Toaru Discussion thread New Fourms #1

[FantaRin_The_First]

Cool job with that verse page gallery revision
In case nobody has already done so, should I try to request a bot to be used to change all mentions of "To Aru " to "Toaru " on the wiki?

Oh god, yes. It genuinely fricking bugs me that "To Aru" isn't "Toaru" here. Million thanks if/when you do this, DT.

And since I am here... Anybody got any idea why the anime adaption is taking so long? Licensing issues? Important VA died? Smth else? Like we can all agree that Toaru's popularity peaked around the late 2000s-early 2010 yet S3 got released in 2019... and we all know how that turned out...

If only S3 was released in the early 2010s to capitalize on its then popularity... we could've gotten a decent WWIII Arc, lol.

 

[Aseka]

Cool job with that verse page gallery revision
In case nobody has already done so, should I try to request a bot to be used to change all mentions of "To Aru " to "Toaru " on the wiki?

All those Imaginary Fest images very cool indeed.

 

[DontTalkDT]

I have posted the change request for the name.

 

[Churronzon]

In case nobody has already done so, should I try to request a bot to be used to change all mentions of "To Aru " to "Toaru " on the wiki?

Yess
thank you

 

[Felience1]

Is there a reason why Kanzaki or the other saints don't have Supernatural Luck? in OT 4 Chapter 2 Part 5 there are very straightforward feats for that, like:

Everything she desired would be fulfilled, and unpredicted, happy miscalculations would happen every day before breakfast. She would somehow survive if her life were threatened. She would avoid bullets for no reason, and she would miraculously emerge unscathed even if a bomb went off right next to her,” Tsuchimikado went on, as if singing a lullaby. “…That’s why Kanzaki neechin can’t forgive herself for being lucky. Perhaps she’s cursed by her devilish fortune.

“But, Kami-yan, what must it feel like to be one of the lucky ones? You’d buy one lottery ticket, and you’d always, definitely win with it. Which means that you would be forcing those around you to pick the nonwinning ones, no matter what.

 

[Aseka]

Is there a reason why Kanzaki or the other saints don't have Supernatural Luck? in OT 4 Chapter 2 Part 5 there are very straightforward feats for that, like:

Everything she desired would be fulfilled, and unpredicted, happy miscalculations would happen every day before breakfast. She would somehow survive if her life were threatened. She would avoid bullets for no reason, and she would miraculously emerge unscathed even if a bomb went off right next to her,” Tsuchimikado went on, as if singing a lullaby. “…That’s why Kanzaki neechin can’t forgive herself for being lucky. Perhaps she’s cursed by her devilish fortune.

“But, Kami-yan, what must it feel like to be one of the lucky ones? You’d buy one lottery ticket, and you’d always, definitely win with it. Which means that you would be forcing those around you to pick the nonwinning ones, no matter what.

This can only be applied to Kanzaki and not necessarily for other Saints.

 

[Felience1]

I think this comes with the stigma all saints have. They talk in this chapter about being one of the lucky ones, one of the chosen ones. the stigma of being similar to the son of god. I will come back to this when i get further with my rereading and have better proof but for Kanzaki what i said before should be enough. this is from the same chapter:

Before Kanzaki nee-chin was born, it was decided she would rise to the top of their group and be their priestess. And that she was one of God’s chosen ones, a Saint blessed with the Stigma, of whom there are less than twenty in the world.

 

[XDragnoir]

I think the right thing to do would be to give Kanzaki supernatural luck and other saints to get it as a possibly,since it's never really properly stated to be an inherent trait of being a saint.

 

[Felience1]

Sounds good to me. I dont know how to do the change properly so someone other than me should do a thread.

 

[XDragnoir]

Okay, I have to say it's pretty sad to see other verses using Sephiroth stuff and getting really higher tiers while Toaru is stuck at H1C.

How many quotes do we actually have that explain the hierarchy of the Four Worlds?

 

[Churronzon]

XD

practically none lol. I been knew Toaru would be the only one that doesn't

 

[Churronzon]

We don't have the explanation for Ain Soph Aur emanating Keter other than being beyond it and the author not even bothering to change the term "Ain" in this fictional series.

Then we got the antifeat of people interpreting Othinus as having killed that same God who resided in the phase of heaven when she supposedly destroyed every phase.

RZIONR was dictated to be an anti-feat (or at least not particularly notable) in past threads when the only description it has for how it works is being qualitatively superior to surface world phenomenon.

Got no mention of what would recreate the verse after Coronzon's ceremony.

Guess we'll see if Touma can suplex planet-level capped Lucifer next volume or if the Gnostics were onto nothing
Maybe only a Level 6 esper will recover their Divine Spark to be able to do that

 

[XDragnoir]

So, we effectively don't have anything in the entire series? Meh.

Guess we'll see if Touma can suplex planet-level capped Lucifer next volume or if the Gnostics were onto nothing

Was Lucifer confirmed to appear in the next volume? I am actually expecting to see him since we got Coronzon.

 

[Churronzon]

Was Lucifer confirmed to appear in the next volume? I am actually expecting to see him since we got Coronzon.

Nah, Kingsford's ability being called Hell Tour and her possible foreshadowing about overthrowing Satan or whoever and kicking down the gates of hell to return from the dead = me coping

 

[Churronzon]

[Toaru] Othinus tiering revisions

hi Two things should be done regarding Othinus' tiering: Remove the word "likely" from her first key's High 1-C rating. Stop scaling her reality warping to her physicals. (Downgrade her 2nd key physicals from High 1-C to Planet level) Goal 2: Since there's no difference between the amount of...

vsbattles.com

 

[Churronzon]

Alice's flamingo would scale to planet level AP via intercepting CRC's magic

 

[Churronzon]

Wallahi it's burnt.

I forgot flamingo uses its own body to intercept stuff, meaning it'd scale in dura too. And Tris killed dozens of flamingos, scaling him above CRC.
Someone rationalize it for me . I don't wanna think

 

[XDragnoir]

Wallahi it's burnt.

I forgot flamingo uses its own body to intercept stuff, meaning it'd scale in dura too. And Tris killed dozens of flamingos, scaling him above CRC.
Someone rationalize it for me . I don't wanna think

When did he kill them? Do you have the quote? The only thing I could find was the scene with him killing the Mice, which "are at the same level" as the Flamingo Bats, but you seem to be talking about another moment.

 

[Churronzon]

ohh all of them were mice. that makes more sense

 

[XDragnoir]

ohh all of them were mice. that makes more sense

Yeah, I think it's kinda like "they're on the same level, but the Flamingos have better focus on dura" or something like that.

 

[FantaRin_The_First]

Yo, I just had a brain fart. Why are the speed of ToAru's superhumans (Saints and Saint-like peps) scaled to the speed of Kanzaki's wires? The Sub-Relativistic result in DT's calc is only applicable to those things if I am not being dumb.

 

[XDragnoir]

Yo, I just had a brain fart. Why are the speed of ToAru's superhumans (Saints and Saint-like peps) scaled to the speed of Kanzaki's wires? The Sub-Relativistic result in DT's calc is only applicable to those things if I am not being dumb.

Because she has like, two speed amps that are regarded as her last case trump cards (Breaker of God and mainly Yuisen) all of which should have a comparable speed, especially given Acqua and Knight Leader got feats against the wires and then with everything else everyone just ends up scaling to them one way or another, including base Kanzaki herself.

 

[FantaRin_The_First]

Because she has like, two speed amps that are regarded as her last case trump cards (Breaker of God and mainly Yuisen) all of which should have a comparable speed, especially given Acqua and Knight Leader got feats against the wires and then with everything else everyone just ends up scaling to them one way or another, including base Kanzaki herself.

Isn't that a bit circular? At the very least, Base!Kanzaki shouldn't scale to the speed of her wires since she only fought against Acqua via Yuisen amping her... and Amped!Knight Leader no-diffed her (IIRC, his unamped self is half as fast as his amped self, so there is that maybe). Granted, I have no idea whatsoever what a Base!Kanzaki can potentially scale to. Plus, we have no idea how comparable are Breaker of God and Yuisen are to each other since Kamachi abandoned the former after OT4 and replaced it with Yuisen.

Maybe I am just being dumb, atm, lol.

 

[XDragnoir]

Isn't that a bit circular? At the very least, Base!Kanzaki shouldn't scale to the speed of her wires since she only fought against Acqua via Yuisen amping her... and Amped!Knight Leader no-diffed her (IIRC, his unamped self is half as fast as his amped self, so there is that maybe). Granted, I have no idea whatsoever what a Base!Kanzaki can potentially scale to. Plus, we have no idea how comparable are Breaker of God and Yuisen are to each other since Kamachi abandoned the former after OT4 and replaced it with Yuisen.

Maybe I am just being dumb, atm, lol.

I never said they were = or anything like that, they have inner scaling obviously but since in multiple fights (such as Kanzaki vs KL or her vs Acqua) we've that her different moves don't really have an actual disparity that would justify they scaling to different values.

For example, KL dealt with the same easiness both her wires and Yuisen in his Curtana amped form, which we know is at most twice as fast as his base that later was on par or slightly slower than Yuisen, so the 4x gap if we went by that calc would break the actual values we know.

 

[StrangerALover]

Can someone debunk toaru cosmology to 3-4D via tuchimicado statements? I mean, his idea that there are no parallel worlds in ToAru is a more correct interpretation.
And I think TMGs don't deserve H1C (Low 1-c for them). Let's cooking?

 

[XDragnoir]

Can someone debunk toaru cosmology to 3-4D via tuchimicado statements?

Which statement exactly?

I mean, his idea that there are no parallel worlds in ToAru is a more correct interpretation.

Did Tsuchimikado also say that? I didn't remember that.

Anyway, yes, that's how the verse works, but this doesn't change anything for their tiers if that's what you mean.

And I think TMGs don't deserve H1C (Low 1-c for them).

Why tho?

 

[Aseka]

Can someone debunk toaru cosmology to 3-4D via tuchimicado statements? I mean, his idea that there are no parallel worlds in ToAru is a more correct interpretation.
And I think TMGs don't deserve H1C (Low 1-c for them). Let's cooking?

There are no parallel world is a statement from Othinus, although it's not an anti-feats against current cosmology. Even there is only a single world, but if it is a higher dimensional structure, still qualified for tier 1.

 

[Churronzon]

So does Fiamma get his miracles with Index Controller or with Imagine Breaker?

Non-canon manga stated it was with IB

 

[Alsotime]

I wouldn’t call it non canon, just a different adaptation, or a different expansion to canon

 

[FantaRin_The_First]

I wouldn’t call it non canon, just a different adaptation, or a different expansion to canon

Basically, this.

 

[XDragnoir]

So does Fiamma get his miracles with Index Controller or with Imagine Breaker?

Non-canon manga stated it was with IB

As Alsotime said, the manga isn't non-canon (if it was non-canon we would simply ignore it), but I think that's somewhat against what the novels themselves said, no?

I think these miracles were referred to by the narration as powers that HR has, rather than ones it would unlock later.

IB did give Fiamma the power to recreate all legends tho, so maybe the manga is turning two things into one for simplicity or maybe it's explaining better what the LN intended.

 

[FantaRin_The_First]

FantaRin The First/Sandbox

vsbattles.fandom.com

Fanta here. I'mma reworking Touma's Stamina and Intelligence + adding a Standard Tactics section for him. Adding you folks wanna add?

 

[FantaRin_The_First]

Got a lot of likes but no comments that could possibly help me in writing things down, lol. Jk, jk

 

[Churronzon]

It looks Fantastic
I got nothing to add to it

---

Does anyone recall Aleister lifting someone up with one arm?
If no one can recall, then I'll downgrade his base Lifting Strength to Average Human since I don't like applying stuff to profiles/new keys without scans.

I only know Mathers did

In the middle of her run, Aleister came to a stop and just about collapsed to her knees,
but Mathers grabbed her neck and he lifted her up with just the one arm.

Even if Aleister did, if it occurred between NT20-21, it was not performed in base so it wouldn't work as justification either way.

Basically the only thing stopping me from continuing Aleister's CRT lol

---

Doubt this can be categorized under an ability. Would I just list it in the techniques section?

Anna Kingsford switched to water from her index finger and invisible ether from her thumb, but it was all wrenched off course before it could reach the silver young man and thrown into an entirely unrelated space.

 

[Aseka]

Doubt this can be categorized under an ability. Would I just list it in the techniques section?

Telekinesis maybe.

 

[FantaRin_The_First]

So...

“The situation has indeed grown concerning. I will now kill Kamijou Touma to correct the course of the plan.”

Rensa’s back opened, the giant “flower” spread out, and then it closed once more.

A blast of wind burst out.

This was Academy City’s #1 power. She had created that wind via vector control.

However…

“If you think you can…”

Before the mass of 120 m/s wind could reach him, Kamijou stepped right up next to Rensa.

“…then prove it!!”

He threw a powerful punch toward her face. - NT7 Chapter 3 Part 10

You think this is enough to upgrade Touma's speed to Subsonic? If I am not mistaken when reaching this text, Touma moved faster than Rensa's 120 m/s wind attack after it was fired.

If it helps, we got Subsonic reactions for Misaki during the past flashback where a bunch of thugs targeted her with powered armor in NT11. Touma is, without a shadow of doubt, physically superior to her and fought a bunch of 'em and defeated them after they exploded their pile bunker drill into his chest since Mental Out couldn't deal with 'em all + their powered suits were preprogrammed to target her even if they were mind controlled-so this maybe could help the Subsonic Touma agenda. Jk, jk.

... Stamina + Intell stuff is almost done. I'mma just trying to figure out the best way to write down their last few paragraphs.

 

[Churronzon]

Telekinesis maybe.

That but limited or maybe a barrier of some sort, but either way it'd have to have a possibly conditional since it's not known what's going on

Then again, not everything has to be indexed. Sukuna's slashes don't have a corresponding indexable ability IIRC

.

Golden Dawn is low-end subsonic, not Touma. If you want to upgrade his combat speed, that's up to you ppl

Left
behind, Kamijou needed to find something that could travel at more than 100km/h.

The people targeting the royal family were not clinging to the roofs and sides of the
carriages. Nor were they using their own carriages or vehicles. They were using their own
feet to run along the asphalt, the median, and sometimes even the signs or streetlights.
Instead of running, it looked like they were sliding along a thin layer of water to match
the 180km/h speed of the carriages.

Aleister also has a possibly subsonic while being slower than Touma

 

[FantaRin_The_First]

Wouldn't that just be a travel speed feat for the Golden Dawn, then? While the Subsonic thingy for Touma would be a combat speed feat as the text makes it explictly clear that Rensa fired first and then Touma moved faster than it to punch her in the face?

Idk. I'm just airing this idea out to see what you folks think.

 

[XDragnoir]

That but limited or maybe a barrier of some sort, but either way it'd have to have a possibly conditional since it's not known what's going on

Agreed, a possibly would fit perfectly.

Then again, not everything has to be indexed. Sukuna's slashes don't have a corresponding indexable ability IIRC

Sukuna's slashes are energy projection (with a bit of invisibility and adaptation thrown into the mix).

Although I get what you meant, only really few powers should be left without a proper ability attached to them.

 

[XDragnoir]

Is anyone keeping track of all the revisions we have to complete (or that maybe have died before being finished)?