Top 5 most powerful beings (Marvel Comics)

[Q_ShadoW_Q]

I don't really know who to put after who, i tried to put something up but still, not quite sure if it accurate but i would like if you could put your top 5 here, it's really interesting me who's the strongest marvel being after The One Above All.

if there is even a one confirmed answer.

Anyways that's my top 5: (I''m' not completely sure about my decision xD)

1.TOAA (The One Above All)

2.God-emperor doom \ Molecule Man (after absorbing the Beyonders energy)

3. Thanos (HOTU)

4. Oblivion

5. Beyonder (Pre-retcon)

I can't really figure out how it's possible to compare these beings as most of them never really fought each other.

My choice probably really messed up, and i will try to explain why i did that...

TOAA first it's obvious, second I chose God emperor doom \ molecule man as they both said to possess the Beyonders energy and i really can't find who is stronger...

The main reason i put them above Thanos (HOTU) was that it seems like their feats are much more impressive even though HOTU Thanos has been completely erased the existing the Beyonders could do the same and their power has been absorbed to God-emperor doom \ Molecule Man so logically i can see it as a reasonable choice.

Now Oblivion is a really unclear being in Marvel comics and never have been fully explained we can assume he's much stronger than TLT as all the beings on the list. (Pretty sure they all stronger)

but due to his lack of feats, i can't put him by relying on my logic, but if i could i probably would put him at the second place as i see Oblivion as an unbeatable creature because of his none existing relation, something about him making me think that he's far above what we expect him to be... can't completely explain it.

The last place i put The Beyonder i'm not sure why i saw it as an obvious thing, but probably because of his almost equal power to pre-retcon Molecule man.

I would hear other top 5 lists and explanations.

 

[Xantospoc]

1) TOAA AKA The One Above All

2) TOBA AKA The One Below All, TOAA's Dark half (basically the equivalent of the Dark Beast in DC comics). I am not joking. Read theImmortal Hulk

3) Current Thanos as of Infinity Conflict, implied to be powerful enough to even resist the power of TOAA, might turn out to be #1,but we don't know yet

4) The Heart of Infinite (And thus Thanos with it), literally stated to be a fragment of TOAA's powers and impled to have made him above everything in Marvel at that time, gave up his power to fix the 'mistake' that took over the universe

5) Current Moleculeman, currently unaffected by the hierarchy of the cosmos (casually stronger than other Abstract). I don't count God EMperorDoom as he was only borrowing his powers.

 

[The_2nd_Existential_Seed]

I could argue former Franklin RIchards (Post Ultimates Amp as "The Shaper") as Top 5 in the place of Molelcule Man considering he was viewed as a threat to someone who oneshotted Molecule Man & was stated more powerful than the previous threats to Creation. Griever also viewed them both as equal threats despite knowing MM's power.

But Griever's powerset is weird at most... So I can't judge.

Definitely have Matthew Malloy as either Top 5 or Top 10.

 

[Q_ShadoW_Q]

I could argue former Franklin RIchards (Post Ultimates Amp as "The Shaper") as Top 5 in the place of Molelcule Man considering he was viewed as a threat to someone who oneshotted Molecule Man & was stated more powerful than the previous threats to Creation. Griever also viewed them both as equal threats despite knowing MM's power.
But Griever's powerset is weird at most... So I can't judge.

Definitely have Matthew Malloy as either Top 5 or Top 10.

I think i missed Franklin Richards xD, if i remember correctly he was able to defeat God emperor doom but with some power boost that i'm not quite remember.

"considering he was viewed as a threat to someone who oneshotted Molecule Man & was stated more powerful than the previous threats to Creation."

What do you mean?

 

[Q_ShadoW_Q]

1) TOAA AKA The One Above All

2) TOBA AKA The One Below All, TOAA's Dark half (basically the equivalent of the Dark Beast in DC comics). I am not joking. Read theImmortal Hulk

3) Current Thanos as of Infinity Conflict, implied to be powerful enough to even resist the power of TOAA, might turn out to be #1,but we don't know yet

4) The Heart of Infinite (And thus Thanos with it), literally stated to be a fragment of TOAA's powers and impled to have made him above everything in Marvel at that time, gave up his power to fix the 'mistake' that took over the universe

5) Current Moleculeman, currently unaffected by the hierarchy of the cosmos (casually stronger than other Abstract). I don't count God EMperorDoom as he was only borrowing his powers.

um... who is current Thanos do you mean infinite gauntlet Thanos? because if you do i pretty sure that he isn't even 1-A...

"mplied to be powerful enough to even resist the power of TOAA"

Never heard about something eve similar to that can you please link me to an image or something that can use as proof?

"TOBA AKA The One Below All, TOAA's Dark half (basically the equivalent of the Dark Beast in DC comics). I am not joking. Read theImmortal Hulk"

now you have to be kidding with me...

 

[Xantospoc]

No, Thanos got a new tricket called 'The Regulator' . Just Check The Infinity Conflict (and no, not GAUNLET,conflict). I have read it once and was enough to throw it across the room

I AM 100% SERIOUS! I SWEAR! THE ONE BELOW ALL EXISTS

 

[Q_ShadoW_Q]

Can you please send me a link to an image of this comics or anything that can use as proof?

 

[The_2nd_Existential_Seed]

It was in the newer Fantastic Four . Griever specifically waited until Franklin's new powers depleted before confronting him. She also outright stated both Molecule Man and Franklin BOTH had the power to control the Multiverse beforehand [which is consistent considering he shaped the Foundation of the Multiverse in Ultimates as well] , which in Ultimates was everything including the Cosmic Multiversal Abstracts (Including TLT) . She was also stated to be the strongest threat to creation, making her scale > Beyonders. SO:

Franklin Richards (The Shaper) ><= Molecule Man (Post-Secret Wars) >>> Griever >>> Beyonders >= Molecule Man >>> The Living Tribunal

For those questioning Malloy: Matthew Malloy scales to PR Beyonder considering Rachel fought PR Beyonder (It takes place in the same canon as PR Secret Wars Pre-Retcon Beyonder) and implied Malloy's ludicrously above him as saying he has power no one else has even come close to rivaling / a power no one else can control , and WoG intended Matthew Malloy as the strongest character seen in the Marvel Universe at the time.

 

[Shivansh_Garg]

Can you please send me a link to an image of this comics or anything that can use as proof?

Here's the comic

 

[Q_ShadoW_Q]

Can you please send me a link to an image of this comics or anything that can use as proof?

Here's the comic

Cool i'll read it and i would back to give my opinion about it

 

[Q_ShadoW_Q]

It was in the newer Fantastic Four . Griever specifically waited until Franklin's new powers depleted before confronting him. She also outright stated both Molecule Man and Franklin BOTH had the power to control the Multiverse beforehand [which is consistent considering he shaped the Foundation of the Multiverse in Ultimates as well] , which in Ultimates was everything including the Cosmic Multiversal Abstracts (Including TLT) . She was also stated to be the strongest threat to creation, making her scale > Beyonders. SO:
Franklin Richards (The Shaper) ><= Molecule Man (Post-Secret Wars) >>> Griever >>> Beyonders >= Molecule Man >>> The Living Tribunal

For those questioning Malloy: Matthew Malloy scales to PR Beyonder considering Rachel fought PR Beyonder (It takes place in the same canon as PR Secret Wars Pre-Retcon Beyonder) and implied Malloy's ludicrously above him as saying he has power no one else has even come close to rivaling / a power no one else can control , and WoG intended Matthew Malloy as the strongest character seen in the Marvel Universe at the time.

Well, i never heard about someone called Rachel or Matthew Malloy...

"ludicrously above him as saying he has power no one else has even come close to rivaling / a power no one else can control "

That was said over the power of HOTU Thanos as well, doesn't it?

Can you like give a list of top 5 as you think it should be, i would be grateful for that.

 

[Q_ShadoW_Q]

I never understood that:

https://***************.to/Comic/Thanos-The-Infinity-Conflict/TPB?id=144117#48

in page 48 you can clearly see Adam says "me from another dimension" yet it shouldn't be possible that there's more than 1 TLT around all the dimension what he meant in "Me from another dimension"?

It's happening again at page 96 when Thanos says:

"You are now the chief embodiment of all major components of this reality"

That's can't be by defeating or taking the powers of TLT you should be above any reality there is in the Marvel existing.

 

[Q_ShadoW_Q]

Ok so, i have read these comics and i have to say something he makes no sense at all there might be a reason this version of Thanos isn't really got into his profile, i saw a lot of logical difficulties there as TLT being 1 in each reality\dimension what should be wrong.

But if we consider this as a real version of Thanos he is really powerful though not enough to get even near omnipotence there's no feat that he is above TOAA if AAO wasn't able to fix what Thanos have done it because it's just his embodiment look at TOAA's profile...

Saying that this version of Thanos is stronger than HOTU Thanos isn't an easy task, as they both did similar things i can bet they should be about the same power level...

and about The One Below All, i can't find him at this wiki for some reason what can mean that he isn't accepted as a true character.

I don't know as long as he isn't at this wiki i can't really prove a lot if someone as a staff will get here and help out it's would be great.

 

[Antvasima]

There is quite a lot of scaling between different writers with different standards here. Matthew Malloy was a typical nonsensical bad writing Brian Bendis character, with no impressive feats to scale from and lots of hyperbole, from a writer who does not know almost any information or context about Marvel history.

 

[Q_ShadoW_Q]

oh ok i got it, but what about this statments in the Infinite Conflict comics when Adam Warlock said here :

"You were also once me from another dimension"

How is that even possible... TLT should be above any dimension or reality level... and what is all about this Thanos i never heard about him and why he isn't 't in this wiki?

 

[Antvasima]

Other writers have established that there is only one Living Tribunal in the multiverse, but Jim Starlin doesn't care, and writes his stories as if there is a different Living Tribunal in every universe.

This is part of the reason why scaling Marvel characters between different writers is almost a hopeless task. There is very little consistency between them and most have little to no ideas what they are doing.

 

[Q_ShadoW_Q]

oh... ok.

so to do a top 5 list is not really a good idea?

 

[Antvasima]

Probably not.

 

[Q_ShadoW_Q]

but saying that these beings:

TOAA,Molecule man (post-retcon, after absorbing the power), HOTU Thanos, Oblivion, Franklin Richards etc... are the strongest beings we know about it's right no?

The problem is comparing them, right?

 

[Antvasima]

Not Franklin, but the other 4 are up there, sure.

 

[Q_ShadoW_Q]

Why doesn't Franklin was able to fight Go emperor doom? he didn't win him but he was able to hold him for some time.

 

[Antvasima]

I don't remember that, but that Franklin was a creation of Doom's, and he is generally treated as far below that scale.

Marvel is filled with extreme outliers. Within the same storyline, The Beyonders both killed the Living Tribunal and were killed themselves by an explosion strong enough to destroy a few thousand universes.

 

[Setsuna_tenma]

life force doom should be at least in the top 5

 

[Q_ShadoW_Q]

Oh ok.

I think i have mistaken him with someone else.

How can we recognize a character above 1-A baseline?

I mean what the requirements to be above the baseline?

 

[Antvasima]

life force doom should be at least in the top 5

I sincerely doubt it. The claim within that story seems like extreme hyperbole compared to the actual scale involved.

 

[Shivansh_Garg]

It's almost impossible to make a list for top 5 characters in Marvel, due to writers (like those of most popular and successful franchises) leaving how characters compare to each other vague and uncertain

A couple of side notes-

1)Franklin never fought God Doom

2)Few thousand of Universes destroyed were just a collateral damage, the actual yeild of the bomb's explosion was unknown, as it was made to be a better bomb than the one Beyonders created to destroy all of creation

 

[Shivansh_Garg]

@Setsuna Life Force Doom at best scales above retconned Beyonder and equal to Phoenix Force

 

[Q_ShadoW_Q]

"1)Franklin never fought God Doom "

yeah i know i said that i was mistaken for some reason i remembered him in a fight with God doom but that isn't the case.

 

[Shivansh_Garg]

Alright my bad, I probably missed that comment of yours

 

[Antvasima]

@Shivansh

Thank you for the help.

So should we close this thread?

 

[Q_ShadoW_Q]

That's fine.

Do you know how can we know who's above the 1-A baseline, i mean i didn't quite get it?

 

[Antvasima]

It is very hard to gauge, but Oblivion should probably be quite a bit above baseline.

 

[Q_ShadoW_Q]

It is very hard to gauge, but Oblivion should probably be quite a bit above baseline.

It's your opinion that he slightly above the baseline or from what we know about him so far?

 

[Antvasima]

Well, he embodies nonexistence on a beyond-dimensional scale. That seems more impressive than some other 1-A characters, but I do not know for certain.

 

[Shivansh_Garg]

@Q ShadoW It would be a better idea to ask it on any other recent 1-A versus thread. One involving Masadaverse or Cthulhu Mythos characters should be good

from what I have seen, characters that scale above other 1-As are considered above baseline, and those who are embodiements of 1-A structures/voids (Oblivion belongs to the latter)

 

[Q_ShadoW_Q]

I mean we have no real feat of oblivion showing his real power, right?

Yet i'm not sure if he can be called embodiment or abstract as he is different than all that we know, considering that he has no concept at all, we can't consider "nothing" or nonexisting as a concept since it doesn't, "nothing" it's the opposite of something and concept have to be something.

Taken from the Latin ("a thought, purpose, also a conceiving, etc.")

"abstract and general idea; an abstractio

The concept of nothing isn't really called concept anymore due to the nature of the concept.(at least as i see it)."

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The meaning of embodiment: (taken from wiki)

"a physical entity typifying an abstract concept."

Relying on that shows that Oblivion has no concept as he the "abstract of nothing\noneexisting", what makes me think that this guy shouldn't be even able to get damaged or be affected by anything... even by TOAA since you can't really erase or defeat something that not exist in any level of aspect.

Though what i know, i might be just talking no sense because of my lack of knowledge of how power hierarchy works over here.

 

[Antvasima]

Well, I am not very good at evaluating the most abstract characters either.

 

[Q_ShadoW_Q]

Do you know someone who has a good amount of knowledge about Oblivion? like someone who would be able to explain this topic of nonexisting and how it affects this character?

 

[Antvasima]

Well, maybe Matthew Schroeder, but he isn't interested in Marvel any more.

 

[Q_ShadoW_Q]

Fine, thanks.