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Professional Wrestling General Discussion Thread

CuteAnimeNekoGirl99

CuteAnimeNekoGirl99

She/Her
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WWE is an iconic franchise and we don't have profiles because of inconsistent storylines and lack of feats there are several instances of feats happening what I thought of off of the top of my head was the numerous time's people were thrown off of the hell in a cell which is a 4.9 meter drop and some such as mankind as well as these characters wacking each other with blunt objects such as steel chairs, lead pipes, steel chains, sledgehammers, a goddamn garbage can, and a kendo stick also Braun Strowman is strong enough to rip off car doors, bust ladders, and throw people hard enough to take down sections of the hell in a cell. also, mark henry tore off the door to the hell in a cell

Ls is way more impressive with Braun Strowman flipping an ambulance and a truck. there's also mark henry who squatted a car and pulled two trucks, some smaller wrestlers such as john cena can lift the big show and the edge at the same time which would be 623 pounds but I found a news article that stated over 700 pounds so this might be higher if we use the canon weights of the wrestlers, hulk hogan who bodyslammed andre the giant a guy that weights at 529 pounds

there aren't any notable speed feats however but most of these characters most likely have just peak human running
 
My main problem with WWE would be that scaling wrestlers to eachother would be weird and wack.

It's like a Marvel situation where it's everybody can fight everybody logic. If we dont put in regulations for WWE, then we would have guys like The Brooklyn Brawler being scaled to The Undertaker after a very long and confusing scaling chain.
 
MistaClean said:
My main problem with WWE would be that scaling wrestlers to eachother would be weird and wack.

It's like a Marvel situation where it's everybody can fight everybody logic. If we dont put in regulations for WWE, then we would have guys like The Brooklyn Brawler being scaled to The Undertaker after a very long and confusing scaling chain.
Click to expand...
I agree with that most characters such as your mick foleys and other characters should scale to lower-tier feats which are street level like falling off the hell in a cell while your big shows, mark henry's and other strongmen could be wall level for tearing off doors to cars, busting ladders, busting parts of the hell in a cell, and breaking the ring all of these feats are common for their tiers the only one I can see from only scaling to the strongman despite doing not a lot from that is cena due to him being able to fight a lot of these strongmen on several occasions I such as mark henry
 
If profiles were to be made, I think a good portion of the WWE wrestlers should be 9-B due to various feats that are on this level, such as the common feat of wrestlers tanking getting smashed onto tables, John Cena surviving this explosion, Mankind surviving being slammed through Hell in a Cell and being thrown off it, Braun Strowman tanking an ambulance crashing into a wall, Big Show busting a window with a casual slap, Ultimate Warrior snapping Hercules Hernandez's chains in half, Skinner wrestling and killing alligators that are 12 feet long, Braun Strowman flipping over an ambulance truck, Ultimate Warrior smashing Brother Love's podium, Hulk Hogan stated to be able to crack fault lines and many others
 
sure I'll make a calc for Cena tanking that explosion all of those other feats seem fine and I found clips for table busting which the best one is seemingly this one where edge tanks getting thrown through two tables which would be 621,463.2732 joules based off of the number given for rectangular table fragmentation and just multiplying that by two
 

2CpkbPt.gif
 
Wrestling profiles can be done, but there's a LOT of things we'd need to iron out beforehand since wrestling is unlike any medium on the site. A big one is the keyfabe-reality interaction, where storylines end and real life begins. Mick Foley as a man was famously hospitalized from the Hell in the Cell incident, but does Mandkind as a character ever reference a great injury? That might be a pretty straight forward answer, but some stuff gets muddled.

There's a few more potential issues but im to tired to explain them rn.
 
Amelia_Lonelyheart said:
Wrestling profiles can be done, but there's a LOT of things we'd need to iron out beforehand since wrestling is unlike any medium on the site. A big one is the keyfabe-reality interaction, where storylines end and real life begins. Mick Foley as a man was famously hospitalized from the Hell in the Cell incident, but does Mandkind as a character ever reference a great injury? That might be a pretty straight forward answer, but some stuff gets muddled.

There's a few more potential issues but im to tired to explain them rn.
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Imo IRL injuries shouldn't be taken into consideration unless they are scripted to take place, for example Seth injuring himself because he flipped weirdly isn't the result of Seth the Character getting injured, its Colby the man that got injured.
 
I'm going to wait for more replies, but I do feel like wrestlers like John Cena, The Undertaker, Braun Strowman, and more should have profiles, as they are more of the consistent characters in the WWE.
 
The sort of fiction ewe takes place in is one that mirrors our world where 1 day in our world is 1 in their universe

when it comes to things such as accidents that happen do become canon think about it kinda like improv in a way with situations such as that one at least for mankind’s case
 
As I stated before, I really love wrestling and I'd love to see WWE added to the wiki! However, Amelia's and Mista's points are all true. Wrestling is a very unique piece of media and have an incredibly difficult scaling chain.

There's plenty of tropes I've observed while watching matches that should be kept in mind. I'll try to make a concise list soon, using examples from matches.
 
Some wrestling tropes to keep in mind when attempting to do any scaling or profiles, and in fact, many of these apply to fiction in general to greater or lesser degrees.
  • Everyone Fights Everyone: Any character can wound or at least inflict pain upon each other in regular occasions. As I will explain a bit further on, the way to scale characters as beyond or below each other is to look how they match up conceptually, and to take into account the circumstances they fight on. See, for example the match between MVP and Mr. Kennedy against Undertaker and Kane. You will see that, during the whole fight, Undertaker and Kane are clearly the superior ones. MVP and Mr. Kennedy can cause them pain and inflict some damage, but they are clearly inferior. However, there are many moments there that either the Undertaker or Kane take the fight seriously, and they take no damage at all from their strikes. This is a common trope in fiction, but particularly glaring in wrestling. The Undertaker that is facing seven other guys in a Royal Rumble match is a completely different 'taker than the one who singlehandedly defeated the entire Smackdown roster.
  • Entrance Peak Energy: This is most noticeable in Royal Rumble matches, so I won't even link them, although if you guys really want a good example, look for the 2007, which is the one I am most familiar with and I can point out several times this happens. In any case, every fighter has a short-lived, extremely high-energy moment when they enter the ring. Even very low-tiered fighters often beat up high-tier ones for a few seconds and knock down several people on the ring before they, themselves are stopped. That is to introduce a bit more chaos andadrenaline into the fight, and a fighter's general performance should not be judged by how they perform in the first moments of a match, except in really egregious cases. In most matches this doesn't apply, as both fighters start out strong, but any fight that introduces someone in the middle of the fight, know that they will dominate the battle for a short time.
  • The Whole Is Stronger Than The Sum: A corny name, I know, but fighters who do attacks as a group do much more damage than alone. A bit hard to give examples, but Royal Rumbles are a good example of this, so 2007 is good too! (There's a better one, but sadly, I forgot the name) Somehow, when two wrestlers contribute to do a single attack, it does way more damage than they, separately (or even together without coordination) can do. Again, in the Undertaker and Kane V.S. MVP and Mr. Kennedy, the only times they did real damage, aside from cheap shots, were when they did coordinated attacks. Similarly, attacks that involve self-sacrifice (That are dangerous to the own user), from leaping from heights such as ropes, ladders or even the scaffolding (yes, really, that happens) and, obviously, with weapons often do way more damage than normal. Funnily enough about team attacks, often times wrestlers have a certain... Let's call it "partnership level" with each other. The better they work as a team, the higher we can consider that "level" to be. What do I mean by that? Wrestlers that are tag team champions, are brothers or have some sort of synergy often do more damage when doing combined attacks than teams that may be composed of individually stronger fighters, but without as much chemistry. In a Royal Rumble with specifications that I forgot, there was a tag team whose individual members were being beaten up hard bythe other fighters, but once they worked together, they eliminated practically half of the ring. Another example of that is how, in Royal Rumbles, many times fighters that have no experience in tag teaming with each other do combined attacks, but they are, seemingly, barely any more effective than their individual attacks.
There's a few more but those three are the main ones that come from the top of my head. Of course, signature moves are more damaging than normal moves, even when they should be biomechanically weak or when the same moves are performed by other fighters, but aren't as emblematic.
 
Personally, I'd tier the characters roughly in this way:
  • Greatest Hall of Famers and most successful fighters. Note that this might only cover specific timeframes. (Undertaker, Hulk Hogan, Ultimate Warrior, Randy Savage, Brock Lesnar, Braun Strowman at his peak and similar ones. Similarly tiered, but that might be a bit lower as they vary a bit and are conceptually more normal fighters, are Shawn Michaels, Triple H, Rey Mysterio, Roman Reigns, John Cena...)
  • Notorious fighters. (Chris Jericho, John Morrison at his strongest moments, most of the successful cast may be here in normal circumstances, Big Show, Mark Henry)
  • Average wrestlers and jobbers. (Santino Marella, The Miz, Hardcore Holly...)
Note that this is a general thing. Conceptually, Rey Mysterio hits quite weakly when he's not somersaulting (which he admittedly does a lot, and he hits very hard when he does that), but his general skill, speed and prowess should put him in the upper tier, while someone like the Great Khali would be extremely strong and durable, but otherwise so slow, less technical and, really, lacking willpower that they are ranked much lower.

There's still plenty to iron around, of course, I could nitpick mistakes on my own rationale and this is only here to provide a bare-bones skeleton, but it's there!
 
EliminatorVenom said:
Some wrestling tropes to keep in mind when attempting to do any scaling or profiles, and in fact, many of these apply to fiction in general to greater or lesser degrees.
  • Everyone Fights Everyone: Any character can wound or at least inflict pain upon each other in regular occasions. As I will explain a bit further on, the way to scale characters as beyond or below each other is to look how they match up conceptually, and to take into account the circumstances they fight on. See, for example the match between MVP and Mr. Kennedy against Undertaker and Kane. You will see that, during the whole fight, Undertaker and Kane are clearly the superior ones. MVP and Mr. Kennedy can cause them pain and inflict some damage, but they are clearly inferior. However, there are many moments there that either the Undertaker or Kane take the fight seriously, and they take no damage at all from their strikes. This is a common trope in fiction, but particularly glaring in wrestling. The Undertaker that is facing seven other guys in a Royal Rumble match is a completely different 'taker than the one who singlehandedly defeated the entire Smackdown roster.
  • Entrance Peak Energy: This is most noticeable in Royal Rumble matches, so I won't even link them, although if you guys really want a good example, look for the 2007, which is the one I am most familiar with and I can point out several times this happens. In any case, every fighter has a short-lived, extremely high-energy moment when they enter the ring. Even very low-tiered fighters often beat up high-tier ones for a few seconds and knock down several people on the ring before they, themselves are stopped. That is to introduce a bit more chaos andadrenaline into the fight, and a fighter's general performance should not be judged by how they perform in the first moments of a match, except in really egregious cases. In most matches this doesn't apply, as both fighters start out strong, but any fight that introduces someone in the middle of the fight, know that they will dominate the battle for a short time.
  • The Whole Is Stronger Than The Sum: A corny name, I know, but fighters who do attacks as a group do much more damage than alone. A bit hard to give examples, but Royal Rumbles are a good example of this, so 2007 is good too! (There's a better one, but sadly, I forgot the name) Somehow, when two wrestlers contribute to do a single attack, it does way more damage than they, separately (or even together without coordination) can do. Again, in the Undertaker and Kane V.S. MVP and Mr. Kennedy, the only times they did real damage, aside from cheap shots, were when they did coordinated attacks. Similarly, attacks that involve self-sacrifice (That are dangerous to the own user), from leaping from heights such as ropes, ladders or even the scaffolding (yes, really, that happens) and, obviously, with weapons often do way more damage than normal. Funnily enough about team attacks, often times wrestlers have a certain... Let's call it "partnership level" with each other. The better they work as a team, the higher we can consider that "level" to be. What do I mean by that? Wrestlers that are tag team champions, are brothers or have some sort of synergy often do more damage when doing combined attacks than teams that may be composed of individually stronger fighters, but without as much chemistry. In a Royal Rumble with specifications that I forgot, there was a tag team whose individual members were being beaten up hard bythe other fighters, but once they worked together, they eliminated practically half of the ring. Another example of that is how, in Royal Rumbles, many times fighters that have no experience in tag teaming with each other do combined attacks, but they are, seemingly, barely any more effective than their individual attacks.
There's a few more but those three are the main ones that come from the top of my head. Of course, signature moves are more damaging than normal moves, even when they should be biomechanically weak or when the same moves are performed by other fighters, but aren't as emblematic.
Click to expand...
This makes sense, there needs to be a clear distinction between the Main eventers (i.e. The Undertaker, Brock Lesner, John Cena, etc.) and the mid to low carders like (Dolph, Sami Zayn, Mr. Kennedy, etc.)

I also don't think we need profiles for every superstar in the business as they would pretty repetitive for some, unlike characters such as The Fiend, The Undertaker, Kane etc who actually have powers in Kayfabe.
 
Zackra1799 said:
This makes sense, there needs to be a clear distinction between the Main eventers (i.e. The Undertaker, Brock Lesner, John Cena, etc.) and the mid to low carders like (Dolph, Sami Zayn, Mr. Kennedy, etc.)

I also don't think we need profiles for every superstar in the business as they would pretty repetitive for some, unlike characters such as The Fiend, The Undertaker, Kane etc who actually have powers in Kayfabe.
Click to expand...
Indeed! And there needs to be some acknowledgement that even some main carders are treated differently from the others.

Undertaker, Ultimate Warrior and Hulk Hogan are the greatest examples of this. They are consistently portrayed as absolute monsters, with Hogan having a famous winning streak, Undertaker several times punking other main eventers when going at "full power" and the Ultimate Warrior being the sole man who could, for a time in the WWE, match with Hogan.
 
EliminatorVenom said:
  • Greatest Hall of Famers and most successful fighters. Note that this might only cover specific timeframes. (Undertaker, Hulk Hogan, Ultimate Warrior, Randy Savage, Brock Lesnar, Braun Strowman at his peak and similar ones. Similarly tiered, but that might be a bit lower as they vary a bit and are conceptually more normal fighters, are Shawn Michaels, Triple H, Rey Mysterio, Roman Reigns, John Cena...)
  • Notorious fighters. (Chris Jericho, John Morrison at his strongest moments, most of the successful cast may be here in normal circumstances, Big Show, Mark Henry)
  • Average wrestlers and jobbers. (Santino Marella, The Miz, Hardcore Holly...)
Click to expand...
John Cena and the rock > Brock lesnar << Goldberg
 
I think elimatorvenoms ideas for scaling are good for the scaling I can see the weaker wrestlers being at least street tier while mid to high tier wrestlers are wall level mayyybe small building if my cena calc is ever accepted
 
I feel like some wrestlers should have some level of Pain Tolerance.

Wrestlers like John Cena have fought in "I Quit" matches, a type of matchup where you beat the opponent so bad to the point they say "I Quit."

In this "I Quit" match, Cena takes multiple beatings and continues to fight on. There's also been many matchups where John Cena has received a beating, and he somehow finds a way to power through the pain and mount a comeback.
 
I agree with this, there are a number of wrestlers have participated in matches where they've been slammed into a bed of thumbtacks and kept fighting especially Foley.
 
The Cena explosion is quite poor, it doesn't destroy the metal structure outside.
 
Zackra1799 said:
I agree with this, there are a number of wrestlers have participated in matches where they've been slammed into a bed of thumbtacks and kept fighting especially Foley.
Click to expand...
I remember that Chris Jericho vs Dean Ambrose match where Jericho was slammed into a bed of thumbtacks as well.
 
KLOL506 said:
The Cena explosion is quite poor, it doesn't destroy the metal structure outside.
Click to expand...
Would you recommend I use a different psi such as well just 1 psi or 0.0689476 bars

4.4257208238^ 3*((27136*0.0689476+8649)^(1/2)/13568-93/13568)^2= 0.00004309826 tons of tnt or 180323.11984 Joules just pretty decent into wall tier which is consistent with some of the common feats of the verse
 
I feel like it's perfectly fine to make profiles for the WWE characters that are more consistent in their verse, as wrestlers like Dolph Ziggler and The Miz are hard to depict, as they fluctuate constantly throughout the years.
 
EliminatorVenom said:
Personally, I'd tier the characters roughly in this way:
  • Greatest Hall of Famers and most successful fighters. Note that this might only cover specific timeframes. (Undertaker, Hulk Hogan, Ultimate Warrior, Randy Savage, Brock Lesnar, Braun Strowman at his peak and similar ones. Similarly tiered, but that might be a bit lower as they vary a bit and are conceptually more normal fighters, are Shawn Michaels, Triple H, Rey Mysterio, Roman Reigns, John Cena...)
  • Notorious fighters. (Chris Jericho, John Morrison at his strongest moments, most of the successful cast may be here in normal circumstances, Big Show, Mark Henry)
  • Average wrestlers and jobbers. (Santino Marella, The Miz, Hardcore Holly...)
Note that this is a general thing. Conceptually, Rey Mysterio hits quite weakly when he's not somersaulting (which he admittedly does a lot, and he hits very hard when he does that), but his general skill, speed and prowess should put him in the upper tier, while someone like the Great Khali would be extremely strong and durable, but otherwise so slow, less technical and, really, lacking willpower that they are ranked much lower.
Click to expand...
Basically what Eliminator said here.
 
Anyone find any other feats?

Also, is this just a general discussion on the WWE verse in general, or we're just talking about making profiles for the verse?
 
I think I might found a really good speed feat for the verse: Matt riddle and chad gable are capable of riding laps around the Heritage Bank Center on scooters which has a area of 32,150m^2, or a circumference of 635.62m. Matt and Gable were capable of riding 7 laps of this in 1min and 40sec or roughly, 44m/s Subsonic.


Found a bunch of wrestlers surviving brutal car crashes, the John cena and undertaker ones are the most notable as they took them directly to the body, the Stroman one is also a brutal one as well.
 
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