opponent, I mean, he even mentions how not even characters that come from totally different stories, are still subject to Henry plot manip

 

[SweetDao]

Wdym character design they are identical. Setting can mean various things.

The exact word used can have multiple meanings, one of the "better translation" out there translated those words by "character design", which is infinitely better than the half baked translation we use.

 

[Livinmeme]

Yan sen literally said the setting is just the power to infinitely overtake the opponent

What is a setting then? I can't think of a definition of "the setting", without implying an existent metanarrative (This is strengthened by henry literally mentioning the existence of another stories, or novels)

 

[Floxiaaa]

Scan? Cause all I saw was him creating another Henry.

That's why we call it plot manipulation through creation.