Would this be allowed to have a profile?

[Antvasima]

There are always people who wish to promote their or some acquaintance's obscure works through any method that they can come up with.

 

[Kaltias]

What i'm saying is that statistically speaking, it just won't happen.

We have what, 7000+ contributors? What's the chance of one of them having read a book that less than 1000 people on the planet read, and what's the chance that they are determined to advertise it using VSBW as a medium?

 

[Saikou_The_Lewd_King]

Indiscriminately banning self-published stuff would kill a large portion of Indie game verses or just indie stuff in general on the Wiki, including popular stuff like Undertale or Touhou Project.

As Kalt said, the chances of being swarmed with obscure, un-rateable stuff is extremely low. If said theoretical people promoting their own work becomes a true issue we simply deal with it accordingly. It's not enough to warrant Wiki-wide regulations like that imo.

Honestly I thought the part about avoiding very obscure series was to avoid having fictions made specifically for VS Debating like Suggsverse, not just because it's obscure.

 

[Antvasima]

We are not indiscriminately banning indie works. We are strictly avoiding extremely obscure works that contain borderline fan characters, and as you say, that is mostly due to quality control reasons, so we don't get swarmed with extremely poorly written power-inflated drivel that detract the focus from regular, less powerful, franchises.

 

[Amelia_Lonelyheart]

I completely agree with Saikou and Kalt on this issue. Popularity should only be an issue for series like Suggverse or stuff that's almost impossible for anyone to verify, like untranslated foreign works

 

[Kepekley23]

Obscurity is irrelevant, Ant. The vast majority of unpopular franchises are stil accessible to anyone who gives them the time of the day.

If one thinks the scans are misleading, they should set out to prove it by watching or reading the series it comes from, unless it's borderline impossible to do so.

 

[Antvasima]

Well, I still think that it would set a potentially dangerous precedent to allow severely power-inflated characters from extremely poorly written stories that only 10 people on the planet have heard about before we give them free advertisement, and as such encourage lots more of the same types of profiles.

Do you really want tier 0 to mostly consist of lots of fan characters that nobody has heard about? I certainly don't.

 

[Kepekley23]

> Well, I still think that it would set a potentially dangerous precedent to allow severely power-inflated characters from extremely poorly written stories that only 10 people on the planet had heard about

Literally nobody here is arguing for this. We've already had that discussion.

 

[Amelia_Lonelyheart]

We're nowhere near big enough for that to ever become a problem. Even if it ever did happen, it be so transparent that people who take care of it ASAP.

 

[Antvasima]

@Kepekley23

Well, that is all that I have been arguing about.

 

[Kaltias]

Ant, that's about as likely as winning the lottery.

It's one thing to have rules set in place to prevent something that could happen within reason, it's a different thing to have rules trying to prevent something extremely unlikely

 

[Antvasima]

@Darkanine

We have 600000 visitors a month, up to 25.6 million page views, and sometimes reach position 10 in the WAM score. We are a very popular wiki now.

 

[Kepekley23]

Also, Tier 0 used to have stuff like the Majestic Presence before it was downgraded, which is mostly unknown even to the very limited amount of fans I/O has.

 

[Saikou_The_Lewd_King]

Applying the logic of Suggsverse in order to prevent other obscure but non-inflated verses doesn't work. Like Dark said, people publishing obscure and inflated verse would be easily visible and easy to take care of. And it would also be very unlikely. I legit don't remember a single time where the writer of an inflated verse attempted to publish their work here.

 

[Amelia_Lonelyheart]

I legit don't remember a single time where the writer of an inflated verse attempted to publish their work here.

I only remember once instance of that happening, and it was deleted within 20 minutes of its creation.

 

[Antvasima]

@Kaltias

I don't think that my concern is particularly unlikely, considering the power-fixation in our community, and if we get rid of our restrictions, we would get recurrently pestered about allowing Suggsverse-style franchises.

@Kepekley23

I/O is a legitimate series in terms of popularity and story craftsmanship. I am talking about extremely obscure and badly written series. Also, the Majestic Presence was downgraded.

 

[Kepekley23]

@Ant

Reddit has 250 million monthly visitors and about 100k active users, if that.

Page views are irrelevant when it comes to actual contributions from people.

 

[Antvasima]

@Kepekley23

I meant that our wiki can easily be seen as a source of free advertisement, and it is rather easy to set up an account here.

 

[Kepekley23]

@Ant

I/O is very obscure and has an extremely small following. Again, you're trying to use extreme examples to inflate the arguments that are being actually made here.

 

[Antvasima]

@Kepekley23

I think that you misunderstand my viewpoint. As I keep stating, I don't mind obscure officially published series with small followings as long as they constitute coherent stories. I mind ridiculously obscure and poorly written power-inflated drivel. That's all that I mean with a reasonable degree of notability.

 

[Kepekley23]

Yeah, but I'm pretty sure nobody here is disagreeing with that.

 

[Antvasima]

Well, if you agree with that, I think that we have reached a conclusion.

 

[Kaltias]

In order for this to happen you need to meet this conditions:

-One of our contributors has read a book that 1000 people on the planet at most care about. That's 1 chance out of a trillion and a half, give or take.

-They actually decide to inflate the verse to advertise it.

-They actually manage to fool everyone.

 

[Antvasima]

@Kaltias

I am too tired to continue to argue about this. Do you agree with the conditions that I mentioned in my second to last previous post?

 

[Antvasima]

@Kepekley23

I think that you misunderstand my viewpoint. As I keep stating, I don't mind obscure officially published series with small followings as long as they constitute coherent stories. I mind ridiculously obscure and poorly written power-inflated drivel. That's all that I mean with a reasonable degree of notability.

Here.

 

[Andytrenom]

I agree with Saikou and Kal. It seems like we are trying to enforce a rule for a problem that doesn't even have a reasonable chance of occurring. Being worried over nothing as some people would say.

 

[Kaltias]

I mean if you are saying "no Suggverse level stuff", sure.

But the issue isn't obscurity in that case, it's that the verse is a power trip that exists only to be powerful

 

[Antvasima]

Well, I am considerably more active in the wiki than the rest of you, and people do keep bothering us about including the Suggsverse even with the current regulations, so getting rid of them entirely would drastically increase our problems in this regard.

A rewrite of the related regulations should probably be fine though.

 

[Antvasima]

I am mentally exhausted and need to go eat dinner now though.

 

[Wokistan]

Xionic madness parts 3 and 4 had like hundreds of thousands of views last time I checked. I think we did reject Invisible Dragon just because it was terrible, even though it was published and selling.

 

[Andytrenom]

Justice for Invisible Drago

 

[Kepekley23]

Invisible Dragon was fanfic.

 

[Antvasima]

Xionic Madness should be fine to include.