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This is Not of My Own Doing (Hanma Yujiro vs Morgan)
- Thread starter Hl3_or_bust
- Start date
- 19,249
- 2,647
- Thread starter
- #2
bump
- 63,487
- 8,486
What's Morgans AP?
- 19,249
- 2,647
- Thread starter
- #4
about 15 kilotons iirc
Yujiro is baseline
Yujiro is baseline
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Yujiro being baseline kinda downplays how high his Demon Back buffs him.
- 1,726
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Yujiro is 8.04 kilotons minimum in demon back. He's about 2.68 kilotons normally and Baki's incomplete demon back was a 2-3x multiplier according to Retsu Kaioh. So Yujiro's demon back is at least 3x stronger than base considering how superior it is to Baki's full demon back, let alone his incomplete variant. 2.68 x 3 is 8.04.
XitSign
He/Him- 3,143
- 1,809
Okay, so Morgan's shy of a 2x lead in AP, I think that works for a fight.
I'm not familiar with Grappler Baki, so forgive me if I ever say anything wrong here, I'm not 100% sure I understand some of these abilities in-universe, the 0.5 Seconds Unconsiousness especially confuses me. Is it some sort of a reaction ability? Ogre reacts faster because the opponent is briefly 'unconsious'?
So they're both well earned Geniuses. Ogre's brilliant and can size up a fight just as it starts with apparent perfection, and Morgan's not only trained by Robin but nearly thier equal and Robin seems to have similar abilities that let him understand Fire Emblem game mechanics in-universe, so these two are going to be brilliant fighters and it's hard to give a clear edge. Ogre's understanding of Morgan from a glance might give him the information faster though, so slight lean that way for now.
Morgan's definately got range. Up close and personal they use various weapons for extended melee, and a few of the spells they can bring the table outrange Ogre by a generous margin. He's got a lot of ground to make up with Standard Battle Assumptions while Morgan can take some pot-shots and get aquianted with thier opponent. Ogre's learning is definately better, but Morgan's no slouch, any extra time to learn about Ogre is bad for him, and time wasted.
Ogre's learning does give him an advantage sicne he'll apparently know almost everything about Morgan, and know what to do/what not to do...but that realization might not be a good one, since he might come to realize a lot of his options aren't as good here anymore. Counter comes to mind, since it makes almost all physical options against Morgan potentially dangerous as practically anything he does to them, he does to himself. Aura and pressure points (though, they might still be 'melee' enough to trigger Counter) are probably the safest way to engage Morgan, but that limits a huge chunk of his abilities and skills he could be making use of here.
Morgan also has an absolutely ludicrous amount of options for stat boosting, accuracy boosting, dodging and reacting boosts, and passive buffs that reduce incoming damage, even a random chance to just refuse to die whena blow should've killed them, as well as regen options ontop of them countering close quarters damage, all of that is going to make them a right-up pain to put down. Morgan's also got an extensive knowlage of nearly every weapon they has at their disposal, a set of durability negation attacks (one that even 'instakills'), flurry attacks (which can also trigger other abilities in the middle of the flurry), a passive debuff aura around her, a revenge attack for adding damage they've taken to thier attacks, 'Critical Hit' chance boosting, and Ignis which will let them get bonus power from thier magic and physical power and combine them together for even more powerful attacks. Plus there's always the chance the Morgan can also become a dragon and take to the skies too. (Taguel transformation honestly seems a bit less useful in this matchup, poor bunny people, they'll get another time to shine)
Morgan's got a huge arsenal, and a big kit of weapons too. They're pretty darn decked out with options, abilities, and powers that make Ogre's fighting style a pain to make work. He has a lot of adapting to do, and I'm not sure even with all his skill and brains he can pull it off with how restrictive Morgan's abilities can make this fight (Plus, Morgan's also a highly adaptive and smart fighter, so they're not going to make this easy on him). Ogre's best option is probably to try ranging back or hoping that something like a preassure point or Vaccum Palm doesn't have the same effect on him when used should Morgan have counter, and niether of those options seem particularly great.
Meanwhile, Morgan has all sorts of really useful powers under thier belt, ontop of thier general well-rounded skill, AP advantage, range advantage, and inteligence. Durability Negations, a OHK, Buffs and debuffs of pretty much every kind, passive damage reduction, regen, healing, pseudo-attack reflection and pseudo-rage power.
Ogre's options are limited, Morgan has answers to a lot of what he can do, and Morgan's got a long list of accuracy/dodging/perception bonuses and debuffs that they can probably even counter Ogre's own amazing reactions and perception abilities. I think if Orger sizes up this fight, he might see that he can't win.
I vote for Morgan.
I'm not familiar with Grappler Baki, so forgive me if I ever say anything wrong here, I'm not 100% sure I understand some of these abilities in-universe, the 0.5 Seconds Unconsiousness especially confuses me. Is it some sort of a reaction ability? Ogre reacts faster because the opponent is briefly 'unconsious'?
So they're both well earned Geniuses. Ogre's brilliant and can size up a fight just as it starts with apparent perfection, and Morgan's not only trained by Robin but nearly thier equal and Robin seems to have similar abilities that let him understand Fire Emblem game mechanics in-universe, so these two are going to be brilliant fighters and it's hard to give a clear edge. Ogre's understanding of Morgan from a glance might give him the information faster though, so slight lean that way for now.
Morgan's definately got range. Up close and personal they use various weapons for extended melee, and a few of the spells they can bring the table outrange Ogre by a generous margin. He's got a lot of ground to make up with Standard Battle Assumptions while Morgan can take some pot-shots and get aquianted with thier opponent. Ogre's learning is definately better, but Morgan's no slouch, any extra time to learn about Ogre is bad for him, and time wasted.
Ogre's learning does give him an advantage sicne he'll apparently know almost everything about Morgan, and know what to do/what not to do...but that realization might not be a good one, since he might come to realize a lot of his options aren't as good here anymore. Counter comes to mind, since it makes almost all physical options against Morgan potentially dangerous as practically anything he does to them, he does to himself. Aura and pressure points (though, they might still be 'melee' enough to trigger Counter) are probably the safest way to engage Morgan, but that limits a huge chunk of his abilities and skills he could be making use of here.
Morgan also has an absolutely ludicrous amount of options for stat boosting, accuracy boosting, dodging and reacting boosts, and passive buffs that reduce incoming damage, even a random chance to just refuse to die whena blow should've killed them, as well as regen options ontop of them countering close quarters damage, all of that is going to make them a right-up pain to put down. Morgan's also got an extensive knowlage of nearly every weapon they has at their disposal, a set of durability negation attacks (one that even 'instakills'), flurry attacks (which can also trigger other abilities in the middle of the flurry), a passive debuff aura around her, a revenge attack for adding damage they've taken to thier attacks, 'Critical Hit' chance boosting, and Ignis which will let them get bonus power from thier magic and physical power and combine them together for even more powerful attacks. Plus there's always the chance the Morgan can also become a dragon and take to the skies too. (Taguel transformation honestly seems a bit less useful in this matchup, poor bunny people, they'll get another time to shine)
Morgan's got a huge arsenal, and a big kit of weapons too. They're pretty darn decked out with options, abilities, and powers that make Ogre's fighting style a pain to make work. He has a lot of adapting to do, and I'm not sure even with all his skill and brains he can pull it off with how restrictive Morgan's abilities can make this fight (Plus, Morgan's also a highly adaptive and smart fighter, so they're not going to make this easy on him). Ogre's best option is probably to try ranging back or hoping that something like a preassure point or Vaccum Palm doesn't have the same effect on him when used should Morgan have counter, and niether of those options seem particularly great.
Meanwhile, Morgan has all sorts of really useful powers under thier belt, ontop of thier general well-rounded skill, AP advantage, range advantage, and inteligence. Durability Negations, a OHK, Buffs and debuffs of pretty much every kind, passive damage reduction, regen, healing, pseudo-attack reflection and pseudo-rage power.
Ogre's options are limited, Morgan has answers to a lot of what he can do, and Morgan's got a long list of accuracy/dodging/perception bonuses and debuffs that they can probably even counter Ogre's own amazing reactions and perception abilities. I think if Orger sizes up this fight, he might see that he can't win.
I vote for Morgan.
- 30,015
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I should note the FE cast are technically above 15 Kilotons since that's something average FE soldiers scale from. The Protagonists regularly solo packs of characters on that level. But regardless, Xit summarized it with very much detail. So Morgan takes this for his reasons.
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TBH I really don't get how we lowball it to 3x.Anttron224 said:
Seriously, an unmastered, weaker Demon Back Buffed Baki from 22 Tons to 2.6 Kilotons
Saying it's at least an only 3x advantage is honestly a lowball
Also Morgan FRA
- 1,726
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Because any higher number would be speculative.
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The difference between 22 Tons (Or whatever Baki 8B scale too) and 2.76 is much higher then 3x. That's a fact
Of course how superior Yujiro's complete demon back is, is the speculative part, but 3x when something weaker has shown far higher feats is a bit of a lowball you know?
Of course how superior Yujiro's complete demon back is, is the speculative part, but 3x when something weaker has shown far higher feats is a bit of a lowball you know?
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I guess.
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As of rn, Yujiro is looking at a base AP of 8 kilotons and a DB AP of ~36 kilotons.
I'll vote Yujiro
I'll vote Yujiro
- 8,505
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Yeah, Morgan fra
- 13,724
- 3,668
Well, Yujiro is 54 kilotons with DB now
XitSign
He/Him- 3,143
- 1,809
While that does give Yujiro the AP advantage now, that was only one of Morgan's many advantages in this fight.
The differant is still only 3.6, so we're still only halfway to oneshot territory, and with Morgan's superior range, having stat manipulations for days, durability negations, passive defenses, regens, and more, they just have so many advantages over raw power to compensate.
Yujiro is increadibly clever and skilled, and now stronger, but Morgan's ridiculously hard to hit, even harder to kill, and has options that could end the fight in a single hit if they use thier luandry list of powers right. I still think for all of Morgan's advantages, they still take the lead, they just don't have the AP advantage anymore.
The differant is still only 3.6, so we're still only halfway to oneshot territory, and with Morgan's superior range, having stat manipulations for days, durability negations, passive defenses, regens, and more, they just have so many advantages over raw power to compensate.
Yujiro is increadibly clever and skilled, and now stronger, but Morgan's ridiculously hard to hit, even harder to kill, and has options that could end the fight in a single hit if they use thier luandry list of powers right. I still think for all of Morgan's advantages, they still take the lead, they just don't have the AP advantage anymore.
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